Putting the rails on a Cross Cut sled..

[Bill Huber]

I am making a new sled and I am using plastic rails, I had problems with the wood on the last one, it shank a little and the sled is loose.

I have read many different ways to put the rails on, put them in and clamp them, screw them in from the top, put some glue on them and many different ways of doing it.

With the plastic rails I wanted to screw then on from the bottom but was having a problem with getting them set just right. I tried clamping them but this did not work out to well, the center would bow. I even tried glue, but I was sure that wouldn't work and it didn't.

So after messing around with it all afternoon it hit me and I used turners tape. I had some 3/4 inch double back tape, put the rails in the slots and put the tape on the full length of the rail.

I then pulled the backing off, move the fence to the correct position and held the sled base against the fence and then just lowered it down. Pressed down all along the rails and it worked great. I could even slide the sled base back and forth to check it out and the tape held the plastic rails right in place.

I flipped the base over and with the rails still taped to it I put in the screws in so the holes would be there. I then took the screws back out and removed the tape, the tape would make the rail to high. Screwed the rails back on and tighten them up.

Flipped it back over and it fit like a glove. I also found that with the pan head screws I use if I really tightened them up it would tighten the rail in the slot, this makes for very nice adjustment later on if it gets a little loose.

Some times it is so easy if you just use your head a little ..........

[Brodie Brickey]

Bill,

Thanks for the tip. I've been having issues with sticky rails.

[Rick Moyer]

Good idea. Next time if you allow for the tape, you could just leave it on and screw through without having to remove it.

[Brian Penning]

So your rails must be higher than the TS top initially?
I remember when I bought the UHMW rail that they were too low below the top.

[Greg Stanford]

So your rails must be higher than the TS top initially?
I remember when I bought the UHMW rail that they were too low below the top.

Just shim the rail so it sits proud of the table.

g

[Richard M. Wolfe]

I have a question, please, Bill.

When you laid the sled on the runners how did you keep it exactly ninety degrees when you put it down? Seems you have one shot only.

[Alex Berkovsky]

I have a question, please, Bill.

When you laid the sled on the runners how did you keep it exactly ninety degrees when you put it down? Seems you have one shot only.
When you put the sled on the runners, it doesn't have to be at 90 degrees. What's important is to have the fence square to the blade.

[keith micinski]

Rather then using rails, why not use a bearing system like they use on a ts- aligner base. I am going to try this and think it will work really well. I also thought about adapting some sort of a drawer slide that clamps inside the slot by tightening a screw block that expands.

[Bill Huber]

I have a question, please, Bill.

When you laid the sled on the runners how did you keep it exactly ninety degrees when you put it down? Seems you have one shot only.

That is correct, you have only one shot but that shot is right on. This is just putting the base on the rails, not putting the front on the sled that I will have to tune when I do it.

I am sure that there will be very little tuning to it because the base is square and it is parallel with the fence which is parallel with the slot which is parallel with the blade. This was the first thing I checked before I started the sled.



80385

[Bill Huber]

So your rails must be higher than the TS top initially?
I remember when I bought the UHMW rail that they were too low below the top.

No, they are made for the Craftsman saw so they are even with the table top, so the tape made them to high.
If I was doing it again I would do as Rick suggested and sand the plastic down so I could just leave the tape.

[Guy Germaine]

Whe I built my big sled, I used UMHW for the runners. It was 3/4" X 3/8" (same size as the slots). I ran them through the planer, and took just a little bit off, so they would not bottom out once they were attached to the sled. I then put double-stick tape on the runners and sat them on washers that I placed in the bottom of the slot. That made the runners sit just proud of the table top. I set my rip fence to the distance that I wanted, and used it as a "stop" for the top of the sled. Then just gently lay the sled on to the runners and press down good. Gently lift the whole thing and turn it over and screw the runners to the sled. I just leave the tape. Also, before I did all this, I drilled pilot holes in the UMHW runners and countersunk them. Now, ifI need to tighten the runners up a little, all I have to do is tighten up the screws. the countersink acts as a wedge and will widen the runners by tightening up the screws.

As others have said, it's not the end of the world if you dont get the runners on perfect. It's the back fence that has to be dead on. When I put the fince on mine, I clamped the fence to the sled, drilled and installed a small lag bolt in one end as a "pivot". One the other end, I drilled an oversized hole in the bottom of the sled, and a pilot hole into the sled and used a 1 1/4" deck screw to hold it in place. I then used the 5 cut method to get it square. Once I had it square, I tightened the lag screw and the deck screw down, then added a few more screws, just for good measure.

[Tom Manley]

Guy - Can you explain the "5 cut method" for squaring the fence on your CC sled?

Thanks

[Lee Koepke]

the 3-4-5 triangle concept?

a right triangle with one side a multiple of 3, the other a multiple of 4, means the hypotenueuse would be the same multiple of 5 ???

or am I over thinking it

[Bill Huber]

Guy - Can you explain the "5 cut method" for squaring the fence on your CC sled?

