Faceplate or Drive Center for Large Blanks?

[Jeff Moffett]

I've been turning for three years now and have yet to use the faceplate that came with my lathe. I recently aquired a larger turning blank than I typically work with (20" diameter) and wondered if I should mount it with the faceplate to rough out the outside of the bowl or if I can safely use my traditional method of mounting between centers using a 2" two prong drive center?

[Scott Hubl]

On a blank that large I would use a faceplate, a woodworm screw that came with a chuck, or a spur drive center that mounts in a chuck.
Keep in mind that alot of lathes come with very large faceplates that are really too big for the size lathe they are coming with, What size is your faceplate?
My Jet 1442 came with a 6" plate and my Powermatic 3520B came with a 3" wheres the logic?

Drive centers are really for spindle work, and a large heavy blank can end up spinning in a morse taper and gaul it up.

You can also use a faceplate "ring" they screw onto the blank then mount onto your chuck, I know Nova chucks have them I have 2, not sure if Oneway chucks have them too.

Only takes a couple minutes to screw on a faceplate.
Use good screws NOT drywall screws.;)

[Kim Ford]

Jeff;

Faceplates are nice and have a specific purpose. I do quite a number of large pieces between centers and have never had a problem, however, there are a couple of hard fast rules I stick to

1) I make sure the spur is biting into solid wood. And usually I cut a sawblade grove with my circular saw in both directions about 1/2" deep because I have a large spur and that sets itself very well. I remove all the bark and soft wood so I have a solid base.

2) If it is an irregular piece, I either clean it up with the bandsaw or use the sawsall to get it somewhat balanced.

3) Speed. . . . Very big concern on large blanks. If you don't have a VFD type lathe that will allow you to start slowly and then control the speed as you progress it makes things somewhat challanging.

4) Cuts are always small, with minimual exposure past the tool rest. This means you move the tool rest quite often until you have a round blank.

5) DON'T do any thing you are not comfortable with, and make sure you have all of your safety equipment on.

Good Luck and let us know how it goes

Kim

[Jeff Moffett]

Scott & Kim, thanks for your replies. Kim, you mentioned that faceplates have a specific purpose, but I'm still not seeing what it is. It sounds like if I follow your rules, I won't ever need a faceplate. Maybe my revised question should be: When would I ever use a faceplate?

[Judy Kingery]

Jeff, I think you've received excellent recommendations.

While I can't specifically answer your question about when one should or should not use a faceplate, I can say that for me - I always use a faceplate for anything other than spindle turning between centers. For me it's simply easier, more stable. I can take the tail stock completely out of the way, do the bottom of the bowl, (while it's mounted on a face plate) and then reverse chuck it with the foot in the chuck to hollow it out. Just seems easier to me as opposed to working around a tail stock to try to do a big turning, and also a little more safe to me if you're anchored tightly onto a face plate with a big hunk of wood.

Best to you. Jude

[Harvey M. Taylor]

I"m with Judy. Why take a chance with a half inch notch when you can have 6 or more long screws holding that big chunk of wood. Remember, if it comes loose, it is headed towards you by the way it is spinning. why chance it? Max.

[Robert McGowen]

One more for turning bowls with a face plate. The main reason that I do it is because I turn bowls with a recess as opposed to a tenon. It is much easier to rough out the shape of the bowl and then move the tail stock completely out of the way to fine tune the design after the blank is balanced and turn the recess. Also, having spun a few pieces with a spur drive, I can honestly say I have never spun a face plate loose! :eek::eek::eek::eek:

[Bernie Weishapl]

All good advice. On bowl turning I always use a faceplate. To me it is more secure. I use stainless steel screws 6 or more. Like Robert and Judy I take the tailstock away when forming a tenon and especially if I do a recess.

[Curt Fuller]

Depends on whether you have a flat surface to screw the face plate to. It's a heck of a lot easier to adjust a big chunk of wood if it's off center or out of balance if you have it between centers, nearly impossible using a face plate. Many lathes come with a fairly small drive center but if you get a big 1" or 1.5" two pronged drive, it will turn most anything. Also, when using a drive spur, if you get a bad catch it will just strip the wood that the drive is seated in. You can stop the lathe and reset the spur. But if you get a bad catch using a face plate and it pulls some off the screws loose, then you have a rodeo until you can stop the lathe. I guess I don't need to say that I prefer roughing between centers.

[Gordon Seto]

No doubt, using the faceplate is one of the most secure method of holding a bowl blank. I believe that's why demonstrators prefer to start either with a faceplate or a woodworm screw chuck.

Faceplate also allows us to turn a blank that is too big for inboard turning, no tail stock at all.

The down side is once the faceplate was attached and started roughing, you are almost committed to the turning axis. It would be a big hassle to shift the blank even the wood grain and pattern revealed begs you to modify your original design.


Take your pick, it all depends on what you think is more important. Each has its pros and cons.

