Power Feeder Recommendations

[Jason Philip]

Hello Creekers. I need some advice on power feeders. I've been looking into getting a power feeder for my shaper. I have no experience at all with power feeders and really do not know what size I need. I would primarily be using it for 3/4" stile and rails and panels. I doubt that I would be moving it to any other machine, so should I just get a 1hp and be done with it or would a 1/2 hp be enough? My shaper is only a 3HP, so I won't be running any real huge cutters on it. Thanks.

Jason

[William Addison]

Most people seem to like the 1hp best but I think it's large physically for a small shaper like a 3hp.

I have a Comatic half horse and it's fed everything I've given it with power to spare and I've run some fairly large panels with it. I suggest you get four, as opposed to three wheels, though. You can set it so that one wheel picks the stock up, one holds it in and down over the cutter, and two out feed.

[Joe Jensen]

I bought a 1HP Maggi Steff 3 wheel. I debated between 3 and 4 wheels a long time. The 4 wheel was so huge that I ended up with a 3 wheel. After using it, I'd go with 4 wheels so I could have 2 infeed and 2 outfeed. The 1HP has never slowed or balked at all, and I would think a quality 1/2HP would be fine.

[David DeCristoforo]

It's true that a "full sized" feeder seems physically large for a "typical" 3/4" spindle shaper. And for most of your work the 1/2 HP feeder will be fine. But... The added mass of the posts and base of the larger feeder plus the additional 1/2 (or 1) HP and larger rollers will serve you well in many situations. Climb cutting moldings for example could easily overpower the smaller feeder. The 4 wheel feeder is nice because, as has been pointed out already, you can have two rollers on both the infeed and outfeed sides. But there are even more massive that the 3 wheel feeders and cost more to boot. So I would suggest a "full sized" 1 HP 3 wheel feeder.

YM

[William Addison]

I was concerned about the power of the 1/2hp when I bought it but I have climb cut some medium sized moldings with no problem. The real advantage of a 1 hp is in an industrial setting when they run for hours and the longest mine has ever run was when I cut a little over 300 feet of molding abiut half of which was climb cut, just for the heck of it. If I were running a commercial shop I'd buy a four wheel 1hp without hesitation.

[James Suzda]

I've got a Grizzly "baby feeder" on my shaper and it works okay, but if if I would do it all over again, I'd get a heavier model and maybe even one with a track instead of the rollers.
However, looking at the other side of the problem, if you get too large of a feeder, read heavy, it might make the shaper a bit unstable with all that weight. (The footprint on my shaper is pretty small.)

[Brian Backner]

Jason,

Besides the hp and wheel configuration (3 vs 4, or even a tracked model), you also need to consider the type of material the wheel is made of.

I have an old (1992) Grizzly 1/2 hp, 3 wheel feeder that has run more than its share of molding through tablesaws and shapers. In the past year I noticed a considerable decline in its performance that I attributed to deterioration of the rubber tires. Running the feeder while holding some medium grit sandpaper against the wheels would temporarily restore their grip while waiting for replacements - but this year, Grizzly no longer stocked the wheels!

At the time, there was another thread on this board that mentioned a company in Oregon that produced replacement hubs that take replaceable tires in several hardnesses. See: http://www.westernroller.com/index.html

Because my feeder was so old, even they did not have them in stock, but they custom machined a set for me. Their standard material for the tires is polyurethane.

They supply the tires in two hardnesses - the harder version lasts longer and will grip most softwood and hardwood moldings well. The softer version needs a gentler touch but grips virtually anything - even MDF panels - without slipping. As I do create a fair amount of paint grade molding and panels from MDF, I went with the latter.

It took a bit of fiddling as you have to get the tires to have the greatest contact surface possible with whatever it is you're feeding - more so than I had needed to with the old rubber tires - but WHAT A DIFFERENCE - that feeder hadn't worked that well the first day I got it!

This solution was not cheap - the $300 I spent would have gone a long way towards buying a new feeder but I am MORE than happy. One advantage here is that the tires are now replaceable using a $10 tool that WRC sells. Tires are something like $40-50 per set should I ever need them. Probably should have a spare set laying around just in case.