Thanks

This should show you how to do it.

http://www.thewoodshop.20m.com/five_cut_method_swf.htm

[glenn bradley]

That is the method I use on all my sleds. Works great. For UHMW I use pan head screws from the bottom. I drill stepped holes in the UHMW as it lessens the swelling when tightening the screws. I leave the double-stick tape on with no problems.

If I need to fine tune the UHMW, I draw down the sides of each rail with a felt pen, slide the sled back and forth and use a cabinet scraper to tune the areas where the ink gets rubbed off till I have a tight but smooth sliding fit.

[Chris Padilla]

I use the Incra Slider Bars (http://www.rockler.com/product.cfm?page=11337).

[Art Mann]

When you put the sled on the runners, it doesn't have to be at 90 degrees. What's important is to have the fence square to the blade.

What is really important is to have the fence exactly square to the miter groove. If the blade is not quite parallel to the miter groove, the result will only be a slightly wider kerf. What I just said is not intuitive, but it is true. One should not reference a fence, either for a sled or a miter gauge, directly to the blade, as it can introduce unnecessary error.

[Gary Keedwell]

A few years ago I drill and tapped some holes in all my runners and screwed in some spring plungers. Now there is no "play" and if one runner is too small..it will run on one edge only.I bought the self-locking ones so they will not unscew with vibrations.

Gary

[Ted Herazy]

A few years ago I drill and tapped some holes in all my runners and screwed in some spring plungers. Now there is no "play" and if one runner is too small..it will run on one edge only.I bought the self-locking ones so they will not unscew with vibrations.

Gary

Gary - do you happen to have a picture of the plungers you used? Better yet, do you have a picture of the plungers installed in the rails?

Thanks,
Ted

[Gary Keedwell]

Gary - do you happen to have a picture of the plungers you used? Better yet, do you have a picture of the plungers installed in the rails?

Thanks,
Ted

http://www.swmanufacturing.com/parts_list.asp?CAT_ID=3

You drill and tap thru the sides . I spaced about 3 or four along the length. You can order plungers with different size threads and materials. If you have any experience with tapping it is easy. Maybe you know a machinist that will help you out.
I put the idea out there a few years ago when I couldn't find a good runner. It generated alot of interest on another forum.... Since then I have seen one manufacturer use the method.
Gary

[Michael Gibbons]

I used a Lee Valley framing square with their square fence attachment then attached a plain old aluminum t-track. works like a charm. I tried the Incra slider track for another jig I just built but I couldn't get it to fit right-they're adjustable, so I used another plain t-track.

[Alex Berkovsky]

What is really important is to have the fence exactly square to the miter groove. If the blade is not quite parallel to the miter groove, the result will only be a slightly wider kerf. What I just said is not intuitive, but it is true. One should not reference a fence, either for a sled or a miter gauge, directly to the blade, as it can introduce unnecessary error.Good point. I failed to mention that prior to building a x-cut sled, the saw must be tuned up.

[Bruce Benjamin]

http://www.swmanufacturing.com/parts_list.asp?CAT_ID=3

You drill and tap thru the sides . I spaced about 3 or four along the length. You can order plungers with different size threads and materials. If you have any experience with tapping it is easy. Maybe you know a machinist that will help you out.
I put the idea out there a few years ago when I couldn't find a good runner. It generated alot of interest on another forum.... Since then I have seen one manufacturer use the method.
Gary

The stock miter gauge on my General International contractor saw uses these also. I bought it about 5 years ago or so. I've seen it on another brand at the time too but I don't recall which one. They work well but make sure you use enough of them. There should always be at least 2 of the ball bearings in contact with the side of the miter slot no matter where the gauge, (or sled) is on the table. Another thing is that you should adjust them before adjusting the miter gauge. If you set up your miter gauge, (or sled fence) and then adjust the bar you may have thrown the sled or miter gauge out of alignment a little.

Bruce

[Richard Wagner]

Excuse me folks, I'm a bit slow on the uptake.

Isn't one of the primary objectives of a table saw tune up to get the fences either parallel to or perpendicular to the blade.. ? The blade being the "primary plane" of reference.

[Bruce Benjamin]

Excuse me folks, I'm a bit slow on the uptake.

Isn't one of the primary objectives of a table saw tune up to get the fences either parallel to or perpendicular to the blade.. ? The blade being the "primary plane" of reference.

I won't speak for other people but for me the primary objective is to get both the blade and the fence parallel to the miter slot. If you get the blade parallel to the miter slot then, yes, you can set the rip fence parallel to the blade. But the primary point of reference is the miter slot. Since the blade is relatively short compared to the miter slot, it's easier to be more accurate if you set the rip fence parallel to the miter slot.

To repeat what has already been stated, if the blade is out of alignment it won't cause a crooked cut. It will just make the kerf wider. Have you ever seen a, "Wobble dado"? As it spins it is constantly going into and out of alignment with the miter slot. It doesn't make a crooked cut though. It just makes a wider kerf depending on how much wobble is dialed into the blade.

