Basic tablesaw use tips?

[Sean Havins]

Hi Folks,

I am the proud owner of a new Jet JPS-10TS table saw. I have never used a table saw before and need some safety pointers before I start the big project this weekend.


I did some test cuts on some small pieces while I was checking the setup and could not come up with a comfortable way of clearing the small piece of wood that is held next to the spinning blade by the blade guard after I made my cut. Do I just flick it with a pusher stick?
I need to rip a truck load of plywood flooring and thinner ceiling panels from 8 X 4 to 8 X 2. I have two support stands with ball bearings on top to take the cut sheets. What is the best position to hold the 8 X 4 sheet of plywood to feed it in to the table saw? Should I hold the rear corner farthest from the fence so I’m not standing directly in front of the blade and can push the panel against the fence as I feed it in?
Does anyone knows of a good source of this type of info that I can lay my eyes on quickly? Or Can i just keep the questions coming here as they occur to me?
Thanks for your time.


Sean

[Chuck Lenz]

Sean, maybe this link will answer your questions, there are two pages. http://www.woodcraft.com/articles.aspx?articleid=317 I'm sure your allways welcome back if you have more questions.

[Al Willits]

I shut the saw off if in doubt, I've launched enough wood alreay that its much easier to stop the saw than take a chance, as your skills increase you may find ways to remove them small scraps from next to the blade, but either way be careful.

I give up trying to cut large sheets of plywood on a table saw, to easy to feed incorrectly and with out a riving knife/splitter I find I can launch even more wood at a very high rate of speed.

I picked up the EZ Smart system or ya can use a straight edge and a circular saw to cut down to a manageable size.

Al...who has a better lauch record than NASA

[James Hart]

Sean,

As the proud new owner of a big saw, you probably don't want to hear this.
I think if I were you, I'd use a straightedge, a circular saw and a big sheet of foam insulation. .
I have significant infeed and out feed support ( a 3' X 5' table infeed and 4' X 3' rollers out), board buddies on the fence and 26 years experience on and off pushing wood through a saw.
My first choice would be to ask the supplier to rip it on a panel saw.
Second choice, and this wouldn't be the case without all the support stuff, would be to rip it myself.
Third would be a circular saw.
This strikes me as a really poor project to learn how to use a bigger saw.

Jim

[Ted Jay]

Hi Folks,

I am the proud owner of a new Jet JPS-10TS table saw. I have never used a table saw before and need some safety pointers before I start the big project this weekend.


I need to rip a truck load of plywood flooring and thinner ceiling panels from 8 X 4 to 8 X 2. I have two support stands with ball bearings on top to take the cut sheets. What is the best position to hold the 8 X 4 sheet of plywood to feed it in to the table saw? Should I hold the rear corner farthest from the fence so I’m not standing directly in front of the blade and can push the panel against the fence as I feed it in?


Sean

SOunds like a good excuse to buy a panel saw... as if an excuse is needed!!!:D

[George Bregar]

Doesn't sound like you will have any small pieces if you will just be ripping sheets in half, but I would suggest just turning off the saw and then removing small cut-offs near the blade when it comes to a complete stop. Getting that stick or cut-off into the blade can send them flying. Not good.

As far as ripping plywood, your technique sounds about right, until you get near the end. At that point continue to push the one piece to the fence side into the fence but not the off side. I would only to this if you have an extension table to support the sheet on the rear of the saw...sounds like you do.

Here is a good link with specifics http://www.waterfront-woods.com/Articles/Tablesaw/tablesaw.htm

Good side up on the table saw.

Edit: I see you have a "truck load." I would also have the supplier cut it.

[Bas Pluim]

I bought the exact same saw, and as great as it is, I would not rip full sheets of plywood on it. At least not by myself, rollers or not. A circular saw and a straightedge are much safer. With a large outfeed table, and a secondary table/ bench for horizontal support...maybe.

As far cutting small pieces (or anything for that matter), do a google search on "Niki good day table saw". That should give you all the info you need.

Bas.

[Brian Kent]

Sean,

As the proud new owner of a big saw, you probably don't want to hear this.
I think if I were you, I'd use a straightedge, a circular saw and a big sheet of foam insulation.

Jim

What is the big sheet of foam insulation for? Is that the support for the plywood that a circular saw would cut part way through?

[Al Willits]

Yes, (I think) you set the saw up so it just cuts the plywood and you'll just go into the foam maybe a 1/4" or so.
I've used 2x2's" the same way, but you set them to support the plywood but out of the way of the blade.

Al

[James Hart]

What is the big sheet of foam insulation for? Is that the support for the plywood that a circular saw would cut part way through?


Yes. I lay a full sheet, at least 2" thick, on the garage floor. Clamp on the straightedge, set the circular saw to cut through the plywood about 3/4" then cut.

There's a video of this on Woodsmith's site, www.woodworkingonline.com (http://www.woodworkingonline.com), it's the video with their top 10 favorite tips of all time.

JIm

[Allen Bookout]

This is the best video that I have seen regarding the information that you are seeking: http://www.rockler.com/product.cfm?page=16790

I have the video and it is well worth the small cost.

