Sharpening methods -

[John Dykes]

Hello all -

Bit of a newbie here - and to hand tools in general... I have 3 nice planes (1930's #7, LN LA Block, LN #4) - and a nice chisel set. I've finally learned to "buy once..."

I've come from "Hand tools suck, who could use this stupid plane (the LN #4!!)" to "I'd rather push a plane than push a button." The key for me is in the sharpening of the tool. That said, I've invested in Shapton stones - and, while still learning, I really like them.

The lowest grit Shapton I have is a 320. Which I have trouble establishing a primary bevel on. I have a granite slab and sandpaper, but that is a bit tedious and running through so much paper bugs me for whatever reason.

I've researched and studied grinders, stones, and inverted sanders - but I'm on the fence on which way to go. The SS method has me leary of the belt sander method, but many seem to think that might be as good or even superior to the grinder (Leonard Lee being one of them...).

I also understand the grinder pieces a bit better (leaning towards the imported Woodcraft grinder, swapping in a Norton 60 grit stone, and the Veritas tool rest). I don't even know where to start on the inverted sander...

Starting from scratch, with limited experience - where should I be headed? And if the belt sander method - any recommendation on sanders?

Thanks and regards,

jbd in Denver

[Wiley Horne]

Hi John,

You're gaining momentum down the slope, all right!

I'm all in favor of hollow grinding, however, something is amiss. You should be able to get a primary bevel on your A2 irons (or the Stanley vintage iron) with the Shapton 320. Or a Shapton 1000 for that matter, provided the bevel is not out of shape. I would suggest getting the stone technique down pat, even if you do intend to pursue the hollow grind. After all, you will still have honing to do, after the hollow grind.

If you don't mind my asking, how are you going about presenting the blade to the sandpaper-on-granite? With a jig? Freehand?

Wiley

[Cliff Rohrabacher]

Belt sanders are great. I use a belt that's made for metal (lasts lots longer) and I use the drum of the sander for a concave grind which I clean up on a stone.

I'm not a fan of lots of stones. I go from the sander to the norton oil stone using only the fine side and I'm keen.

[John Dykes]

Momentum is right.... Tonight I just won my first ebay auction. A bit scary, but it looks like a nice 1930's #5.

I have the Veritas jig and the Ellipse per the David Charlesworth videos. I first tried to establish the initial bevel on the Shapton 320 using the Ellipse, but dug a groove in the stone faster than I could cut a bevel. Given the cost of the stone, that scared me away from too much hard shaping on those stones. Again - pleading ignorance in this process....

I like the thought of using stones to cut or reshape a bevel - and I'm not too keen on the hollow bevel idea (Not sure why to be honest). I would gladly buy the 120 or 220 Shapton if I thought that would work. It just seems like I pushed and sweated on that #7 iron and didn't get very far.

But to answer your question - I now use the Veritas jig on the granite. As I get the basics down, I'll work towards the Charlesworth Ellipse method (as my #4 still has hard corners...).

Thanks for the feedback,

jbd in Denver

[Wilbur Pan]

One thing to keep in mind when using the Shaptons is to let the stone do the work. You really don't have to push down all that hard. I sharpen plane blades and chisels free hand, and I try to keep just enough pressure to make sure that the tool stays in contact with the surface of the waterstone.

The other thing to watch for when establishing a primary bevel on a waterstone is to make sure you keep checking that the stone is flat as you work on it. I've found the Shaptons to get softer the lower in grit you go, so it's easy to be sharpening along on a low grit stone and then find that your stone is now concave and has put a convex surface on your tool. I have a set of Shaptons (1000, 5000, 8000) and when using the 1000, I do a reflattening touch up every 5 minutes or so.

Whatever grits you use, ideally you'll be doing most of your sharpening on the first stone, as that stone is going to extablish the first sharp edge and bevel shape. Assuming you've been able to keep your bevel flat by making sure your stone is flat, you'll zip through the rest of the grits relatively quickly, since they won't have to do any reshaping of the blade surface.

Having said all that, when I need to do some major work on a tool, like changing the bevel angle, or getting rid of a nick, I'll use either a granite slab and coarse sandpaper, or a grinder.

[Eddie Darby]

I've finally learned to "buy once..."

The key for me is in the sharpening of the tool. That said, I've invested in Shapton stones - and, while still learning, I really like them.

Starting from scratch, with limited experience - where should I be headed? And if the belt sander method - any recommendation on sanders?

I am glad that you made it over the learning curve hump!:eek:

Not many do!:rolleyes:

Buy the Best and forget the Rest!;)

If you are looking for a method to grind steel away quickly by hand, then I would suggest diamond stones, for the coarser grits.
I use the DMT 10" x 4" xcoarse/coarse stone. It doubles as a flattener of my waterstones until I get the lapping plate from Shapton. ( only for finer stones )

Once you get to the 1,000x grit sharpening, go to your Shapton stones.

For A2 I would look into the Shapton Glass Stones next time you are buying.

I'm at a loss as to why your 320x is not working unless it has a glazed surface? I would try refreshing the surface first if it is the problem.

[Marcus Ward]

This is what I've been using to set the bevel on my blades:

http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=90045

if I had to do it over again I would have bought this, and probably will later:

http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=93981

Yeah, it's cheap HF stuff, but you're beveling blades, not replacement heart valves. :)

My 2 cents.

[John Dykes]

Eddie -

I got the DMT coarse \ xcoarse a few days back. And yes, it's plenty to establish a bevel. Thanks for the advice.

I'm also using it to flatten the Shaptons - and have since tossed the Norton flattening stone. It startled me to see how badly out of shape the waterstones were.... :\

Thanks again,
jbd