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Keith Outten
12-18-2007, 9:42 PM
Last weekend our System Administrator Aaron Koehl created a script for Corel Draw that provides a button on the tool bar for inserting Grade II Braille.

Aaron's script provides an input box to type in the necessary text and then creates Grade II Braille directly in the drawing. It is very slick and has already saved me a lot of time over the last couple of days on a project I am working on at CNU.

The braille interpreter program is public domain software but it is old and needs to be updated. Aaron mentioned that he could rewrite the interpreter and make some improvements. If there is anyone interested and would be willing to shuck Aaron a few bucks for his work when it is finished we might be able to persuade him to write the new program and distribute it here at The Creek.

Anyone interested?

.

Pat Kearney
12-18-2007, 10:14 PM
Keith, sounds interesting.

Just so I understand properly, I type a word in an input box in Corel Draw, it then appears as braille in the drawing, and I can laser engrave that? If that the case then I am definitley interested. What's Grade 2 braille?

How much do you think we need to chip in?

Joe Pelonio
12-18-2007, 10:37 PM
I'm in for sure.

Keith Outten
12-19-2007, 6:06 AM
Keith, sounds interesting.

Just so I understand properly, I type a word in an input box in Corel Draw, it then appears as braille in the drawing, and I can laser engrave that? If that the case then I am definitley interested. What's Grade 2 braille?

How much do you think we need to chip in?

Pat,

You get a button on your Corel Tool Bar that opens an input window. Type in the text or number you need and click the generate button, thats all it takes. Grade II Braille is required on all ADA signs by the Federal Government. It is a bit cryptic compared to Grade I Braille because there are abbreviations for things like ing and tion.

Aaron's script automatically formats the braille as 24 point and centers it in the drawing. Aaron has offered to edit his script so that Braille that is selected will be edited in the box automatically rather than having to delete the entry. If no braille is selected then a new entry is created. This would make it a bit easier to edit signs when you use a template which is how I make them at CNU. I am working on 118 door signs for our new library right now, the script saved me hours over the last couple of days and reduces errors.

The old DOS program that Scott found on the Net worked but it was slow and required me to cut and paste then convert the entry to artistic text then to braille then edit the point size. Lots of steps have been eliminated and the possibility of making errors other than spelling are gone forever :)

How much? I guess it depends on how many people are interested in the new program. We can spread the cost out among a large group is should be very reasonable. I will send Aaron an email and see if he has a number in mind.
.

Mike Ross
12-19-2007, 9:50 AM
Hi Guys, This sounds like a great tool and I would throw a few dollars in the pot.

Mike Ross

Ron Thompson
12-21-2007, 6:29 PM
I haven't needed yet, but if I ever do ..........................

I'd be interested.

Ron in San Jose

Scott Shepherd
12-21-2007, 7:05 PM
Yup, I'm interested, providing it's not 3 of us forking up all the cost.

Ed Lang
12-22-2007, 7:42 AM
I have never needed to use such a thing, but would pitch in a bit to have the option if I needed it.

Scott Challoner
12-22-2007, 1:33 PM
I'm with Ed. I don't have a current need, but I see myself moving more into signage. Can I make braille with my laser?

Scott Shepherd
12-22-2007, 8:26 PM
Yes Scott, you can. Easier in some materials than others. Corian appears to be very easy, while acrylics are more challenging. It's not the easiest thing you'll do (or the most fun), but it's certainly something you can do. I do them in Rowmark materials. You'll earn your money on those days, gluing and inserting every single ball.

Keith Outten
12-22-2007, 9:43 PM
Aaron came by my shop this evening and edited his script to add the features I needed, basically the ability to click on existing braille and edit it directly. Works even better than before :)

I told him about this thread so he will be posting something here soon.

.

James Rambo
12-24-2007, 4:03 PM
Is the braille that is produced with this 'to be' program what could be used in public places like hospitals and such type of buildings? (Sorry if this is a dumb question but I dont do braille now) If it can I would be in for it since I make a few signs for the hospital I work for every month.

Keith Outten
12-26-2007, 8:41 AM
James,

Yes, this method of producing braille meets the federal guidelines for ADA signs. I use a laser engraver to make the braille holes in my door signs and get a perfect friction fit so I don't have to mess with glue. This is possible when you use Corian or plastic for your substrate and acrylic braille balls. The coefficient of expansion of the two materials being so close allows the no glue technique. If you were using wood as a substrate and acrylic braille balls you would need an adhesive.