[Allen Bookout]

I have both a cabinetsaw and the EZ. I see no problem with using the cabinetsaw for cutting up full sheets of plywood. Some people get tunnel vision regarding such things. If you do not like the way the operation goes using the cabinetsaw THEN find another way to do it.

[Thom Sturgill]

I also have the same saw.
Get some help if you don't have more support for large sheets and make it a priority to make a large enough outfeed table to support the weight and length of the material. Mine gives me an almost 4ft past the rear fence rail and I would still hesitate to push a 3/4" sheet of ply through (though I have done it:rolleyes:)

As to the small pieces - turn the saw off and wait for the blade to stop, THEN use that push stick. Also make a zero clearance throat plate. Due to the size, the pre-made ones available at Rockler and Woodcraft will not work. Rockler's phenolic blanks are even too short. I found longer blanks at McFeeleys.

[Ben Grunow]

I like an outfeed table as the stands can fall over with cupped sheet s of ply.

At the very least wax the TS top so they slide easily (johnson's paste wax) and to prevent rust.

I have a festool saw and prefer the TS. More work to handle the sheets, but simpler to me.

Ben

[Lee Schierer]

With regard to your first question. The best way to remove the small scrap pieces next to the blade is to turn off the saw, wait for the blade to stop and then move tehm. Anything else is less safe and could result in an accident. The saw is dumb, it can't tell your fingers from the wood so don't give it the chance.

On your second question, ripping p[lywood. If your fence moves far enough for the cuts you need then the able saw will work. Roller stands will help, but are still likely to tip at the wrong time. Your best and safest way is to get a helper. Two people on a full sheet of plywood works best.

[Greg Sznajdruk]

Norm on the NYW this past two weekend did a 101 on table saws. He routinely rips 4 by 8 on his saw. I do as well and have no reservations in doing so. The first couple of sheets, I admit were under the watchful eyes of my father.

But that was more years ago than I care to remember.

There are a number of folks who break down sheets with circular saws, bottom line do what you feel safe and comfortable with.

Greg

[glenn bradley]

Do I just flick it with a pusher stick?

--- wait for the blade to stop, then remove the piece.

Should I hold the rear corner farthest from the fence so I’m not standing directly in front of the blade and can push the panel against the fence as I feed it in?--- That's how I do it.

Does anyone knows of a good source of this type of info that I can lay my eyes on quickly? Or Can i just keep the questions coming here as they occur to me?There are various books on table saw techniques and safety. A quick search at Amazon should turn up a bunch. Here's some online stuff:

--- http://www.woodcraft.com/articles.aspx?articleid=317
--- http://www.taunton.com/finewoodworking/SkillsAndTechniques/SkillsAndTechniquesArticle.aspx?id=5298
--- http://www.taunton.com/finewoodworking/subscription/SkillsAndTechniques/SkillsAndTechniquesArticle.aspx?id=29766
--- http://www.taunton.com/finewoodworking/SkillsAndTechniques/SkillsAndTechniquesPDF.aspx?id=2261
--- http://www.taunton.com/finewoodworking/SkillsAndTechniques/SkillsAndTechniquesPDF.aspx?id=2269

[Al Willits]

While some of you experts and Norm have no problems cutting a 4x8 sheet on a table saw, he (OP) says this is his first table saw, you wanna bet Norms been cutting on that saw of his for a long time now??

Can it be done?
Oh hell ya, but how many cuts is he gonna make before he gets good at it, a straight edge and circular saw, which he probably already has, will make straight cuts with little or not problems...well except in my case and I bought the EZ.

Not to mention the cost of good plywood now days, I've been playing with my TS for about a year now and I'd be darned if I'd do a $120 sheet of 4x8 plywood on the saw now, maybe when I get as good as Norm, but till then, nope.

Be interesting to see a show of hands on any who have had problems cutting a 4x8 when they first started...OK raise your hands....I thought so...:D:D

Al

[keith ouellette]

Full sheets of plywood are hard to cut. You need to hold it steady as you push it through and hold it square against the fence. I stand opposite the fence and hold the sheet against the fence with my left hand and push it through with the right. Get a 5/8 4x8 plywood and make a few practice runs first.
Cutting a full sheet is a lot harder than doing a small piece. You will also need two stands in back of the saw and two in front for a full sheet to be stable on and off. A table in front would be even better (make shift 2x4 table)
ALWAYS STAY CONSCIENCE OF WHERE YOUR HANDS ARE!
That will avoid most accidents. You have to concentrate on the cut and your body parts at all times. always stand to the side of the blade (easy in theory) just in case you get the one in a thousand kick back. I had a piece of wood gouge my osb wall pretty good. Untill then I didn't really think a saw would really fire a piece of wood so well.

[David Weaver]

I'll second what some of the others have said. It's something you can do on the TS (the panel cutting). It's hard by yourself, and you're likely to get results you don't like, even if nothing flies across the shop or the wood doesn't fall off roller stands and get dinged up.

With a second person, it's an easy job if you're both on the same page. This is probably the one thing in the shop where having a second person can help the most - from a safety AND from a results standpoint.

[richard poitras]

Try a Gripper push block for the small stuff ...very safe and pushes the pice and cut off at the same time..

