Bench top table saws, Ryobi any good? Others?

[Alan Tolchinsky]

Hi All,

Does anybody own one of these that they like and has a good fence? I'm looking at the Ryobi BTS20 for $230 at Home Depot. Any good? I'm looking at this for a second shop and don't want to buy more saw than this. Other suggestions welcome. Thanks. Alan

[Scott Kilroy]

the old ryobi BT3100 has a bit of a cult like following but its now being sold as the sears crasftman 21829 (I think). At that price point it's going to be hard to find anything accurate.

[Jim Andrew]

I don't have any Ryobi tools that I am happy with. Just wish I'd spent a little more and bought something Makita. Jim

[Norman Pyles]

Don't know anything about that saw, but I would look at the used market. You will get a lot more saw for the same money. I love my Ryobi 1+ drill/driver, and saw though.

[Al Killian]

Not worth it. The saw is all plastic and is not accurate enough for woodworking. LOML bought me one and it went back in less then a week. I would rather go without then to deal with all the issues that saw has. Save your money and search for a used one. Even a old craftsman will out run this saw and you can get them for around $150.

[Brian Kent]

I bought the next one down in price - Home Depot $89 Ryobi.

The splitter - looks like the same one as this - was so weak that it would stop the wood in the middle of the cut.

So I thought I would just remove it and "be careful". The kickback slammed into my stomach so hard I was surprised I didn't have any internal damage.

There is not room for a pop-in splitter. I made a wooden splitter attached to the back.

The next kickback broke the wood splitter and the wood I was cutting shot back into my hand and almost broke my finger. It bent the light aluminum fence to a 45 degree angle.

I finally bought a sturdier saw just for safety sake. I would keep looking for something reasonably priced that has a much sturdier fence and either a decent splitter (or riving knife!) or room behind the blade for a pop-in splitter.

Incidentally, I did not sell the Ryobi at a garage sale. I took it apart and put the parts in the garbage and recycle.

[Thomas Knighton]

Check out the Jet bench top HD sells for $250. Same motor type, but belt driven and has dust collection. I've been looking at it for my shop, which will need something highly mobile due to extremely small size. Matthew Voss, another member here, has one and seems to think very highly of it.

Another of Jet's bench top's, without the legs and dust collection, can be had on Amazon for $199.

For the about same price, it looks like both are much better saws.

Tom

[Gerald Eberhardt]

IMO Ryobi tools lack quality!

I have a few of their lower cost bench top tools like the band saw, scroll saw and router table. After a few years I had replace the bearings in the band saw, and the router is now having bearing problems. And I personally think the only reason the scroll saw has survived this long without issues is because of the low usage.

Replacing the bearings in the BS was an eye opener. The wheels were way off balance, there was a lot of end-play slop on the wheel shafts, and there was a lot of plastic in the parts.

After the BS, I would be scared to see what I would find in a $200 table saw.

If I was to do it over…..I would spend a bit more and get some higher quality tools. I think Ryobi’s place in the market is quick, cheap tools to get by.

[Randy Cohen]

I've been disappointed with the Ryobi tools I've had.

[tom cooper]

Alan-
The answer to your question depends on what type of service you need for the second saw that you want to buy. I have had a couple of Craftsman lightweights for my extra's and they work fine for what I needed - simple crosscutting, flooring, even ripping 2x's and rough work. With a decent blade and understanding their limitations, any of the cheap saws will do this for you and last a reasonably long time (wait a minute, I had a Delta bench top which I burned the motor out too easily - DON'T buy a Delta!!!!). I recently eliminated all the cheap stuff and bought the Bosch jobsite saw for a few hundred bucks more and while my needs justified the better grade saw, I think the small Jet mentioned above is a good value and wish I had looked at that first.

[Billy Chambless]

IMO Ryobi tools lack quality!


And that's sad... I remember when they were as good as Makita. And that was back when Makita was better than now!

[Prashun Patel]

If you want a benchtop, my research showed that it's hard to beat the Dewalt or Bosch portables. But at $400-500 it made me question how much I was going to be moving it around. If yr not going to move it, you might be better off with a contractor or hybrid saw. They'll be quieter too.

