Are Grizzly planes ok?

[Jon Crowley]

I'm looking for a decent jointer plane that won't break the bank. The grizzly '22" smoother' looks like a typical Stanley/Bailey ripoff:
http://www.grizzly.com/catalog/2008/Main/326

I have a couple vintage Stanley's... #4, #5, but the 7 and 8's seem overpriced to me for the condition on that auction site. If the grizzlys (grizzilies?) just need some lapping and fine tuning out of the box that would probably fit my needs. I'm not expecting a LN or anything...

think it would work for what I want?

[Wilbur Pan]

A Grizzly plane will work for what you want, if by "plane" you mean "doorstop. ;)

Honestly, you'd be better off scouring the auction sites for a used Stanley jointer. Keep looking -- you'll find one.

[Jim Koepke]

I'm looking for a decent jointer plane that won't break the bank. The grizzly '22" smoother' looks like a typical Stanley/Bailey ripoff:
http://www.grizzly.com/catalog/2008/Main/326

I have a couple vintage Stanley's... #4, #5, but the 7 and 8's seem overpriced to me for the condition on that auction site. If the grizzlys (grizzilies?) just need some lapping and fine tuning out of the box that would probably fit my needs. I'm not expecting a LN or anything...

think it would work for what I want?

Not sure about how well made any others are, but you could set up searches on the auction site that shall not be named to alert you when something comes up.

I got lucky on a #7 type 11 for less than $40. The person was from the area so I saved on shipping. The big problem was the handle was painted turquoise. Her father worked in a cabinet shop and that is how they kept their tools from getting mixed up.

Before that, I was just a few minutes late at an estate sale to get one. Some other galoot was walking around with it and a big smile.

You may also want to search on Union planes & Sargent planes if those are acceptable to you. Then there are those right here on the Creek who may have a good plane to sell.

On the Stanley planes, everyone seems to want the ones with the frog adjusting screw (type 10 & later). If the plane is in good condition otherwise, this is not a make or break feature for me.

One thing to think about though, Union planes have a right hand thread on the adjuster as do Stanley planes before the 1890s. This can be a bit confusing in the shop if you have a lot of planes. If you start down the slope, you will likely end up with a lot of planes.

Also as far as searching goes, people make mistakes and list things with incorrect spelling. Look under Stanely and Plain. If a particular plane is being sought, my search would be Stanley 7. That will find everything that has been listed with Stanley and 7 in the title. Plane will find everything with plane or planes or any word that has plane in it. If you search on Stanley 7 plane, it will not show a listing for Stanley #7 joiner, because the word plane is not in the listing title.

Hope this helps and happy hunting.

jim

--The hunt is half the fun, getting in to shape is quite the chore.
True pleasure, the ultimate one, is having fine shavings spill out on the floor.

[Billy Chambless]

Check out this thread on finding vintage planes:

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?t=74230 (http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?t=74230&highlight=reputable+sources)

You can most likely find a nice Stanley (or Union, Miller's Falls, Sargent) jointer for only a bit more.

[Marcus Ward]

A Grizzly plane will work for what you want, if by "plane" you mean "doorstop. ;)



So you've tried one and can verify they're no good?

I've been tempted several times to pick one up and give it a shot. If you've never used a plane before and don't know how to tune one this might not be your best purchase, however, if you do want to do it and find you can't get it to work right, you can send it to me and I'll see if I can tune it up just for the experience of working with a grizzly plane to see how good they are.

[Robert Rozaieski]

Look for a transitional. You can get them in any length you want up to 30" (or longer if you make a new wooden body), if needed they can be flattened in about 45 seconds (with another plane) and they are dirt cheap. I got a 28" transitional for $25 shipping included. I tuned it up in about 15 minutes, including flattening the sole. Another option is a woodie jointer. I got a 30" woodie for $25 shipping included as well. This one tuned up in 20 minutes including flattening the sole (took a little longer than the transitional because I had to lap out some pitting in the iron) .

Lapping long soled planes is an exercise in futility. It's not like lapping a smoother or block plane. The ends and edges are much more likely to get dubbed over into a long iron banana. Believe me, I've been there. I don't buy long metal planes anymore. They are not worth the effort unless the sole is already flat.

[Jon Crowley]

I've been tempted several times to pick one up and give it a shot. If you've never used a plane before and don't know how to tune one this might not be your best purchase, however, if you do want to do it and find you can't get it to work right, you can send it to me and I'll see if I can tune it up just for the experience of working with a grizzly plane to see how good they are.

I greatly appreciate that offer and will keep it in mind. Thank you! :)

[Wilbur Pan]

So you've tried one and can verify they're no good?

Yes.

It would take at least as much time to get the one I saw into good shape as a vintage Stanley Bailey, and the casting didn't seem to be as good as the vintage Stanleys that I have.

[Curt Harms]

I'm looking for a decent jointer plane that won't break the bank. The grizzly '22" smoother' looks like a typical Stanley/Bailey ripoff:.....

I was talkiing to the guys at Highland Woodworking about their "bargain" planes, Anant or Groz. They also sell the high end ($200+) planes. They said take the Anant, make sure the sole is flat, put a hock blade in it and it's a functional plane. Does that sense money-wise? Dunno. I know it makes sense to use hand tools for tuning and certain fitting which I do but have no real interest in the finer points of the neander life, sorry:o.

Curt

[Jim Koepke]

I was talkiing to the guys at Highland Woodworking about their "bargain" planes, Anant or Groz. They also sell the high end ($200+) planes. They said take the Anant, make sure the sole is flat, put a hock blade in it and it's a functional plane. Does that sense money-wise? Dunno. I know it makes sense to use hand tools for tuning and certain fitting which I do but have no real interest in the finer points of the neander life, sorry:o.