I guess the point of all this is that if you have the choice, go with polyurethane tires - you will not regret the slightly higher investment!

Usual disclaimers apply - I don't own WRC, etc. - I'm just very impressed with their product. By the way, if you do call them, ask for Phil - was very knowledgeable and helpful - tell him Brian from Massachusetts told you to call.

Brian

[Peter Quinn]

I'm using a 1HP grizzly on a 3HP delta, occasionally I move it to the TS using a rolling cart. Its heavy so I don't dead lift it but the swap is otherwise painless. I agree with Yoshikuni, 1/2HP will do most things but you may find the bigger feeder more effective for some situations well within the capacity of a 3/4" machine.

Its the difference between having some excess capacity on the larger feeder or running the smaller feed often near the edge of its capacity. I don't consider overhead to be overkill.

In regards to the added mass making the shaper tipsy, I am not going to use a small tipsy shaper in any event. I find with the power feed set in position near the cutter head my shaper is actually more stable with the added mass reducing vibration during use.

[Jason Philip]

My shaper is the 3HP Grizzly, it has a wide enough footprint that I shouldn't need to worry about it being tipsy. I agree, I don't really want to be using a shaper that is unstable. After rereading my initial post, I was referring to 3/4" material, the shaper can use up to a 1" bore cutter. I was looking at the Comatics and they seem very similar, in appereance at least, to Delta, Grizzly and Accura. The PM also look similar but it doesn't seem like they have a 220v single phase. Does Comatic manufacture for the other companies? The Maggi Steff looks like a very good quality tool. The price difference for a 1hp and 1/2hp Grizzly is only $50, add another $50 and you can have a 4 wheel 1hp ($850). Maggi Steffs prices were $800 (1/2 HP), $1015 (3/4 HP) and $1300 (1 HP). What other manufacturers am I missing? I'd like to buy the better quality, but, when I look at the $850 price range the 4 wheel 1 hp Grizzly vs the 1/2 hp MS, its looking like Grizzly (and Grizzly is only about 1 1/2 hrs away). Any comments about the comparison of these two models? Thanks for the help.

Jason

[David DeCristoforo]

There are tons of brand name feeders. If you are happy with the Griz products, go for it. The price is certainly hard to argue with. As to the question of the machine being "tipsy", this is only going to be an issue if you swing the feeder so that it is completely "cantilevered" off the shaper table. My Delta HD shaper can support this but if I lean on the feeder when it's hanging off the machine like that, the whole thing will tip. So I try not to leave it like that but there are times when I need to get the feeder completely out of the way. When I must work like this, I support the feeder with a saw horse to keep the machine stable. On my Felder machine, I can swing the feeder completely off the machine and then sit on it with no tipping!

YM

[William Addison]

I bought my CoMatic at Sunhill because they were on sale so you might call them, but currently their prices don't seem enough better than Grizzly to make it a good move. They are an odd company.

[Mike Heidrick]

There is an awesome price of $857.15 shipped on the 4 Wheel single phase 220V Delta branded Comatic feeder on amazon right now. That is a steal. The free shipping is great because these are VERY heavy!! I own the 3 wheel 1hp Delta feeder and it is awesome.

[J.R. Rutter]

I have that feeder, and it does a nice job. I got it used (supposedly - it looked brand new) for $500. The 1 HP feeders are nice because they are all so similar that wheels, etc. are interchangeable. 4 wheels are excellent for panel raising, but belted 3-wheelers handle short rail parts easily...

It is a toss-up for a 3 HP shaper, IMHO. Either one would work well, and if you cope after running sticking, then the 4-wheel would be my choice. I cope first, to avoid having to do mating backer boards, then run sticking on the rails last.

[Rod Sheridan]

I have a Hammer HC308 1/2HP 3 wheeled feeder on my shaper and like it.

It's on sale in the US now til mid April if I remember correctly.

Regards, Rod

P.S. The main difference between the very small feeders and the mid to large size is the spring strength on the drive wheels.

The feeders don't use their weight to push on the work piece, they use the springs pushing against the column to force the wood onto the table. (Remeber the feeder is suspended in the air by the support column) Larger feeders have stiffer columns and stronger springs.