[Alex Cam]

I guess I don't need to say that I prefer roughing between centers.

I'm with Curt. If you take the time to set things up correctly, roughing between centers is as safe as it gets.

[Jeff Moffett]

This is why I love this forum. The faceplaters had me convinced to go that way, and then others jumped in and swung me back the other direction. I truly appreciate all the helpful advice!

[Brian McInturff]

I'm a "between centers" guy. Once you mount a face plate you are committed. Using a screw on drive center is great for larger blanks.
Here is what I use: http://stubbylatheusa.com/Convertible_Drive_Center.100.pdf
Quite a few Stubby owners use these and it gives you a lot of options. Once you start turning, if you see there is a void or inclusion or something that you want to incorporate into you design then all you do is reset between centers.
I've had some heavy out of round, almost square, large blanks on my lathe between centers and have yet to have any problems. There are dangers with anything as when I use to use a face plate I had a few pieces crack on me where the face plate was attached.
YMMV

[Pat Salter]

I'm big on 5) when it comes to safety equipment. One sugguestion I would make is not to bother with a face shield :eek: wait, wait, let me finish :D
I have a friend that does large pieces and when one came off and hit him in the face shield he still had a megadollar dentist bill. Now he wears a catchers mask with safety glasses :D
something to think about. the face mask/shields are simply protection against chips and other small stuff.

oh, on the mounting question, it depends on if i'm going to make a natural edge bowl or a regular bowl (one where the top faces the center/pith of the log). If it's going to be a natural edge I drill a 1" hole through the bark and maybe a 1/4" more so the spur drive hits solid wood. If a normal bowl I use a screw chuck and tailstock until the piece is round and stable (more or less :D).

[Reed Gray]

I seldom use a face plate (only on natural edge bowls). For regular bowls, I drill a recess using a forstner bit that matches the size of my chuck jaws, and expand the chuck into that. This works for bowls up to 18 inches, and I don't find the tailstock necessary. On a 20 inch bowl, I would consider the tailstock, unless I could find a 4 inch forstner bit, and my drill press could spin it. I did work my way up to this. Unless I use extended jaws, I can't drill deep enough on a natural edge bowl to get into solid wood without the face of the chuck hitting bark, so I use a face plate after I have leveled off a spot with a forstner bit. This way, the chuck never has to come off the lathe for any of the turning and coring that I do.
robo hippy

[Kim Ford]

Jeff,

This is a great thread. Everyone has contributed.

IMHO a lot of what you use is dependent upon your style of turning. For instance:

I always try to rough out green and then dry my bowl blanks. This means that between centers is very easy and I can decide on the fly if I want to change something; orientation or center. Also I try to keep big pieces between centers as long as possible just because they can be heavy and unbalanced and rodeo's are for horses, bulls, cowboys and arenas not lathe rooms. . . .

If in the roughing stage you want to hold from only the headstock end and are going to use a chuck then when between centers turn a tenon or a recess. This assumes that the wood is solid enough to hold the weight and the stress of the blank with a chuck, if not use a faceplate, however I set the faceplate to the true surface I gained while between centers.

When I use a faceplate it is usually when I want to keep the center.
So after my blank is dry, and I put it back on the lathe and get a true base, I would then glue a block to the base, attach the faceplate to the block or use a threaded block if I have that ability. This lets me take the piece on and off without loosing center.

The other thing you need to know is that the modern four jaw chucks we are using are quite an advantage. The gripping power they have did not exist just a few short years ago which made the use of faceplates much more common that maybe it is today.

[Matt Hutchinson]

Things also greatly depend on the lathe, and the chuck you are using. If you have a beefy lathe, then you may not need to use faceplates for this size of work. Also, the quality of your chuck matters greatly. I have a 5" Vicmarc, and I haven't had to use faceplates to mount my large bowl blanks. I just use the woodworm screw mounted in the 5" jaws, screw on the blank (up to 23" dia.), and rough a large dovetail tenon at the foot of the bowl (usually don't even use the tailstock for support). After roughing the outside I flip the bowl, mount the dovetail tenon in the 5" jaws, and I'm good to rough out the inside.

But here's the disclaimer: I have an old pattern maker's lathe. It's got so much mass that I haven't even bolted it to the floor. It also has a 2" shaft. This makes a huge impact, especially with large, out of balance blanks.

Though I don't have personal experience, I imagine that a PM or Oneway bolted to the floor could use this method safely, especially if the tailstock is used for additional support.

If you go to the thread Forum Members and Their Lathes, I have a pic on the 3rd page showing a cherry bowl that I roughed out in this way. It's about 22" by 6" deep.

Whatever the case may be, if you are unsure of/uncomfortable with the safety of a procedure, don't do it. Err on the side of caution.

Hutch

[William Bachtel]

Try the face plate for awhile see how you like it. I use a faceplate for all big pieces for l2 inches in dia