R16/18 Insulated Garage Door?

[Andrew Thuswaldner]

I've been looking at insulated garage doors on-line and at the local HD and I don't get how the units on-line can be R16 and R18? I don't know how to make a 2x4 stud wall anything more than R14 so how do they get an even bigger R value in a garage door? The HD only has doors that are R6.5 and R9 (if I recall correctly). Also, if you have any recommendations for door manufacturers I'd appreciate knowing that too. Thanks!
Andrew

[Greg Pavlov]

IMO, they can't. What's advertised is the theoretical insulation value of the foam in the door, which is probably as high as you're being told, but the overall door assembly is most likely half that at best.

[Rob Will]

I have several insulated steel doors from 10'x8' to 24'x14'.

Per inch of thickness, the "foamed in place" doors have the highest r-value. (various manufacturers, Raynor, Overhead Door, Clopay etc.)

As far as the overall warmest door, that would probably be my 3" thick Raynor Tri-Core doors.

Whatever you decide, be sure to specify insulated glass (not standard on all doors).

If the doors are larger than standard residential garage doors, I like to use 3" track.......but that requires 21" of headroom instead of 15".

IMHO, run away from the borgs as fast as you can on this one. Call some local door companies that do this stuff every day.

Rob

[Andrew Thuswaldner]

Thanks for the input guys! Rob, is your advice on avoiding the borgs about the product or the installation?

[Darryl deHaan]

I just insulalted my basement so I can tell you from research. Foam insultaion has a higher R-value, per inch than batt insulation. Foam gives you R-5 per inch, where batt insulation you can get anywhere from R-3 to R-4 depending on type.

So to answer your question, if you have a 3" door you could achieve a theroetical R-15 with foam. I guess they must have wonderfully thick plastic skins to get another R-3 out of them (to get R-18).

Hope that helps.

Darryl

[Jim Becker]

You can buy R15 fiberglass batts "right now" that will fit in your 2x4 stud walls...there is some behind the guest shower unit in our addition "as we speak".

And for the garage doors, various kinds of foam insulation can provide higher R-Values. Closed cell foam, for example, is R7 per inch. Again, in our addition, we have R19+ in our 2x4 stud walls...with room to spare. It's all about what material is used for the job.

[Greg Pavlov]

I just insulalted my basement so I can tell you from research. Foam insultaion has a higher R-value, per inch than batt insulation. Foam gives you R-5 per inch, where batt insulation you can get anywhere from R-3 to R-4 depending on type.
So to answer your question, if you have a 3" door you could achieve a theroetical R-15 with foam. I guess they must have wonderfully thick plastic skins to get another R-3 out of them (to get R-18).

Hope that helps.

Darryl
... they also must have amazing gasket/seal technology to hit R-18 on the 120-odd feet of joints and gaps on a 22 X 8 foot, 4-section door.

[Mick Zelaska]

I had insulated garage doors with insulated glass installed on my new garage workshop and am amazed at how well they work. At 30 degrees outside temperature and no heater running, I can work in the shop with just a sweatshirt. Of course, I prefer working in a cool (60 degrees) shop.

At the same time, I had insulated garage doors installed on two bays of an existing garage. As a comparrison, with the old non-insulated doors, I could not work in the garage at 30 degrees without supplemental heat. As a matter of fact, I could see my breath. Now, with insulated doors installed, I can work in that same garage in a sweatshirt at 30 degrees.

I know foam has a higher R-Value than fiberglass. I also know that there are some "phantom" items used in calculating advertized R-Values (like inside and outside "air film"). Cutting down on air infiltration is important. I would would pay particular attention to the installation making sure the weatherstipping is tight.

[Eric Gustafson]

As a comparrison, with the old non-insulated doors, I could not work in the garage at 30 degrees without supplemental heat. As a matter of fact, I could see my breath. Now, with insulated doors installed, I can work in that same garage in a sweatshirt at 30 degrees.

That reminds me when used to service a radar on board a C-130 cargo aircraft in the desert winters here in Tucson. It always seemed colder in the plane than out. Something about the aluminum skin of the plane seemed to "radiate" the cold.

[Pat Germain]

I second the advice to stay away from BORGS with buying a garage door. Their installation services are notoriously awful.

I also second that an insulated overhead door makes a HUGE difference. I had a local contractor install one on my garage a few years ago. The un-insulated steel door was just slightly better closed than open; and only because it blocked the wind. Otherwise, it was like a thermal conductor.

A local overhead door installer will likely have a lot more door options to choose from, as well. There are some really slick doors out there these days. :)

[Greg Pavlov]

I had insulated garage doors with insulated glass installed on my new garage workshop and am amazed at how well they work. At 30 degrees outside temperature and no heater running, I can work in the shop with just a sweatshirt. Of course, I prefer working in a cool (60 degrees) shop. ........
We replaced a 50's era wood door with an insulated (2" foam) door, no windows, on our 2 1/2 car garage which shares two walls with our house. Outside temps haven't dropped below high 20's since - global warming is moderating Buffalo's weather, for better or worse - which pulled the inside garage temp down into the 50's, which means that it wouldn't take all that much to heat to a useful working temp. I work down in my basement with the heat registers closed & the low to mid 60's temps feel just right for an active session.

[John Callahan]

Rob, Does your TriCor door work well enough where you don't wish you had a wall in it's place on a cold windy day?

[John Gornall]

I have 3 inch R-16 doors on both ends of my shop and I'm very happy with them. I don't live in a cold place, seldom below freezing, but I do get hit with a strong wind. My shop stays nice and warm. When the wind blows 40 knots the doors move and groan a bit and a little rain gets driven under the bottom of one door. Even on a cold day when I'm in my shop I raise both doors about 6 inches for ventilation. And on good days both ends of my shop are wide open and I often drag machines outside. I really enjoy turning out in the sunshine. I'd much rather have these doors than walls.

[Ken Garlock]

When we built in 2002, I had Overhead Garage Door Co, doors installed. They are the 'Thermacore 490 series (http://www.overheaddoor.com/Product.aspx?pid=66) and are advertised at R-17.5.

I know from experience that the south facing doors can be in the summer sun with the outside air temp over 100 deg. all day, and you can lay your hand on the inside of the door and keep it there as along as you want. You just touch the outside of the same door, and in seconds you will have a burn.

Are they good, yes, but it is like buying tools. Spend more initially, and be happy for a long time.

Oh yes, we have the Overhead Garage Door Phantom model door opener. You can stand under it while operating, and conduct a conversation in a low whisper.

[Rob Will]

Thanks for the input guys! Rob, is your advice on avoiding the borgs about the product or the installation?

Nothing against the folks at the BORG, it's just that this is a VERY technical item to spec and install. In my experience, local door shops have more parts and service. In fact, they probably do installs for the BORG.

Rob

[Rob Will]

Rob, Does your TriCor door work well enough where you don't wish you had a wall in it's place on a cold windy day?

John, my two TriCor doors face away from the prevailing wind. Rob