Jointer

[Roger Brandel]

I am new to Sawmill Creek and I have a question for all you "old pro's" out there. I am working on devleping a list of tools/equipment for my new woodshop and have run into a dilemma. I am looking to outfit my shop with a 12" jointer, but want some opinion's on the style - parrellelogram or dovetailed table? Also, does anybody have any particular brand preferences?
Any information will be very appreciated.
Thanks,
Roger Brandel

[Jim Becker]

Welcome to SMC!

Honestly, it almost doesn't matter if you are going to be like most folks and never change the cutting depth. Parallelogram type jointers keep the leading edge of the infeed table the exact same distance from the cutters no matter what the depth setting is. But if you don't change it...it's not going to vary, anyway. So pick the machine you like the best and fits your budget.

As a one-person shop, I also made the decision a few years ago to go with a jointer/planer combo, rather than separates. Better space utilization for me and the quality of my machine (a Mini Max) is outstanding. Mine is ~14" (350mm) but typical sizes are 12", 14", 16" or 20", with the investment going "very North" as you get up to that top size range.

[keith ouellette]

I have had both parallelogram and dove tail and think the para. is a lot easier to set up. If your tables are out of wack all you have to do is turn some bushings (4 on each table) and reset the tables. You can tilt them towards and away from the fence and move the front or back of each table up and down independently. With a dove tail all you can do is shim it.
Go parallelogram.

[Roger Brandel]

Thanks Jim. I have also been looking at the jointer/planer combo's but was a little fearful about accuracy? Much more moving parts on something that normally should not move much. Your thoughts/experience?
Roger

[Jim Becker]

Dead on accurate, Roger. They had better be considering the investment!

Seriously, most of made of precision welded steel with cast iron tables. I actually consider them to have less moving parts than the equivalent separates...remember, they share a cutter head and drive systems for both functions. MM, Felder/Hammer, etc., all make fine machines. There are also 12" units available now from the more mass-market oriented names, such as Jet and Grizzly.

[George Bregar]

I just picked up a used Delta 6" DJ-20, and was using a 6" Jet. Go with the parrellelogram, but if I felt the need for a larger jointer, I would actually go along with what Jim suggests, a combo. Also, beyond how the beds are adjusted, I think bed length is more critical.

[Steve Kohn]

I have the 12 inch Grizzly with parallelogram beds. The extra width is nice but really find the length (approximately 7 foot) has taken my work to the next level.

I have not looked carefully at the combo machines but aren't they pretty limited on bed length?

[keith ouellette]

The thing I don't like about the combo ( I owned one on a combination machine
but the planer jointer was typical) are the short beds and the limited planer width. They are pretty expensive once you go past 12"in. If thats all the planer you need then fine but if you decide you want a lager planer....
I originally didn't think a jointer past 8" was very necessary till someone on the creek explained the benefit.

[Jim Becker]

Interestingly, I (and quite a few others based on other threads) have not found the bed length on the combos to be a real limitation. It's even rare that I need to flatten a very long board anyway, but when I have, there have been no problems. I work my lumber in steps...skimming to understand what's "in there" and that's often done before the material goes into "inventory", componentization where the material is rough cut to size and then jointing flat and planing to thickness. In this manner, I don't wish for a longer machine in any way. What I do get a lot of satisfaction out of is the wider bed...I use it all the time, particularly to slightly skew a workpiece while feeding it over the knives for a shearing cut. Totally eliminates tear out and gives a very nice surface that requires less sanding at the lower grits for finish. It's been rare that I needed to thickness plane something wider than my machines capacity, too. (13.6" - 350mm) 99% of the time, what goes through it is substantially narrower and I can still take advantage of the skewing technique.

[Roger Brandel]

Thank you all for the valuable information that you have shared with me. I have learned a lot and it will help in making a decision. I will let you know what I go with in my shop development.

Thanks,

Roger

[Al Willits]

Just curious, Rog mentioned to me that 3k for a joiner might be a bit more than he wanted to spend, so I mentioned the Steel City 8" units, website shows two units, A 8" Deluxe and a 8" Industrial.

They seem to have the same motor/cutters/etc?

Any major differences a hobbiest might consider?

Al

[Cliff Rohrabacher]

I change cut depth quite frequently.

[Steven Wilson]

Roger, more important than the table type (parallelogram or dovetailed) is the type of cutterhead you have. A quickchange head (i.e. Tersa or simmilar) or indexable carbide insert head (i.e. Byrd) is a great improvement over the typical old school cutterhead that you need to realign your jointer knives whenever you change blades.

[Chris Padilla]

Thanks Jim. I have also been looking at the jointer/planer combo's but was a little fearful about accuracy? Much more moving parts on something that normally should not move much. Your thoughts/experience?
Roger

Roger,

I have the FS41-Elite, 16" J/P from MM. I have to tell you, there something NICE about having a jointer and a planer of the same width. Wide planers are cheap...wide jointers are not. However, the cost of that sucker is around ~6k and not easy for most to digest but for the quality and longevity thus far, this machine ought to last a long, long time and pay for itself many times over...well, at least that is how I sold it to the wife! ;)

[Eddie Darby]

Let's say you want to buy a jointer, as well as a planer, and you buy a top end bench top planer at around $600 or thereabouts.

I see that the Jet JJP-12 combo is selling for $1,700.

1700 minus 600 leaves 1100.

Where are you going to get a new 12" jointer for $1,100 ???:confused:

Saves space.
One head only to upgrade if you decide to go spiral.
One knife change does both machines.
One set-up for both jobs, which are usually done together at the same time.
One dust system for shavings.

Any way that you slice it, there are a lot of ups to the combo side of things.