Curt

The Hock blade and chip breaker will cost as much or more than a Stanley #7. $70 for high carbon steel, $79 for A2.

Just now looking at completed sales there are four that sold for less than $60. There is one that sold for over $200 and a few in between.
There is no telling what got into a couple of bidders to run the price up so high on one. But if someone else wants to prove they have more money, let them do it. Another one will come along.

I see the Anats are $119 for the #7 and $89 for the #8.

The informations says you will have to tune it to get satisfactory results.
Most of my Stanley's have only needed sharpening and cleaning to give fantastic results.
A Union plane my father gave me produced fantastic results with just a blade sharpening.
An LN gave me fantastic results out of the box with just an adjustment to the lever screw and blade.

When I was in School, satisfactory was a C. Good was a B and Excellent was an A.

Never settle for satisfactory when Excellent is within your grasp.

A co-worker of mine buys all kinds of junk from Harbor Freight. He buys it because it is cheap. He bought a #5 size hand plane with a block plane for less than $15. Sure, it could remove wood from the edge of a door. It was a plastic handled piece of junk. I took an extra 1940-50s vintage Stanley #5 to work to show him what a decent plane could do. He ended up buying it from me.

Be patient, there is no rhyme or reason to how the bidding goes, but if you stick to your reasonable $ limit and learn about what you are buying and what is being offered, you will win one.

Nothing feels better than pushing a plane along a board and thinking the blade is not set enough to take a cut only to see the wispy curls come up out of the mouth to prove you wrong.

Well, nothing we talk about here.

jim

[Bob Smalser]

New economy planes are cast and machined to mediocre tolerances, have minimal hand-fitting, and often have gummy vandalium irons difficult to flatten that also won't take my best edge. But the designs are good, plastic handles work just as well as rosewood, and with a lot of work and a better iron they can generally be made to perform well.

http://pic20.picturetrail.com/VOL12/1104763/17020258/263580659.jpg

But the problem with low tolerances is there are no guarantees. If you get one with a sole this far out of true, you won't be able to flatten it without also ruining the mouth. I wouldn't go so far as to buy Anant or Kuntz thinking I could flatten the sole, slap in a Hock iron and equal L/V or L/N performance with them. Maybe, but maybe not too.

http://pic20.picturetrail.com/VOL12/1104763/17020258/263582393.jpg

So I can't imagine buying a new one when better-made, pre-war Stanleys can be had for a fraction of the price of new. Just make sure they don't have any cracks. Get the sole flat in the right places, add a thicker Hock iron and you can have as functional a plane as any prestige make made today.

http://pic20.picturetrail.com/VOL12/1104763/17020258/263582382.jpg

But even with stock irons, the better of the smaller pre-war Stanleys are often easily fettled to equal the performance of even a L/N. I'll pay more to buy a Sweetheart era (1925-35) plane:

http://pic20.picturetrail.com/VOL12/1104763/17020258/307226158.jpg

And for jointers, the one I have that gets use the most is the woodie in the back. More length for the weight and nothing outperforms that that thick, laminated iron.

http://pic20.picturetrail.com/VOL12/1104763/2594266/285184097.jpg

[Don Dorn]

Very interesting and informative thread. For Christmas, I received a Griz 14" smoother. I was surprised at the heft and found it much like a Baily of the same size. After honing the blade, I was ready to settle in for a great deal of lapping but believe it or not, it wasn't necessary. I love the plane and use it almost exclusively for fitting drawers due to the heft ( and I have a LV Bevel up smoother)

Fast forward - I ordered a #7 Griz hoping for the same thing but no such luck. It was like others have mentioned in that the sole was anything but flat. I took it to a friend at a machine shop who said he would jig it up and flatten it so my lapping would be greatly reduced. I was going to write a bad review and it reminded me to let Grizzly make it right so before my friend started on it, it went back at their expense. The Griz rep was very nice and said they would have the new one checked with a straight edge before sending it to me, but after this thread, I'm not sure it's possible. I wouldn't be out much if it isn't - I'll let my friend flatten it with a Bridgeport milling machine. If that gets done in a satisfactory manner, the rest of it meets my expectations. With honing and tuning, I hope it to be a serviceable jointer plane.

[Dave Lehnert]

I was walking around a Big Lot's store checking out the tool section one day. As I looked up at about eye level there sat a brand new Stanley #7 hand plane. Had a price of $30 written on it with a black Sharpe. Could not believe it. Point is. Keep looking and you will never know what you will find. Problem now is I can't drive past that store without stopping.

[Tony Zaffuto]

Dave,

That's funny about Big Lots. Several years ago Big Lots disposed of the remaining Record woodworking vises. I couldn't go by a Big Lots without stopping, hoping to get one of the Record bargains, but no such luck.

With the import planes, it is pretty much a crap shoot, as Bob Smalser has said. I was at the Muncy, PA Grizzly location, and even though I was not considering a purchase of a Grizzly plane, I gave a smoother the once over. There was not a straight edge handy to check the sole, but I did take the blade out and the frog was covered with paint. All castings were rough. What I was amused at was the #78 rabbet plane. It had the fence attached backwards! I sort of remember seeing the same issue in one of their flyers or catalogs.

As I said, I had/have no intention of purchasing any of the import planes as I got plenty of vintage iron as well as some LN and LV at my disposal. I will add, though, we should watch how the manufacture of these planes develops. If the makers see a ready market, the quality will advance quite rapidly.

T.Z.