I have engraved over 80 door signs at CNU in the last few days using Aaron's Corel Draw script and I have forty more to complete by tomorrow. I have been able to engrave all of the door signs using just one template editing it for each individual sign because I can edit the template faster than the engraver can produce them (an average 8 minute engraving time and about 3 minutes for cleaning with a brush afterwards). Now that I have a fast and accurate means of editing the braille I don't need to save hundreds of sign drawings, just the template for each building. I can start the engraver, edit the template for the next sign and brush the last blank that was engraved and be ready to replace the sign blank before the laser is finished. When all of the plaques are engraved I cut the letters from 1/16" thick plastic and start gluing in the letters and installing the braille balls. My system is based on volume or production runs and gets the time per door sign down to just minutes per sign which includes producing the plaques on my router. At $45.00 each daily production runs of 20 to 40 door signs are possible so it is profitable work :). Material costs are less than $7.00 per sign.

I have been working for months shaving minutes and seconds here and there trying to get my time as low as possible per sign. I have refined my technique several times reducing the time per sign to 50% of the time required when I first started. I think I can get the time even lower by changing a few more steps and by routing the hanger keyholes on the ShopBot. I have been machining the keyhole hangers on my bench drill/mill on the door signs I have made so far. If I had a youngster to glue the letters and insert the braille balls I'm sure I could double my production rate and reduce my cost per sign even further.

Aaron's script is a painless solution to a tough task that I have to do almost every day. Saving me a couple of minutes per sign will produce big savings this year alone.

Aaron is willing to provide just the script which would be very affordable and it works perfectly. The free braille interpreter from NIB, although it is old hasn't been a problem for me.

.

Stephen Beckham
12-27-2007, 7:36 AM
Keith - I've only had one request to do a sign with Braile in it on Romark Plastic. I know she will be coming back, they were just inquiring - so I will need it eventually.

I know there are more opportunities in the local area so I'd offer it as an by line in a couple ads to get the word out that now a local guy can do it as well...

I'm in on the chip-in...

Keith Outten
12-27-2007, 9:10 AM
Stephen,

The last time I looked at my local phone book there were hundreds of sign shops in my area but very few offered ADA signs so the competition drops considerably when you offer ADA work.

The goal is getting the word out that you are able to provide superior ADA signs, an alternative to the same old industrial looking acrylic signs that we have all grown used to seeing in public buildings. You can contact your local building contractors to let them know you are willing to provide a superior product for the same price they are paying for traditional ADA signs. Drop off a couple of samples to show them your product quality and in a short period of time you will have more work than you can imagine. Nothing better than a steady stream of profitable work to improve the bottom line.

I don't advertise, I respond to "Requests for Bids" these days and two jobs per year is all it takes to make me happy. Its true I work for CNU full time now but two commercial sign jobs is very close to my annual salary as a state employee and is only about 3 months work part time. I have invested serious capital in my shop and equipment over the years so it isn't as though you can just get your shovel out and fill your bank account. There is some hard work involved as well but the payback is very quick and the profit margin is the best I have ever seen. I wish someone would have told me years ago that this kind of work was so profitable and so plentiful.

I have also stopped engraving for the public altogether, haven't engraved a photograph in so long I doubt I could provide the service if I had to :)

.

Kevin L. Waldron
03-07-2008, 11:38 PM
I thought that Flexisign Pro 8 already had this feature. I don't own a laser yet but according to the manual it is possible to cut this without having to drill or burn holes and insert balls. The laser cuts the background out and leaves the points high.

Kevin

Keith Outten
03-08-2008, 10:06 AM
Kevin,

There are some high end programs that offer this feature built-in I am told. Aaron has created something that really works well and is inexpensive that works in Corel Draw which most of us already own and use on a daily basis.

Aaron has been working on his program and has written a new engine with some improvements. I don't know what his timetable is for making his new Braille Interpreter available but I will probably be the first to do a live test and will let everyone know :)

The problem I have seen with signs that don't use Braille balls is the the tops are rarely round which is required by the ADA. Also the area clear isn't very smooth and I doubt it would meet the same quality standards that are possible by inserting smooth acrylic balls. I know it is a little more work but the results are worth the effort. All of the signs at CNU were made the way you suggested, we are changing them now to a more attractive sign design that is also more durable.

