Check out this rack

[Lewis Cobb]

I have been tinkering around with Sketchup and trying to place a lumber rack in my workshop that gives me the following key features:

1) - leaves space underneath for a bench with chopsaw, etc.
2) - bears most of the weight on the floor
3) - is strong enough for anything - including scraps of steel etc.

Here's the general concept

http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r290/LewisCobb/Lumber%20Rack%20Design/1.jpg

Closer look at the arms & vertical stanchions (I think they are called that)

http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r290/LewisCobb/Lumber%20Rack%20Design/2.jpg

Here's some details:

10' high

2” x 3” x 11 gauge (0.120”) steel box beam for the vertical and horizontal arms
6” x 8” x ¼” steel plate for the braces that connect the arms to the verticals

The braces are welded to the arms, but bolted to the verticals – this way I am able to move things around with additional holes in the verticals later, as well as dismantling the thing for moving someday.

Spacing is 20” on center and the verticals are bolted to horizontal 2x10’s that are in turn lag bolted into the wall (it’s a 2x6 wall)

The arms are 24” in length

There’s a small concrete ledge at the bottom of the sheetrock wall in my shop – the top of the foundation - that juts out from the wall - you can see this in one of the pictures - so the horizontal 2x’s will space the verticals out from the wall to clear this.

Concerns:

One concern I have is how to ensure that the arms will be consistent at 90 degrees to the vertical upon assembly– the holes will have to be dead on for this. One fellow that I know (machinist) suggested that I drive a pin through the ¼ steel braces that in turn bears against the front face of the vertical, and use only one bolt – then it could be shimmed a little to tweak the arm “up”. Not sure I like this idea but may investigate it further.

Anyway, if anyone has any comments or suggestions – fire away. This is in the embryonic stages at the moment (i.e. Sketchup & Coffee)

Thanks for looking,
Lewis

[Ed Peters]

and eliminate the arm fabrication from your project. Set up a ¾" Forstner bit and a guide fence in your drill press and tip the table about 5 degrees. Drill a series of equally spaced holes in your vertical elements along the area you intend to use for storage. Then fasten them to the wall as you originally intende and use ¾" black pipe for your arms. You can slip PVC pipe over it to protect the wood. This is an inexpensive and very reliable format for developing elevated storage space.

Ed

[Lewis Cobb]

and eliminate the arm fabrication from your project. Set up a ¾" Forstner bit and a guide fence in your drill press and tip the table about 5 degrees. Drill a series of equally spaced holes in your vertical elements along the area you intend to use for storage. Then fasten them to the wall as you originally intende and use ¾" black pipe for your arms. You can slip PVC pipe over it to protect the wood. This is an inexpensive and very reliable format for developing elevated storage space.

Ed


Ed - thanks for the tips - If I could find some decent 4x4's around here I would prefer to do that - all the stuff I have seen is just too green and would warp and twist before I even got it into the shop. Mind you I am still keeping my eyes peeled for something decent.

Cheers,
Lewis

[Charles Wiggins]

Lewis,

Looks cool. Did you see the post about Triton racks being on sale at Woodcraft this weekend (http://woodcraft.com/family.aspx?familyid=4793&refcode=75IN11RL)?

Question - do you have your whole shop built in Sketchup? How long did that take? Are you using Pro or free?

[michael osadchuk]

.....take a look at page 185 of Scott Landis' book "The Workshop" for a very cheap/strong wood storage rack that has same overall cantilevered horizontal rack design and a similar version but cheaper, scrap ply brace at the junction of the horizontal and vertical members....... the rack in Landis' version needs access to the overhead joist to anchor the rack....
...... think about whether you need the horizontal 2x10s onto to which you are bolting the vertical members; is there not sufficient "hardpoint" strength for the vertical members at the locations where the 2x6 wall studs are located .....and anchor each vertical member on the (hopefully adjoining) ceiling joist.....

... good luck

[David Duke]

Lewis thats a good looking design and will be extremely strong. Just giving you a heads up though if you haven't bought steel lately.....prices have quadrupled in the last 2 years!!!!!!!!!!

I used the racks available at Woodcraft, not the Triton racks that Charles mentioned but these http://www.woodcraft.com/family.aspx?familyid=3931 they just looked a little stronger than the Triton to me. I have filled mine completely up and there is no sag.

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=21663&stc=1&thumb=1&d=1129058860 (http://www.sawmillcreek.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=21663&d=1121203712)

[Fred Voorhees]

Lewis - immediately upon seeing your sketchup, I thought that you were employing the same design as I use for my wood rack in my shop. I have included two pics to illustrate. In my design, I mounted a 2x6 on the slanted wall portion of my shop just above the kneewall. To this I mounted 2x4 uprights and everything was lag screwed into place. The arms are fabbed up using 2x4's which are scabbed on both sides with 1/2 inch plywood. The 2x4 arms simply butt up against the uprights and the plywood scabs on each side extend past the arm back ends and extend to the back of the uprights. The extended plywood is then bolted through the upright with a heavy bolt. The bolt hole is drilled into the upright so that it snugs the 2x4 arm up tight against the upright. What is nice about this setup is that I have a series of holes drilled up and down the uprights, all aligned so that I can change the height of all of my rack shelves to accomodate different loads. Also, because I mounted the rack away from the kneewall, it allows sheet goods storage behind it.

[Jim Becker]

My suggestion would be to bag those pre-fab tables and build them into the same rack. You can easily cantilever a work surface off the rack supports and that makes storage under the "bench" practical, too. My miter station is built on this principle...storage above and below and no legs to get in the way under the work surface.