[Dick Sylvan]

I have a Hammer HC308 1/2HP 3 wheeled feeder on my shaper and like it.


What do you have it on?

[John Shuk]

One thing I never understood. Why are power feeders so expensive in general?

[Jason Philip]

JR, Are you saying you have the Delta 4 wheel 1 hp? Thanks.

[Peter Quinn]

In regards to quality I think the grizzly is good enough for most things but don't be confused, you are getting what you pay for in this case. I have used steff/maggi's and powermatics at work professionally, 3 wheel 4 speed 1hp 1PH, and a 4 wheel variable speed 1HP 1PH. They are continuous duty under heavy load for hours. They have steel adjustment wheels. The ones I used had functioned flawlessly after being pushed hard daily for YEARS.

I have the grizzly 1HP 3 wheel 1PH and have had it over heat and stop dead during a production run in my small shop. Had to let it cool off, started back up no damage done. This is rare but very annoying when it happens. It has plastic adjustment wheels that I figure will break eventually, but grizzly sells steel replacements pretty cheap. The castings and base are solidly made, all moving parts work smoothly, but I'm pretty sure they run a lower grade of motor than the higher priced competition. Also the rubber on the wheels is about the least sticky cheapest stuff I have ever seen on a feed wheel, though those too can be replaced or rebuilt with better tires. You get what you pay for and in this case I wish I'd paid more.

If I had to do it over I would get one with variable speed as they are much more adjustable and easier to use than swapping gears.

[J.R. Rutter]

JR, Are you saying you have the Delta 4 wheel 1 hp? Thanks.

Yes, along with a bunch of others. Better paint job than the Grizzly, and better adjustment on clamp under the motor, otherwise very similar. (Just read Peter's assessment, after posting this, and agree.) Mine has a lever for gear changes, as well as 2 speed motor and internal gear swap for lots of speed options. Of the feeders that I have, I would rank them in this order, starting with least favorite:

1/4 HP Griz. - Broke almost every adjustment lock lever off in first month. Feeder itself is fine for light duty.
1/2 HP Griz. - Fine for light shaper use and jointer use.
1 HP Griz. - per comments above.
1 HP Delta - step up from Griz. in many subtle ways
1 HP Maggi - Step up from Delta in fit + finish. Fine threads on adjustment screws on columns.
1 HP HolzHer - Replacement parts are expensive, nice spring action.
1 HP Univer - Similar quality to HolzHer, nice spring action.

[Rod Sheridan]

What do you have it on?


General International 40-250 3 HP shaper..............Rod.

[Jason Philip]

Thanks JR, the info is greatly appreciated! I'm leaning towards the delta since Mike gave me a heads up on a pretty good deal through Amazon. Thanks again everybody.

[Mike Heidrick]

One thing I never understood. Why are power feeders so expensive in general?


I wondered that too until I bought a 1hp feeder. First off it is a huge 220V TEFC motor. The head is complete castiron and steel. It has precision oil bath gearing for multiple speeds and the electronics for forward and reverse wheel movement, synchronized wheel movement and heavy duty hubs with Polyurethane wheels, the huge pressure spring/tension wheel assembly, and then the heavy duty geared stand that provides X, Y, and Z axis adjustments for a head that weighs aout 100lbs. Seriously, there is more to this machine than many WW tools I own. I really felt I was buying teh other half of my shaper when I purchased this. When you see a 4" diameter head spin on a 5hp shaper, you are glad you have a feeder. Just an observation that is hard to realize in pictures on the net is all. When you get on for $800-$900 shipped new, and it arrives and you unbox it, you then know you have gotten a deal on a major tool upgrade for your shaper or other tools.

http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e169/BloomingtonMike/IMG_3388.jpg
http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e169/BloomingtonMike/IMG_3390.jpg

http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e169/BloomingtonMike/IMG_3389.jpg

http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e169/BloomingtonMike/IMG_3392.jpg

For comparison - here is the Delta baby feeder. The head on the 1hp Delta is the size of the entire feeder including the stand of the baby feeder!!




http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e169/BloomingtonMike/feeder.jpg