[Randy Carnley]

I have a very small working area so I bought the Bosch (mainly because I have several Bosch tools and love all of them and the saw received rave reviews. It is pricey but for my use an excellent investment.

[Alan Tolchinsky]

I guess I'll eliminate the Ryobi. But the reviews for the Jet on Amazon were not that good either. I would definitely buy a contractors saw before spending a lot on any bench top. So I'm off to Craigs List to see what's there. Thanks again all.

[glenn bradley]

Ryobis are what they are just as Harbour Freight tools are what they are to an even lesser degree. I hear good things about the DeWalt bench top but my brother has this (http://www.boschtools.com/tools/tools-detail.htm?H=175981&G=54932&I=80580) and it is sweet for a BT. Available as the 4100 without the stand.

[Scott Kilroy]

I guess I'll eliminate the Ryobi. But the reviews for the Jet on Amazon were not that good either. I would definitely buy a contractors saw before spending a lot on any bench top. So I'm off to Craigs List to see what's there. Thanks again all.

I haven't used the Jet but I always take amazon reviews with a grain of salt.

[Chuck Tringo]

Its too bad you didnt pull the trigger a few weeks ago, the orange borg had the Ridgid jobsite saw for $299 (2400 i think), normally $450. I would have jumped on it if i hadnt just bought one of the new Jet proshop saws a little over a month ago. Its about as beefy as the Bosch and the fence is just a shorter version the 3650, which many who have them seem to like.

[John Seiffer]

the old ryobi BT3100 has a bit of a cult like following but its now being sold as the sears crasftman 21829 (I think).

I have the BT3100 and it's great for a small saw. Very accurate when tuned up and a lot of features for the money. The "cult" website is http://www.bt3central.com/ but since Ryobi discontinued the saw most of the talk is just about wood working.

The Crafstman 21829 is the same saw (different colors) and seems to come with a set of wheels.

[Randal Stevenson]

Like others said, this is NO BT3 series. Check out Craigslist, or keep your eyes open for a used contractor saw, or better yet (portable AND functional), look down below in the EZ forum and get a guide and a smart table, or a Bridge setup.

[Alan Tolchinsky]

I haven't used the Jet but I always take amazon reviews with a grain of salt.

I don't know about that Scott but there was one owner who wrote a review that had some very specific complaints about it. The review sounded very believable to me.

[Thomas Knighton]

Alan,

I've investigated the Jet saw fairly well. If you can direct me to which review you're talking about, I may be able to address the issues.

Tom

[John Thompson]

I purchased a Ryobi BT 3000 saw about 6 years ago in a yard sale for $125 which inclued long extension rails. My neighbor had used it for several years as he makes outside furniture for a living. Took a chance and took it home... cleaned it up and built a wooden base cabinet from scrap to stabilize it. As stated, Ryobi dis-continued the BT 3 series but still make the saw for Sears as the 21289.

Has a small slider.. riving knife and a dust chute under the blade that is second to none with what it collects. I have no real figures to reveal what my neighbor put across it with 1 1/2" treated lumber, but by adding an extention table right and rear... I have shoved over 40,000 linear feet of up to 1 1/2" ( 6/4) stock through it before I upgraded to a Cabinet saw as I needed more HP with the 8/4 + stock I frequently work with.

Did I retire or attempt to sell it for $125 or less. Nope.... it sits in the back shop with a dedicated dado blade and a custom fence I made and installed to strickly do dadoes. No blade change and it's still raring to go as of the last use three or four weeks ago.

Would I purchase the cheaper $250 version from Ryobi or Sears who Ryobi make for. Nope.. it's junk. The Bosch bench-top is also a fine saw along with the 21289 but at the price point offered.. I would skip it and look at the Rigid contractor or better yet a used cabinet in the $700-$800 price range.

But... I will go against the grain of all Ryobi was bad. I have an older Ryobi 3 x 21 belt sander I prefer over a Bosch and PC I have. It's still hummin' on the rare occasion I use a belt sander. As far as I am concerned a belt sanders use is for construction with a few rare uses in my wood shop.