Bruce

[Tom Manley]

I have a dial indicator & stand to measure this pretty precisely but am not quite sure ... How close is close enough when setting the saw's rip fence parallel to the miter slot?

[Bruce Benjamin]

I have a dial indicator & stand to measure this pretty precisely but am not quite sure ... How close is close enough when setting the saw's rip fence parallel to the miter slot?

That's hard question to answer because some books and manufacturers actually instruct you to angle the rear of the fence away from the blade, (and the miter slot) when setting it up. I think I've seen it written that angling it away a few thousandths will help keep the piece between the blade and the fence from binding.

Last time I checked it mine is set so that the blade is about dead-on, or as close as I can measure. But with my Biesemeyer clone fence there is a certain amount of flex possible at that end of the fence so I think it's sort of a moot point. One thing for sure though, you're a lot better off having the back of the fence angled away from the blade a little than having it angle towards the blade. Angling it towards the blade will cause the wood to bind and at best causing some burning and at worst causing a kickback.

Depending on what kind of fence you have, it's not hard to dial in the adjustment. At least it's easy compared to adjusting the blade parallel to the miter slot. Of course adjusting one miter slot to be parallel with the other miter slot is the most difficult adjustment of all. ;):rolleyes::D

Bruce

[Bob Stritzke]

Of course adjusting one miter slot to be parallel with the other miter slot is the most difficult adjustment of all. ;):rolleyes::D

Bruce

That's what if forgot to do.:eek: Great best comment all day.:)

[Art Mann]

Excuse me folks, I'm a bit slow on the uptake.

Isn't one of the primary objectives of a table saw tune up to get the fences either parallel to or perpendicular to the blade.. ? The blade being the "primary plane" of reference.

I would not say that is the best way of looking at it. The miter slot is the one thing you can't adjust. The idea is to set the rip fence and blade parallel to it, and the miter or sled fence perpendicular to it. As someone pointed out, some references even say to kick out the back side of the blade a few thousandths away from being parallel to the rip fence. Every measurement ought to directly reference the miter slot.

It was said before, but is worth repeating. The blade can be slightly out of parallel to the miter slot, and you can still get a square cut. However, if the miter fence is not perpendicular to the miter slot, you will not get a square cut, regardless of how you adjust the blade. This is not obvious, but it is a fact.

[Rob Blaustein]

I would not say that is the best way of looking at it. The miter slot is the one thing you can't adjust. The idea is to set the rip fence and blade parallel to it, and the miter or sled fence perpendicular to it...
...However, if the miter fence is not perpendicular to the miter slot, you will not get a square cut, regardless of how you adjust the blade.

Art, I agree entirely with the second portion quoted above--for a crosscut sled or miter gauge, the sled or gauge fence must be perpendicular to the direction of the feed. But I wonder if there's something potentially misleading about the way you wrote the first part above. Isn't it actually the miter slot that one adjusts? I always thought you adjust that relative to the blade by moving the table slightly. In other words, you don't typically set the blade parallel to the slot, you set the slot parallel to the blade. --Rob

[Bill Huber]

Art, I agree entirely with the second portion quoted above--for a crosscut sled or miter gauge, the sled or gauge fence must be perpendicular to the direction of the feed. But I wonder if there's something potentially misleading about the way you wrote the first part above. Isn't it actually the miter slot that one adjusts? I always thought you adjust that relative to the blade by moving the table slightly. In other words, you don't typically set the blade parallel to the slot, you set the slot parallel to the blade. --Rob

That would depend on what type saw you have. I have a contractor saw and you set the blade to the miter guide. Now on a cabinet saw I think you may be right, you set the top to the blade, not sure on that part.

[Brad Townsend]

I'm a little surprised no one mentioned using a dado stack on the saw to cut a shallow dado in the bottom of the sled the exact width of the miter bar and screwing it in. Thats how I did mine. Fast and easy.

[Rob Blaustein]

That would depend on what type saw you have. I have a contractor saw and you set the blade to the miter guide. Now on a cabinet saw I think you may be right, you set the top to the blade, not sure on that part.

Yes, sorry, I was referring to a cabinet saw which is what I have. I don't know how to tune a contractor saw. Yet more variables to throw in the equation.

[Art Mann]

Good point Rob. Perhaps I could have said it better. The point I was trying to make is that the blade should not ever be used as a reference to set the crosscut or rip fences. The miter slot should always be the primary reference.

[Tom Manley]

" Of course adjusting one miter slot to be parallel with the other miter slot is the most difficult adjustment of all. ;):rolleyes::D"

Bruce - that's a good one!

[Art Mann]

I'm a little surprised no one mentioned using a dado stack on the saw to cut a shallow dado in the bottom of the sled the exact width of the miter bar and screwing it in. Thats how I did mine. Fast and easy.

That would be a good way to do it if you are only using one miter slot. I use both miter slots and the precision adjustments required to get each dado the exact width and then get the exact spacing between dados is too much trouble.

You bring up a good thought though. Why do we use both slots instead of just one?