GFCi's in a basement shop?

[Robert foster]

How many of you use GFCI's in your shop? Do you have them on all circuits? What should one do with 220 volts? I have them on all the circuits around the perimeter of my shop but I think I need them on all tools. Right or wrong?

Bob

[keith ouellette]

I didn't put any in my shop but I don't know if my shop is to code. I shocked my self once. I don't want to do it again but it was by far not the worst thing I had ever done.

I will say the gfci is a marvel. I have a switch and a plug outside of my shop that have gfci. I didn't have the cover on the switch and a frog slid his way in and tripped the circuit. He came out un harmed. I thought that was a very good test.

[Wes Billups]

Robert, in our area you are not required to have 220's protected by GFCI which I'm guessing is pretty typical for the rest of the country.

Wes

[Jeffrey Makiel]

GFCI outlets have a history of failure when used with an induction motor. I've found that even the better ones from electrical suppliers often fail. Perhaps this has changed recently. However, I would not run a wet tile saw without one.
-Jeff :)

[john frank]

GFCI's are available to protect your 220v circuits. They are GFCI circuit breakers you install in the main panel. They are spendy, but if your code requires it they are available.

[Ken Garlock]

HI Robert. I was forced to install GFCI receptacle on all my 120V outlets. Because I had double doors(french doors) as a main entrance, the inspector said "they like to see GFCI on every circuit." I guess the idiot thought it was a garage. Normally that would mean one GFCI on each circuit. Since my outlets were wired using the Edison wiring that split a 220 line into 2 120 lines at each quad outlet, it was necessary to install a GFCI at each and every duplex receptacle.

I have NO GFCI on any of the 220V lines. If you run an equipment ground to each 220V tool, you are pretty much covered. Besides, I am told that 220V GFCI s are 'higher than a cat's back.'

[Whit Whitfield]

I took the GFCI out and put in a regular socket when I got a Jet 1642 lathe with varialble speed. Had read that it would trip the GFCI. I did not try it to see what would happen. Hope that was not a mistake.
Whit

[David G Baker]

In one of my shops I have a 240 volt 50 amp GFCI in my main panel that is the supply for a sub panel that I run all of my wall plugs out of except for the one that supplies my MIG 120 volt welder. In my pole barn I have GFCI at the first box on every circuit with a max of 6 boxes on each GFCI. Right now I don't have any 240 volt equipment except for my stick welder and GFCI are not used on welders.
When I reach the point where I need 240 volt GFCI at a receptacle I will use the panel type GFCI.
I also have a couple heavy duty extension cords that have built in GFCIs.
I had a GFCI experience when I was painting a bedroom. For some reason that I couldn't understand one of my circuits stopped working. The GFCI in the bathroom was the first receptacle in the circuit. I reset the GFCI and everything worked but I wanted to know what tripped it in the first place. I checked everything from the main breaker panel to all things on the circuit and couldn't find the problem. I started removing all of the receptacles until I found the problem. While I was painting around one of the receptacles a hair from the paint brush left a very tiny line of paint on one of the plug screws and that popped the GFCI. Made a believer out of me.

[Jim O'Dell]

When I wired my shop, I made the first outlet in each loop a GFCI, except the the two for the flourescent only circuits. Didn't even look at the 220 GFCI breakers. (I wired 8 220 outlets!) :eek: Jim.

[Jim Hill]

When my basement shop was wired, the electrician said that all the 120v circuits had to be protected with a gcfi. The 220v circuits were considered dedicated circuits (only one outlet on each 220v breaker) and did not have to have the same protection. Passed the inspection with flying colors so I guess the man knew what he was talking about.

Jim

[John Hixon]

210.8 A
All 125 volt, single phase, 15 and 20 ampere receptacles installed in the locations specified shall have GFCI protection for personnel.

2) Garage and also accessory buildings that have a floor located at or below grade level not intended as habitable rooms, and limited to storage areas, work areas and areas of similar use.

5) Unfinished basements -- for purpose of this section, unfinsed basements are defined as portions or areas of the basement not intended as habitable rooms and limited to storage areas, work areas and the like.


Note: this is not the complete code but I believe it answers the question.

[Rob Russell]

I took the GFCI out and put in a regular socket when I got a Jet 1642 lathe with varialble speed. Had read that it would trip the GFCI. I did not try it to see what would happen. Hope that was not a mistake.
Whit

If the lathe truly would trip the GFCI receptacle, the proper way to replace it would be to put a "single outlet" receptacle in. That way, only the lathe could be plugged into that receptacle. This is assuming the lathe isn't on castors and easily moved. If the lathe is sitting in one place, that can be considered "dedicated space" and there is an exception that allows for the non-GFCI protected outlet.