Good luck with whatever you do...

Sarge..

[Dave Dionne]

I'll follow what John said about the older BT series, it go my woodworking, I know pwoplw that use it over their cabinet saw just for making segmented bowls. When that saw is on it is on. I have since moved to a Jet cabinet becasue I wanted/needed to start doing more sheet goods.

Check on Craigs list and search for Ryobi they pop up allot in my area for $100-150.

Wish I had kept mine but that was a part of the deal when I up-graded.

Took it apart and sold it for $180 more then what I paid for it new.

Good luck

Dave

[Matt Mutus]

I have the dewalt DW745. It's light which is nice because I lug it around. It was $299 with free shipping from Tool Barn.

I think there are certain things where Dewalt gives you the best bang for the buck in terms of combined price and quality. This is one of them (CMS another).

BTW - if you have space for a real saw - personally I would look very hard for a used contractor and forget benchtops.

[Alan Tolchinsky]

O.K. here's one review and a pretty balanced one at that from Amazon. In general a lot of people liked the saw but some had severe criticism for the fence and miter guage. Those are one of my main concerns in a saw. Here's the review from one gentleman:


MISCELLANEOUS
Save for the mitre gauge and rip fence, Jet appears to have done a commendable job with this saw's design; the only operation gliche I've encountered is the occasional interference of the rip fence and the handwheel used to raise and lower the blade. The construction is sturdy, though not heavy, there is plenty of opportunity to add extension wings and a table surround, plus the relative light weight offers a lot of portability. I've mounted my saw on my own purpose-built stand with casters, yielding a surface height of 34.5 inches -- ideal for me. The saw is attached to the stand with four hex bolts, easily removed when I need to take the saw somewhere.

OVERALL IMPRESSIONS
Pressed (or not-so-pressed as the case may be) to rate this saw, I think I'd give it an 8 out of 10, dropping the two points because of the disappointing mitre gauge and rip fence. Beyond that, Jet has produced pretty much what I expected for a $200 weekend project tool. It's at least on par with comparably priced (and even higher priced) equipment, likely better than most. If you feel up to replacing the two aforementioned components (mitre saw and rip fence), you should have the foundation for a very nice, versatile piece of equipment that will serve you well. Help other customers find the most helpful reviews
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Comment

[Jim Becker]

BT3100 or whatever the current equivalent is would be a better choice if you want Ryobi. Bosch has a nice portable that even has a riving knife. The Dewalt seems to be the frequent choice of contractors that have to lug around a portable table saw these days and it has a reasonably workable fence.

[Larry Conely]

I have a BT3100 that I use at a second location. The fence seems to be very similar. I would buy another in a heart beat. I bought it used, and it has performed well beyond my expectations.

[Scott Kilroy]

I don't know about that Scott but there was one owner who wrote a review that had some very specific complaints about it. The review sounded very believable to me.

I didn't look at the reviews for this item, but in the past I've seen a number of tool reviews where the reviewers expectations weren't realistic.

[Thomas Knighton]

Alan,

Apparently the miter gauge slop can be fixed with some UHMW tape. The fence issue that many people report seems to be damage caused during shipping. Several reviewers report the fence working great on other versions of this saw (there are three...two with legs and one without). Should you opt to get the Jet saw, and the fence isn't right, then I'd call Jet and have them send you a replacement.

Just what my research into this indicates. Hope this helps.

Tom

[Alan Tolchinsky]

Thanks again everybody. This is a tough one for me because I'm used to using a Delta CS with a Unifence which is great. So I know these table top saws will have their limitations. I'm still looking for used saws but none so far to be had.

[Jon Bonham]

I've never owned a single Ryobi tool that was worth a crap. My wife bought me a Ryobi miter saw at HD and I took it back a couple days later and bought a DeWalt DW716. The Ryobi couldn't make two consistent cuts out of 10 tries.

[Daniel Berlin]

Alan,

Apparently the miter gauge slop can be fixed with some UHMW tape. The fence issue that many people report seems to be damage caused during shipping. Several reviewers report the fence working great on other versions of this saw (there are three...two with legs and one without). Should you opt to get the Jet saw, and the fence isn't right, then I'd call Jet and have them send you a replacement.

