Finish advice (longleaf pine + oak)

[Neal Clayton]

Hi everyone, I've been searching around a handful of forums and this one seems to be generally more knowledgeable on average than most, so I'm hoping someone can point me in the right direction.

I've decided to strip and naturally refinish all of the woodwork in my 100 year old house. The stripping itself I've worked down to a manageable (albeit still tedious) process of heat gun on the flat surfaces followed by methylene chloride, the question that remains is what to do afterwards stain and seal wise.

1) the doors are a red oak
2) the trim is a longleaf pine, the more visible pieces (window sills, crowns, and exposed ceiling beams for instance) being heart cut boards with considerably more red than the rest.

The question is what type and colors of stains will give me a consistent finish color when all of this is stripped and ready to refinish? Also, what type of sealer should I use? I know some types of lacquers don't play nice with ammonia, and I've got a big picture in my head of a wife or maid (even if they're not mine ;)) years down the line having the bright idea of cleaning the bathroom or kitchen tile with a bucket full of ammonia and ruining the woodwork's finish. What if anything would stand up to such punishment? All of this wood was built to last so it seems like it should be finished to last too, but I don't even know if that's possible or not.

[Todd Burch]

If you go through the trouble of stripping the paint off of your whole house, and then pigment stain that 100+ year old long leaf pine, I will personally come to your house and slap your hand with a ruler. ;)

Pratt and Lambert makes an excellent floor varnish. A polyurethane will give excellent protection, but can look kinda plastic-y. There are yellowing polys and non-yellowing polys. I suspect the wood has a pretty good yellow cast to it already.

Pine doesn't <pigment> stain well. The grain reverses. This means the naturally light areas will be darker and the naturally dark areas won't change color, and you end up with the naturally dark areas (the latewood, aka orange colored wood) being lighter than the earlywood (the what once were light cream colored / white areas).

With the oak, you can stain just fine. A wiped varnish or sprayed lacquer would be my first choices for a topcoat.

BTW, welcome to the Creek!

Todd

[Neal Clayton]

well that was what i was getting at but didn't explain that well ;). yes, yellowing is what it needs. i don't intend to try and make it look like oak or walnut with a stain, but it needs something to give consistency to the base color. there's a variation in the color from board to board.

the sills and crowns and doorframes are quarter cut boards so have significantly more red than the baseboards, for example, which are plain cut and softer, and the base color seems to be a much darker yellow. i've got exposed beams downstairs which probably will be the same thing (much more red than the trim).

so i need some sort of finish that will yellow the softer stuff a bit.

since the original wood was painted and not varnished i don't think there was a concern when they built it for color consistency, and they used plain cuts for the routed trim, and quarter sawn center cuts for flat surfaces and structure pieces. so although it's all from the same tree it has a bit of color variation in the base wood from window to door to baseboard. a more consistent base yellow is what i'd like to achieve.

[Todd Burch]

ML Campbell, and other manufacturers, make products called Toners. Toners equalize variations in color. ML Campbell's Toners must be sprayed, but for as much as you have to do, if you don't have a compressor, you should probably buy one**.

Toners are really a sleeping giant in terms of what can be achieved in wood finishing. Industry knows about them, but most woodworkers don't. If you've ever wanted to reproduce a commercial finish that you saw on a piece of furniture at the store, Toners are how they do it.

Grain variations can be subdued with Toners. Sapwood and heartwood changes can be subdued. Even different kinds of wood, RIGHT NEXT TO EACH OTHER, can be made to look like each other with Toners.

If you've never use a Toner, you've never REALLY experienced what can be done with a wood finish.

Todd

**Matter of fact, I have the perfect one for sale for portable onsite work if you are interested. I bought it to spray a house addition in Houston and have only used it that once.

[Neal Clayton]

yup, you're right, i've worked with wood off and on for 10 years and never heard of such a thing as a wood toner.

that sounds like exactly what i need to play with.

i've actually already hijacked my stepfather's compressor (he's a pipeline inspector, always on the road and never home to use his tools anyways, he won't miss them ;)), so i got that covered.

thanks for the info on the toners though, i'll definitely try that stuff out.

the biggest problem is actually finding scraps. i've talked to floor and cabinet people locally for advice and their first idea is "well bring me a scrap", to which the response is, "well, the wood is near extinct and all i've got is on the wall already" :p. luckily i did manage to score some scraps from a guy back home in new orleans that's been salvaging beams from old buildings after katrina so hopefully i'll have comparable wood to test with next week and can make some progress.