[Robert Mahon]

When I cut thin pieces, I always shut the TS off and wait for the blade to stop before I clear the pieces. In fact, I've cut shims as thin as 0.005 inches that way. But, when doing that, I don't cut all the way through the parent stock. Just far enough the get the length I need, shut the TS down, wait for the blade to stop, lever the piece off the table and later crosscut the piece to length. Never, ever try to pull the piece back through a running blade. (ask me how I know this).

That thing is a Super Veg-o-matic. It slices, it dices and it's dumb, dumb dumb! And I've never seen anybody stop a 3 HP machine by hand.

[Allen Bookout]

Be interesting to see a show of hands on any who have had problems cutting a 4x8 when they first started...OK raise your hands....I thought so...:D:D

Al

I am not raising my hand. I did see a good video before I ever did one. With a proper size outfeed table and the correct technique I do not see the problem. I think that the secret is to keep your eyes on the workpiece in relation to the fence, not the blade and good balance so that you are always in control. Correct body position in relation to the workpiece as the piece is pushed through is helpful also.

There are always more ways than one to skin a cat but when I want accurate, repeatable cuts I prefer the tablesaw. I would really prefer a slider but that is a different story.

[Sean Havins]

First off....
Wow.
I really appreciate the fast and detailed responses! As I read through the thread my first thought was "OK, I probably don't want to cut my teeth on 4x8 sheets". My next thought was "Crap. I just spent a weekend assembling and adjusting a TS that I won't use right away." Well, I guess I'll use it on the entertainment center plans I saw in WoodSmith recently.

After reading a bit I called the lumber yard and they'll do the cuts for 25 cents each.

This is good. I can take my time learning the TS. And I'll get a lot of use out of it through the years.

There's enough here in this thread to keep me busy for a while, thanks.

[Paul Joynes]

If you decide to rip the sheets, ensure that you confirm that the fence is parallel with the blade before you start. If the fence is even slightly toed into the blade you could have a kick back and a 1/2 sheet of ply would do some serious damage to you. Also, ensure that your splitter is correctly aligned and the feed pawls are in place before starting.

[Ted Jay]

First off....
Wow.
I really appreciate the fast and detailed responses! As I read through the thread my first thought was "OK, I probably don't want to cut my teeth on 4x8 sheets". My next thought was "Crap. I just spent a weekend assembling and adjusting a TS that I won't use right away." Well, I guess I'll use it on the entertainment center plans I saw in WoodSmith recently.

After reading a bit I called the lumber yard and they'll do the cuts for 25 cents each.

This is good. I can take my time learning the TS. And I'll get a lot of use out of it through the years.

There's enough here in this thread to keep me busy for a while, thanks.

The hardest thing about cutting 4x8 sheets is handling them. Especially if you've got 3/4 MDF or Double sided Melamine, man are they heavy and a pain to manhandle. I ran into the same problem when I build a desk out of both for my son's room, I had to have help. If they were 1/4 or 3/8 thick no problem.
Just use common sense and think safety first in trying to figure out if you can reach that cut-off switch, while trying to hold onto maybe a half sheet of ply waiting for the blade to stop. As Allen said, a good sized outfeed table would come in handy at this time.

[Dave MacArthur]

I've often wished there was a forum here for "basics" like this--it's not actually basic at all, as you can see from reading the cautions here from experienced woodworkers, and there is a lot to learn. The tiniest pressure difference of one hand, between two folks technique, can result in one guy saying "Stop being a baby, cut it!", and another guy saying, "and then the board came flying back and broke my rib".

If we get this much great info from the single basic question of ripping 4x8 sheets on a table saw, think how many hundreds of other topics beginners could benefit from folks experience on?

Remember, in every cut on the TS, there are probably over 100 different variables that folks aren't even discussing here. Size of infeed/outfeed tables, flex in the tables, sturdiness/wobbliness of the saw base, type of blade, type of guard, guard installed or not, type of fence, fence angle to blade (parallel, toed out?), type of surface on the tables, waxed metal or not, thickness of the 4x8, where you stood and what angle you applied pressure as you fed the sheet, height of the blade, speed of feed, whether you paused while feeding or tried to walk it through, type of plywood, voids in plywood that might give a brief accel/decel in feed rate... etc. etc...

You can see that there is a TON-- a TON! of stuff you will NEVER know about how woodworker A is repeatedly able to cut sheets of 4x8 on his TS, while woodworker B recommends against it. However, what you DO know it this: Safety is not about going for it without experience and knowledge, and hoping for the best, hoping to get the same results as the experts, while you yourself acquire working knowledge on all those variables listed above. Your instinct in posting here and asking questions is GREAT! Play it safe, work smaller sheets you can control by yourself, and build your own experience base--safely. The question is NOT "Is it possible to rip 4x8 on a TS safely?", the question is really "Is it likely that I, just starting out with a new TS, will be able to rip 4x8 safely on my TS without either ruining the wood or increasing the risk of injury to myself to a level that would merit doing the cut in a risk-reducing alternative method?"

I think you are wise in your choice ;) Keep up the questions, and welcome!