.

Kenneth Hertzog
03-08-2008, 2:01 PM
Hi Keith

My sign shop is still in the infant stage but is growing every day.
this is something that i'm sure is needed and will be an asset
I'm in
Just let me know how much and when
ken

Brent Vander Weil
03-09-2008, 5:26 PM
Have not done any braile work as of yet, but definately interested... I too am not sure how it is done... Do you laser away the entire backround to leave just the braile "bumps" ... I noticed mention of gluing little balls into the holes... Is this how it's done, on another option? Sorry but I must plead total ignorance in this type of signage production... but if I can do the work I am in for a few bucks to make life easier and I would rather a friend of the creek get the money...

Keith Outten
03-13-2008, 2:58 AM
Brent,

There are many ways of making Braille signs. The technique I am using is based on 1/2" thick Corian plaques, I engrave the text and Braille holes to 1/32" deep then glue the letters into the cavities with CA glue. The letters and numbers are laser cut from 1/16" thick plastic sheet, the ADA standard requires the tactile text and numbers to be raised 1/32" from the plaque surface. The Braille balls are basically 1/16" diameter acrylic balls, I generally glue them into the holes using craft glue, CA glue chemically reacts and will melt the acrylic balls.

The picture below isn't the best quality but it might help you visualize this style of door signs. The Braille balls are clear and almost invisible, they are glowing in the picture from the reflection of the camera flash.
.

Aaron Koehl
03-17-2008, 10:58 AM
Brent,

There are many ways of making Braille signs. The technique I am using is based on 1/2" thick Corian plaques, I engrave the text and Braille holes to 1/32" deep then glue the letters into the cavities with CA glue. The letters and numbers are laser cut from 1/16" thick plastic sheet, the ADA standard requires the tactile text and numbers to be raised 1/32" from the plaque surface. The Braille balls are basically 1/16" diameter acrylic balls, I generally glue them into the holes using craft glue, CA glue chemically reacts and will melt the acrylic balls.

The picture below isn't the best quality but it might help you visualize this style of door signs. The Braille balls are clear and almost invisible, they are glowing in the picture from the reflection of the camera flash.
.
You'll also notice that, in the picture above, the braille balls appear to be glowing.
This effect is much more pronounced in person, but the camera was able to capture it to some degree.

The acrylic balls actually produce a very appealing shimmering effect when you walk
by them- a small detail to enhance already nice signs, and add an extra wow factor.

Bob Cole
03-28-2008, 7:00 PM
Any news on the release of the translator? I would be willing to pitch in.

Lonny Meeks
11-26-2008, 9:57 AM
Keith has gotten me interested in signage and I would like to know if this has or will happen?

Keith Outten
11-26-2008, 10:48 AM
Aaron has given up on his new translator, I think he ran into some kind of legal issue. I still think that his script that uses the free NIB translator is valuable, it is the one I use every day and it works perfectly.

I have asked (even begged) Aaron to sell his script here at The Creek for 30 to 40 bucks, it is worth every penny. I rely on his script for every ADA sign I make, it is a one click menu button that pops up a box that you just type in the text or numbers you want. When you hit the OK button the grade 2 braille pops into the Corel Drawing...it can't get any easier. If you want to edit braille that is already in your drawing you select the Braille and then click on the Braille button, you can then enter your new text or numbers.

I have suggested that Aaron create a new Forum here and give access to the forum to people who purchase his script. This would make it easy for him to post upgrades and instructions. Aaron can also customize his script if necessary, he did it for me when we were testing the script last year.

If you want Aaron's script I suggest you bug him to death by sending him Private Messages. It wouldn't take him but a few minutes to place it in a Forum here and make it available.
.

Angus Hines
11-26-2008, 11:06 AM
I PM'd him yesterday begging and pleading and even offering to make a donation to the doctorate fund.

Hopefully he will take your suggestions Keith.


Aaron has given up on his new translator, I think he ran into some kind of legal issue. I still think that his script that uses the free NIB translator is valuable, it is the one I use every day and it works perfectly.