Just what my research into this indicates. Hope this helps.

Tom

I have owned one of these jet benchtops for approximately 3 weeks and am about to return it (The BTC model, which has the right wing extension but no legs).
The amazon review about the miter gauge and fence are spot on.
The fence is absolutely horrible (and that is being kind). Even if you adjust the clamping screw to maximum clamping, it can still be pushed out of alignment pretty easily. The fence will also happily clamp out of alignment and it is very hard to keep it square just sliding it along the rail.

I figured this was just a fence damage problem, as you did. Jet fedex'd me a new fence (saturday delivery no less) packed as well as could be, but it has the exact same problem.

I love Jet's support, and their larger models, but the fence on the benchtop, and the non-standard miter gauges (it's 10mm by 16mm, not 3/8 by 3/4. Everything on this saw is in metric.), just did it in for me.

FWIW, the reason the fence doesn't stay square is twofold, AFAICT. First, the angled aluminum on the front portion doesn't stay flat against the rail like most t-square fences do. It's a few degrees off. If you push it flat against the front rail, the rear end comes up. In addition, there are only two contact points for the fence on the rail (IE the entire front block does not contact the rail, only two raised portions on the left and right ends of the T), and because they are not exactly the same height (according to my calipers :P), it will happily wobble from one to the other, and clamp in both positions. The first problem is what kills you because nothing prevents it from clamping out of alignment, like you see on the bosch. If the angled aluminum was a perfect 90 degrees, and the front was touching the rail all the way down, presumably the contact points would prevent it from clamping in wobble-left and wobble-right positions, even if you had to realign the fence slightly once to account for the contacts not being perfectly done.

The wobble is not just a small amount, it's about 3/8ths of an inch or more.

I seriously considered drilling holes and putting a delta t2 fence on it, because i otherwise like the saw, but at some point I lost the will to try to make a cheap product better than it really was, and just bit the bullet and bought the bosch.
The ridgid ts2400ls was the other one i considered, and looks like a fine saw, but all 3 home depots in the area i went to that claimed to have 5+ in inventory couldn't find them after each spent about 15 minutes looking on tops of aisles . I took this as a sign :)

[Alan Tolchinsky]

Daniel, Thanks for posting that. It pretty much goes along with several reviews on Amazon. It just shows that you can't buy something based on brand name alone. At certain price points a lot of junk is out there no matter whose name is on it.

[Thomas Knighton]

Daniel,

Thanks for the heads up on that. Your review was a lot clearer than most of the Amazon reviews.

Definitely something for me to keep in mind. Granted, with my tiny shop, any table saw might be impossible for me ;)

Tom

[glenn bradley]

Daniel, Thanks for posting that. It pretty much goes along with several reviews on Amazon. It just shows that you can't buy something based on brand name alone. At certain price points a lot of junk is out there no matter whose name is on it.

Alan speaks true. We are beyond the point of brand loyalty in our world. Just shop the best of breed.

[Steven Wilson]

I haven't seen any of the small portables that would tempt me to buy one if I ever needed it. I would seriously consider a Festool circular saw / MFT setup before one of those.

[Matthew Voss]

The expectations of these saws are too high. I bought the Jet for jobsite use, and it has been a good compromise between cut quality and portability. I've had the saw for 14 months and it has performed flawlessly. I have mine in a Rousseau stand with t-style fence, but the fence was acceptable and the saw has been great for all-around carpentry use. The saw has a poly v-belt spinning the arbor shaft so the cut is very smooth and relatively quiet (compared to the Makita) and the saw is light @ 50 lbs (compared to the Bosch). I got tired of lugging the Bosch in and out of the truck. The Dewalt 745 is popular for the same reason.

That being said, these benchtop saws are not in the same class as a contractor saw with induction motor, full size cast iron top, commercial fence, much less a cabinet saw. These saws are designed to meet specific needs in the marketplace, but shouldn't be compared to the power and accuracy of cabinet saws used to make fine furniture. Apples and oranges...