1st Time Sprayer, need material advice

[Chris Merriam]

Got a big compressor for my birthday, and now have a Wagner HVLP on the way from Christmas. I'm all set to start spraying but am kind of stuck on a couple things.

Based on my reading, I think I'd like to start using dyes instead of pigment stains. But this stuff is expensive!! It's like $100+ for the full range of colors. How do folks get started with using these - do you start with just a color or two? Seems like you'd end up missing the one color you need to get the final ending wood color you want...

How far can you stretch a can of spray finish? This stuff is like $25 a quart!! Say you are doing an average nightstand and you are going for a fairly smooth finish (pores pretty much filled in). How many quarts would that take?

Thanks!

[Matt Meiser]

I can't comment too much on the dyes/stains. I've used a few of the Transtint dyes I've bought for specific purposes. Mostly I'v use the Honey Amber liquid to tint waterborne finishes so they give an oil-like coloring to the wood.

For finishes, I really like Target USL because it is extremely forgiving and pretty easy to spray for a novice. I just did a second project with it and had forgotten how great it is. The other thing I've sprayed with good results is Minwax Polycrylic on some shelving and bathroom cabinets. It has the advantage of being relatively inexpensive and is available almost anywhere.

[Christof Grohs]

Got a big compressor for my birthday, and now have a Wagner HVLP on the way from Christmas. I'm all set to start spraying but am kind of stuck on a couple things.

Based on my reading, I think I'd like to start using dyes instead of pigment stains. But this stuff is expensive!! It's like $100+ for the full range of colors. How do folks get started with using these - do you start with just a color or two? Seems like you'd end up missing the one color you need to get the final ending wood color you want...

How far can you stretch a can of spray finish? This stuff is like $25 a quart!! Say you are doing an average nightstand and you are going for a fairly smooth finish (pores pretty much filled in). How many quarts would that take?

Thanks!

Chris

Unless you have the means to remove the vapors from sprayed solvent based finished you will be spraying water-bornes. I shoot mostly Target coatings (http://www.targetcoatings.com/home.html) like Matt mentioned and have really grown to like them, especially the USL. Water-bornes have a pretty good shelf life so buy them in gallons not quarts to save $. You will just have to shoot a project once to get a feel for how much finish you are going to need. There are far too many variables involved to give a solid answer to that.

If you plan to use dyes you need to first ask yourself which woods you typically work with and then buy colors within that range you typically work. It's not necessary to buy full color range kits, just mix dyes to get the colors you want but remember to include the 3 primary colors. Wood takes dye pretty much like stain so you will consume just about as much dye as stain on your projects.

[Chris Merriam]

Thanks, I was planning on getting the Target USL, hence my sticker shock at seeing the prices. I was hoping that sprayed finish is magically less material intensive than brushing so I didn't have to buy as much.

Maybe I'll come up with a utility project so I can learn to spray on the cheaper minwax poly.

One more question, I normally finish my pieces before gluing up. I'll probably change that now that I start spraying. But what about drawer openings? I'm working on a nightstand with a single drawer about 5-6 inches tall - can a spray gun shoot inside there and cover the drawer cavity?

Thanks!

[Jim Becker]

Chris...good materials do cost money, but the results pay for the product in spades. That includes lumber. The first step in the finishing process is choosing the right boards to make it from. The TC finishes are not inexpensive, but they have done well by me...better than anything else I have tried.

As to the dyes, I generally buy water soluble colors in powder form and mix with distilled water in small batches. I also have a few of the universal liquid tints From Homestead "just because" the color I wanted was in stock. I'd probably never consider buying a whole "set" of dyes because so much of it would never get used.

Don't worry about spraying very far inside a drawer opening. There's no reason to finish the inside that's never visible. You can still pre-finish things if you want as long as you mask off glue areas, etc. I do that for cabinetry as I hate spraying into a box with the resulting mess back at my person...as well as the tight quarters. It's easier with my second gun...the remote 2 qt version of the Wagner...but I still prefer to spray things flat and assemble later.

[Chris Merriam]

Thanks for all the replies, one more question regarding safety. For some reason I've been so hung up on not spraying NC lacquer that I thought it was okay to spray other solvents at home in my basement. I read through a bunch of old posts yesterday but would like to get some clarifications.

In a basement without an approved spray booth, I should not spray anything except water base? Does that include pigment stains too? Would that include dyes if I mixed them in alcohol? I am not looking to take chances, so i'm looking for the most conservative approach.

Thanks for helping me not blow up my house!!

[Roy Hatch]

Chris,

Dyes dissolved in alcohol and sprayed should be explosive if you have the appropriate concentration. Not something you want in your house.

You should find that with the loss of product when spraying you will use a larger volume to finish a given item. When we learn (I'm a beginner too) what we're doing, we should finish in less time and have better looking finishes. Unfortunately, we will probably use more of the finish. With that said, I think that a quart for a small table should be enough.

I think we need some good references for mixing colors as that is one of the many things about which I know nothing.

Roy

[Jim Becker]

For the dyes, just use the water soluble versions...same colors and you can wipe them on and work them. No spraying necessary. (The reason you spray alcohol soluble dyes is that they "dry" too quickly to wipe on evenly)

I only spray water borne products and shellac. (The latter might be a problem in a basement shop due to the alcohol fumes) I'd never spray NC Lacquer without a proper spray setup.