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View Full Version : getting ready for a new shop, and need some help



brad kellner
02-03-2008, 7:53 PM
currently im working out of a good sized 2 car garage, but i am looking for a house in the country this fall and i am planning on building a dedticated woodshop there that will not house any garage items or ever house a vehicle. it will be for my hobby only. i have been playing on the drafting table to design an building that will allow me plenty of room so i am not moving many tools around.

mostly i build cabinetry but at the same time i like letting friends and family use my shop and tools for projects. im looking to set up for a business as i do home remodling and kitchen cabinetry as side work and i would like somewhat roomy set up as it is easier to keep clean when u do not have to tear down a work station to set up for another process in the project.

i am looking to invest around 40k into just building the woodshop and putting in the concrete floors. i am hoping to have be able to frame, side, and roof the building and have the floors also poured for this money. i figure it will take me a few years after the building is built with trial and error of setting up workstations in different configurations to find something that works for me.

here are some hings i want and i was hoping that the comunity here could help me kind me so i am not wasting money building the place way too big for my needs and having a bunch of wasted space. i was thinking of a 32x40x16 with a raised office and tools storage to maximize floor space for working while reducing clutter. i want to have the place heated by oil or propane. a friend of the family mentioned radiant floor heat using pex tubing and a few large hot water heater. i want a small 8x8 finishing room so i am not spending tons of time cleaning before doing any finishing work. i am hoping to be able to set this place up for maximum efficentcy so i can make money rather than loose money draggin tools out and cleaning all the time. any pointers or things to consider that others ran into that anyone can give me would be greatly appreciated or even shop pics or layouts they have would help me out greatly.

Roger Bell
02-03-2008, 10:36 PM
The separate finishing room is a great idea. I have a 24x36 with a 12x24 finishing/glue-up/hand tool room. No power tools. Although it takes up a lot of space, it is the best decision I made when building my shop. You might consider separate or auxillary heat for that room, so you can crank it for glueups and leave it cranked overnight for finish drying.

Considering that kitchen cabinets are your thing, I don't think that 32x40 is too big. Seems about right.

I also added a 10x36 (length of building) covered, concrete floored, (but not walled) overhang off the back. There I store construction lumber, turning lumber, trash cans, etc. I can strip paint and do other nasty work in the open air. Before I got my DC system, I had the stationary belt/disk sander, planer and TS out there. It rains a lot here, so covered storage of any kind is valuable. Off the ends of the building I built a lean-to for firewood and an attached lean to redwood greenhouse is planned for the other end wall. Minimizing the need for dedicated buildings for those purposes. These additions are dirt-cheap at time of construction.

Your idea for a non-vehicular shop, is a nice luxury. When I built my shop, I put in a double-passage door (6' of passage width) instead of the usual garage door. Seals tight, no heat loss and no mice or vermin that come with garage doors. Plenty of room to move WW related stuff in and out, but no cars.

John Fricke
02-04-2008, 1:20 AM
I purchased a steel frame building online fall of 06. 35 x 56 x 12 for around $12k delivered. Me and a few buds erected it quite easily in a week. Concrete ran $2 / ft delivered and finished.

Rob Will
02-04-2008, 2:22 AM
You need more like 50 x 50.
I also started off with 32 x 48 x 16 high. It quickly became apparent that the room was not big enough.

If anything, I would go to 50 x 50 x 12' high and put the office on the main floor.

This is NOT bigger is better thinking. You really need that much room (IMHO).

I would look at some other small production shops. You will find that they are bigger than you think.

Good luck, you have a lot of decisions in front of you.
Rob

Joe Chritz
02-04-2008, 3:37 AM
Mine is 24x30 with a spray room of 10x14 or so on the end. It needs to be a few feet wider and longer. 32x40 would be a minimum. I would add 4 feet to the length and section off 10' for a spray room on one end and a storage room on the other.

You can do the building itself for well under 40K. Radiant floor heat is a good system. Keep at least one overhead door, I am surprised how much I use mine. I have an 8 foot lumber cart, off cuts and a few sheets in front of the door on casters so I don't loose the space.

It is a big project but so worth it when done.

Joe

Jim Becker
02-04-2008, 10:23 AM
Separate finishing room... good! 8'x8'? Go a little bigger, especially with such a large shop. You need room to be able to maneuver larger pieces and get completely around them with out bumping into walls. More space will help you do that.

You don't say where you are located, but you do indicate that heat will be required. By all means consider in-floor radiant right from the start. Very comfortable and efficient. But also consider breaking up the space a little more and put in a zoned system so you can heat even more economically. That's a big space! Storage can be heated less or even unheated much of the time. You might also consider a separate assembly room in that respect.