I have asked (even begged) Aaron to sell his script here at The Creek for 30 to 40 bucks, it is worth every penny. I rely on his script for every ADA sign I make, it is a one click menu button that pops up a box that you just type in the text or numbers you want. When you hit the OK button the grade 2 braille pops into the Corel Drawing...it can't get any easier. If you want to edit braille that is already in your drawing you select the Braille and then click on the Braille button, you can then enter your new text or numbers.

I have suggested that Aaron create a new Forum here and give access to the forum to people who purchase his script. This would make it easy for him to post upgrades and instructions. Aaron can also customize his script if necessary, he did it for me when we were testing the script last year.

If you want Aaron's script I suggest you bug him to death by sending him Private Messages. It wouldn't take him but a few minutes to place it in a Forum here and make it available.
.

Keith Outten
11-26-2008, 1:02 PM
I just talked to Aaron on the phone and he has agreed to setup a new Forum here for his script. He said it might take a couple of days but he would make his script available ASAP.

Aaron will setup a PayPal link which will give you access to the files in his new Forum.
I'm sure any income he can realize from his script will be welcome, it costs money to be a full time student :)
.

Scott Shepherd
11-26-2008, 3:11 PM
I've seen the script, it really is excellent.

Bob Cole
11-26-2008, 5:42 PM
Good news.

Thank you for following up. Would be good to help out a fellow creeker.

Doug Bergstrom
12-01-2008, 8:44 AM
I would be interested.

Angus Hines
12-01-2008, 11:20 AM
Is it going to be a new forum or a sub-forum of this one just curious as to where to watch for it appear !:)


I just talked to Aaron on the phone and he has agreed to setup a new Forum here for his script. He said it might take a couple of days but he would make his script available ASAP.

Aaron will setup a PayPal link which will give you access to the files in his new Forum.
I'm sure any income he can realize from his script will be welcome, it costs money to be a full time student :)
.

Keith Outten
12-01-2008, 12:19 PM
Angus,

Aaron's Forum will be in the Manufacturers Forums area near the bottom of the main page.
.

Larry Bratton
12-07-2008, 9:41 AM
Now that I sold my Vision rotary to Keith...I really really need this script. Mr Outten, during his personal visit yesterday, with his lovely wife Jackie, has convinced me that I need to be headed into Corian signage. Keith is very passionate about his product and process, to the point that he even got my wife interested in making Corian pens. She already has all the tools including the lathe, so hopefully he built a sufficient fire there to get her going. Anyway, it was great meeting Keith and Jackie, we had a great conversation!

Ray Uebner
12-08-2008, 2:50 PM
Hi
I have never used it to this date nor needed it but think it would open up some new doors. Count me in I would be willing to have that option.

Keith Outten
12-08-2008, 3:52 PM
I was able to talk to Aaron on the phone this afternoon about his script. Aaron has a project he is working on with a serious deadline but....he promised that as soon as he could get a few minutes he was going to create his new Forum here and upload his script and the instructions.

I am beating him about the head and shoulders every chance I get so he doesn't forget to get this done and I will continue until he is bloody if that is what it takes :)

Tomorrow I will threaten to take away his next five birthdays.

Wednesday I will get serious :)

.

Angus Hines
12-08-2008, 4:12 PM
I see they are training him right there, in Doctorate school. I have yet to meet a doctor that could maintain a schedule.

Scott Shepherd
12-08-2008, 6:19 PM
Maybe if you tell him that there will be loads of little blind kids who can't find their way through buildings until he posts the script?

Poor little kids......and all because Aaron is so selfish that he thinks studying is far more important than helping the kids.

Shame....shame.....shame. Come on Aaron, do it for the kids :D

Keith Outten
12-19-2008, 6:49 AM
Yesterday was Aaron's deadline for his latest projects so this morning he should have some time to get to his list of things to do that are not related to William and Mary :)

He is on Christmas break until after the first of the year now...we shall see :)
.

Angus Hines
12-19-2008, 8:58 AM
LOL, but which list will he start with, his SMC To-Do list or the Honey-do list:)

Aaron Koehl
12-30-2008, 1:52 AM
LOL, but which list will he start with, his SMC To-Do list or the Honey-do list:)
Angus,

I think you're on to something! Yes, my latest semester has been incredibly time consuming, more than I could have ever imagined, but on the bright side it has finally come to an end. Of course, now comes along all of the other projects I haven't been able to do for the past four months!