The exceptions are part of the full 210.8(A) section that John refers to above.

Rob
Addy protocol: unlicensed, homeowner electrician

[Wayne Cannon]

My inspector said that dedicated circuits did not require GFCI. Typical examples of "dedicated" circuits are those for garage door openers, smoke detectors, 120 V. wall clocks, kitchen ranges (for electric ignition on gas range), etc. In my shop, he considered all of the 240 V. circuits as "dedicated" circuits, since they all have tools relatively permanently plugged into them. All of my 120 V. circuits required GFCI.

[Wayne Cannon]

You only need one GFCI outlet per circuit if all of the other circuits are wired "downstream" from the GFCI outlet, as the GFCI outlet also protects all outlets downstream from it.

GFCI receptacles are not too expensive -- $16 for a 20-amp GFCI receptacle at my local Ace Hardware store. Get a GFCI receptacle tester ($13) while you are at it. You can also get GFCI breakers (e.g., for my spa), but at $30+ each, they are twice as expensive.

[Wayne Cannon]

In addition to garages, outbuildings, and outdoor outlets, GFCI protection is required for kitchen and bath circuits.

[Wayne Cannon]

None of my large 120 V. tools (e.g., Delta 1642 VS lathe, 18" bandsaw, DeWalt planer) cause any problems with GFCI.

[Wayne Cannon]

Grounding is no longer sufficient. If there is a short in a grounded tool, current will flow on the ground conductor, which is primarily what a "ground fault" circuit interrupter (GFCI) is designed to protect against. Of course, this is somewhat countered by the "dedicated" circuit argument that allowed my 240 V. circuits to be excluded from GFCI.

FWIW, there's a growing trend towards requiring AFCIs (arc-fault circuit interrupters) to protect against fire as well as ground-faults, an enhancement from GFCIs that protect against shock.

[Rob Russell]

The GFCI requirement only applies to 120v circuits. The fact that your inspector said the 240v circuits were "dedicated" is irrelevant. Unless California has amended the code to require GFCI on 240v circuits, s/he could not have required you to GFCI-protect your 240v circuits.

The "dedicated space" exception isn't for a circuit, it's for a specific receptacle and cord-and-plug connected "appliance". You gave a bunch of examples of "appliance" that could easily be considered dedicated, but it doesn't mean that the entire circuit could be non-GFCI protected. If all the cord-and-plug connected "appliances" on a circuit are "dedicated space", then the entire circuit would become an exception (a circuit just for smoke detectors is an example, although there are professional electricians who argue that dedicated circuits for smoke detectors is a bad idea). If your garage door openers were on the same circuit as the garage utility receptacles, the utility receptacles would need to be GFCI-protected. Only the garage door opener receptacles could be considered as "dedicated space" appliances.

[Wayne Cannon]

Good point about dedicated "receptacles" versus "circuits". I should have been more careful. Thanks. The "dedicated" receptacle for the igniter of my gas range is on the same circuit as kitchen outlets that are required to be GFCI; however, the receptacle for the igniter could come before the GFCI receptacle protecting the rest of the kitchen outlets, such that the igniter's outlet would not be GFCI-protected.

I also re-read the code, and you are correct. It specifically states only that 120 V. circuits of specified types must be GFCI, clearly implying to me that GFCI isn't required for 240 V. circuits.

[Cliff Rohrabacher]

I don't and I had the code guy in.
Ya need 'em out of doors, near pools, and near any water like sinks.

[Brian Dormer]

I have 1 non-GFCI circuit for lighting and an exhaust fan, 1 (existing) outlet up on the ceiling that is GFCI and I ran 2 20 amp GFCI circuits for my basement shop. There is also an accessory GFCI mounted right next to the panel.

As long as the runs are not too long - I can run any piece of shop equipment off any outlet without tripping.

My TS used to trip the circuit all the time (it was at the end of the run) - which is why I now (and will forever more) use 2 GFCI circuits. I ran them starting at opposite ends of the shop and work around the walls.

For any outlets in an unfinished or semi-finished basement (where the bare floor might get wet) - you should use a GFCI.

[Jim Kirkpatrick]

When I bought a GFCI for my pool pump it ran me $175!

[Mark Mazzo]

When I wired my shop I put in a sub panel. GFCI's are code in a basement shop. My sub panel is fed with a 50 amp breaker from the main panel. I used a 50 amp GFCI (a bit more expensive) so that I could separate the circuits from the sub panel in any wy I wanted and not have to worry about daisy-chaining from several distinct GFCI outlets.