For any large exterior doors, use roll-ups rather than garage doors that take up overhead space. And don't forget natural light. Even if you put windows high up on the wall, don't leave them out.

brad kellner
02-04-2008, 11:26 PM
yeah the finishing room i thought would be too small 8x8 really isnt that big, if i make any large saze pantrys i could see myself not being able to fit it into the room, or if i could fit it into the room i wouldnt have enough room to work and on top of that i would only be able to do a few pieces at a time. im defnitely thinking more like 16x12 for the finish room. after talking to the instructor at school (union apprenticeship school) he recamended radiant in concrete heating. he told me to do the multi zone set up so when the finishing room isnt being used i could drop the temp to around 40 degrees to save on heating cost, and told me to set the work area at around 55 degrees, just enough to keep the chill outin the winter. which is all i really want. but my instructor did recamend putting in a small heat pump for my office so it would stay nice and warm and could be cooled easily in the summer since it is the only part of the shop i would actually use air conditioning in.he told me it would probly only cost me about 20-30 bucks a month to heat my office at 70degrees year round. i also was told since i plan on using h.i.d lights to go to an indoor gardeing store and buy a vented reflector for the h.i.d lights and an inline blower and suck the air down to vents around the floor to make use of the additional heat put out by the h.i.d. light. he said that they actually put out a fair amount of heat and it would probly help with the heating bill and since i would be using the light anyway it would me a good way of maximizing the way i heat the shop

and about the size i was kinda going back and fourth between 32x40x16 (was only thinking 16ft ceiling so i could put a mesine in) to 40x60x 14 i figure with this i could avoid having to build a mesine to put my office in. plus then i could have everything on one floor and not have to run up and down stairs. but if i go bigger to a 40x60x14 i am probly just going to make the place a pole barn to save on cost. i really dont like the idea of a steal building becuase metal transfers heat and im thinking heating the place in the winter is going to be big money as it is. western pa is like the artic but we do have around 2 months of actual really cold weather (aound 15-30 degrees) occasionally it will get below 0 but that is far and few between and it doesnt last very long. and lately the winters have been pretty mild for the most part exept for a few really cold spells.

i do like the idea of a covered concrete patio. on nice days i do like to do some work outside like sanding and staining. as far as windows are concerned i really dont care for them in my shop. i think they would raise my heating bill more than i would get use out of them. plus i like the idea of no one being able to see what i have in my shop. people are more likely not to steal what they cant see. plus then the wife wont be able to look out the window and see if i am in there or not. and part of the reason i want out of the garage is so it is easier for me to hide when i want to get away from her.

this shop isnt really going to be a income business, more like a hobby business to help pay for my toys (tools) if the work i do in it pays for me to be able to afford to keep the power on and give me a warm place to work and get away from the wife, i would concider my little business a success. she doesnt like the noise in the shop (gives her migraines) so it will help me get some time to relax and get away from the house hold drama. but at the same time i do want to be able to have the space to be efficent enough to turn a little profite. i would like to do it as a maine income but i would only want to be a worker i wouldnt want to work the office and i know from doing home remodling and additions, customers love talking and that takes away from time i could be working and on tight bid jobs i just cant have that so if it ever got bigger than 4-5 goodsize kitchens a year i would have to hire my brother in law to run the business end of it.

thanks for all the help i do truely appreciate it and it is helping me get what i will need planned out. keep the helpful info coming.

tool wise i am in the process of upgrading my tools and adding on a few other high end tools to make things easier.
some of the stuff that are in the works is
-upgrading to a 10" cabinet saw with 50 in rails and 6 ft outfeed table and with sliding table
-currently (hopefully this weekend) upgrading to a 15in planer and getting a byrd cutterhead for it. i dont see myself needing to go bigger than 15 inches since most the rough cut lumber i get is about 12 inches exept for the occasional wider one and im just upgrading becuase i want the 220v power and to upgrade to a byrd cutterhead
-cyclone filter
-37 in drum sander
-14" and 18" bandsaws
-upgrading my 6" grizzly jointer to a 8" grizzly parralelogram jointer
-custom 3 sided router table for doing cabinet doors (i hate changing bits and adjusting heights, i loose way to much time dialing them in)
-benchtop mortiser
-drill press (varialble speen floor modle)
-osilating spingle sander
- ez jig for cutting up sheet goods
- semi autopocket hole cutter
-lathe (dont see my self using this alot but got a nephew who likes turning)
-16x4 assembly table and varius cabinets for storage
-80gallon compressor
-already have a 12" slide saw and am selling a 10" radial arm saw

right now i kinda have the basics and am able to get the job done but i am going to upgrade becuase im a tool junky and i enjoy using professional equipment and want this to be my dream shop and want to have it fully loaded for woodworking and cabinetry. any machines (not counting hand tools i already have them) that i am not thinking of. im just asking becuase the tools i plan on buying are what are deciding the size of my shop ive been planning to build next year

thanks agian and keep the helpful info coming