I have the script in hand and I am testing to make sure it will work for Corel X4/Vista. I am also putting together an installer. I know it works for X3, and Corel 12, although I will need Keith to test it once more.

Hopefully, with some feedback, I'll be able to make improvements to the software. To reference an earlier post, I decided to write a grade 2 Braille engine from scratch--it's a very complicated problem; thesis-worthy. The most popular translators today are based on some research done back in the late 70's. By last August, my translator was successful to about 98% accuracy, using a newer method, but the last 2% will likely require considerable changes and some consultation with a trained human Braille translator to answer some outstanding questions of mine.

That said, the script I am releasing is based on a very accurate grade 2 Braille translator. If I get enough support, I will certainly continue development on the Corel script based on any feedback, and may pursue further development of my other translator.

The new script will be available sometime tomorrow.

Angus Hines
12-30-2008, 7:50 AM
GREAT looking forward to it Aaron. Wish I could remember the name but there is a huge company in Stuart FL that creates just translators of diffrent types for the blind.
If I remember I'll PM you with the info.

Bob Cole
01-02-2009, 8:12 PM
That is great Aaron. I look forward to supporting your efforts.

Angus Hines
01-06-2009, 2:48 PM
Angus,

The new script will be available sometime tomorrow.


Oh Aaron you've got to be the hardest person in the world to give money to.....LOL. I got 49.95 burning a hole in my pocket for this.

Were all still waiting with baited breath.....hoping all those poor blind children don't walk into a janitors closet somewhere :eek:

Aaron Koehl
01-06-2009, 3:52 PM
Been working on it all day-- I found that the code will not currently work with 64-bit version of Vista, and so I am currently adding some routines to allow that to work, but it requires some recompilation in a separate development environment. Also making some changes and adding some error detection, since the original was written specific to Keith's setup-- better to make these updates up front!

Larry Bratton
01-06-2009, 7:55 PM
Me too! Let me know when to send the money!
(as I no longer have the Vision machine..I sold it to Keith)

Angus Hines
01-06-2009, 9:24 PM
Been working on it all day-- I found that the code will not currently work with 64-bit version of Vista, and so I am currently adding some routines to allow that to work, but it requires some recompilation in a separate development environment. Also making some changes and adding some error detection, since the original was written specific to Keith's setup-- better to make these updates up front!

LOL YAY Vista F's it up again...Go Bill G. Thanks for getting it right to begin with. However error detection can come later in an update. I don't mind going through versions to eventually get it exact it's a godd way to to build stuff beta it then make the upgrades as useres find issues.

But yea that Vista thing needs to be on top of the list.

Have fun with the Kitchen project.....Fun ain't it.

Bob Cole
01-14-2009, 5:40 PM
I wouldn't mind getting the non-vista compliant version. I have a sign job that I would love to try it out on.

Larry Bratton
01-14-2009, 6:24 PM
I wouldn't mind getting the non-vista compliant version. I have a sign job that I would love to try it out on.
Yes, NON Vista would suit me just fine too. I'm an XP guy.

Aaron Koehl
01-16-2009, 4:47 PM
It's working for Vista and XP.. I'll set up the forum after dinner tonight.

Lonny Meeks
01-16-2009, 5:38 PM
Thanks for all your work Aaron!!!!

Larry Bratton
01-16-2009, 8:28 PM
It's working for Vista and XP.. I'll set up the forum after dinner tonight.
Aaron, where is it going to be posted?

Angus Hines
01-16-2009, 10:00 PM
WOW You eat'in late tonight.......Very cosmopolitan of you. LOL :D


It's working for Vista and XP.. I'll set up the forum after dinner tonight.

Keith Outten
01-17-2009, 5:48 AM
Larry,

Aaron will setup a new Manufacturers Forum for his Corel Draw Braille Script....sometime in this century :)
.

Angus Hines
01-17-2009, 10:47 AM
LOL I was starting to think that they had cured all the blind people:eek:...and we didn't need Brallie any longer:D

Larry Bratton
01-17-2009, 10:57 AM
Larry,

Aaron will setup a new Manufacturers Forum for his Corel Draw Braille Script....sometime in this century :)
.
Ah..thanks. My hope is for it to be soon..at my age...

Keith Outten
01-18-2009, 6:12 PM
It's Done!

Click Here (http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?t=102008) to go to Aaron's new Software Forum.