You may also want to simplify the individual lumber supports by using iron pipe or extra heavy conduit into drilled holes with a very slight angle back to the wall. Very strong and adaptable. 24" OC is more than sufficient for lumber storage, too...you don't need to go down to 16" OC. Use 3.5" square posts and drill for the supports.

[Matt Meiser]

Based on my experience you don't really need the feet sticking out on the floor as long as the top is tied to substantial structure in the wall. My rack is just bolted between two of the poles in my pole barn and stores a lot more wood than that--and hasn't moved in almost 4 years.

[Lewis Cobb]

Lewis,

Looks cool. Did you see the post about Triton racks being on sale at Woodcraft this weekend (http://woodcraft.com/family.aspx?familyid=4793&refcode=75IN11RL)?

Question - do you have your whole shop built in Sketchup? How long did that take? Are you using Pro or free?


Hi Charles - never saw the Triton units on sale but will take a gawk shortly.

I have been building my shop for the last 3 years off and on. It's a finished room that I added on the back of my garage. The room itself is done and all the electrical, even the insulation, sheetroc and painted. I have my tools in there but nothing on the walls yet and I'm trying to organize it with Sketchup as a guide. I have no clue about what time I have into the Sketchup model but when I am parked in front of the tv with the laptop, I doodle away as my wife watches tv. She considers it as me spending time with her but I get to plan my shop at that the same time :). I have the room all in Sketchup as well as most of the tools that I envision in there many of which I have not bought yet. I'll toss up a .jpg of the "dream" when I get a chance. Based on my progress rate I should have it done by the time I retire in about 15 years ....

Cheers,
Lewis

[Lewis Cobb]

Gents - wow - lots of good ideas. Thanks very much for the tips. I think I saw that Workbench book at the libary the other night when I was diggin around there for ideas. Will have to take another pass later this week.

On the price of the steel - there's a weird little place close by me here that I had priced a few of the things at and it didn't seem to bad, but I hear what is being said about prices of metals going up. If you think steel prices are bad - check out the reels of copper wire at the hardware store lately. All I can say is I am some glad I wired this shop 3 years ago !

Fred - how far are your arms sticking out from the vertical? I was hoping to get 24" on mine - hence the "extreme" approach that I probably can cut back on after looking at your design. I like it.

Jim - Those 2 pre fab'd tables have been nothing but a curse ever since I bought them on 50% off sale years ago. They have been shuffled from the basement to the garage, to the workshop, back to the basement, and now they are out in the workshop again. The cheap thin steel they are made of makes them useless for any serious work as the top can never be really flat - it's too "wobbly". One of these days they are going to go to the end of the driveway with a FREE sign on them - Probably as soon as I build what you have done for your miter station - an excellent approach by the way - thanks.

[Ron Brese]

Lewis you could always glue up some yellow pine 2 x 4s to use as your 4x4s. They would be quite strong and stable once laminated.

Ron

[Bart Leetch]

This rack is made of 2x4 & 1/2" pipe & is 8' long with a header of plywood rabbited into the back & a board the same size rabbited into the back at the bottom. I lag bolted a 2x4 to the wall that the whole thing sets on & lag bolted it top & bottom into each stud.

[Rob Will]

Based on my experience you don't really need the feet sticking out on the floor as long as the top is tied to substantial structure in the wall. My rack is just bolted between two of the poles in my pole barn and stores a lot more wood than that--and hasn't moved in almost 4 years.

Matt is right, and the taller the wall, the less important "feet" actually are.

Rob

[Justin Bukoski]

you guys might be surprised but I use heavy duty shelf track and snap in 20" shelf supports for my lumber rack. I have a significant amount of lumber on there and I have no problems. Paid about $80 for the whole rack and it took me less than 30 mins to install. PM me if you want pics...

[Rich Engelhardt]

Hello,
An alternative suggestion.
Check out any retailers in the area that are folding up.
You can often pick up the store fixtures for pennies on the dollar.
At one time, in another house I lived in, I had two 8' floor standing shelf units I picked up for under $10. ea., complete with an assortment of 12 to 18 in deep shelves. Each shelf was rated for >500# and they had pegboard backs on the racks themselves.

The buyer we sold the house to wanted us to leave them, so we did.

The biggest dawback is that you have to be there when they get down to selling the fixtures, after the merchandise has all been cleared out. That's often a 1 day only event - during the week, seldom if ever on weekends.
Also, the units are often knocked down. If you decide to go this route, make sure you look at the racks closely while they are still up, and make notes of how they go together.
I put up literally thousands of racks during my career in retail. Even with directions and diagrams, they are often tough to figure out.

[Matt Meiser]

That's a good idea Rich. When I was in High School and college I worked for an auto parts store and dealt a lot with those shelving systems. They hold a LOT of weight. The heavy duty track systems are also good for a buy-it and install-it solution. We used some in the office at our old house and it was extremely sturdy when the uprights were screwed to studs.

[Greg Funk]

Lewis,

I think your design looks good but is over-engineered a little. If you can fabricate in steel the benefit is you can use less material than wood. I would try and get away with 3 supports instead of the 6 you have shown. Also I agree with Matt that the bottom supports are unnecessary unless you want to keep your wood off the concrete.

I particularly like the window view you've incorporated into the sketchup drawing - nice touch.

Greg

[Fred Voorhees]

Fred - how far are your arms sticking out from the vertical? I was hoping to get 24" on mine - hence the "extreme" approach that I probably can cut back on after looking at your design. I like it.

I would have to go out and measure them to be exact, but they are something like 15" out from the uprights. Have never had a problem with them.

[Lewis Cobb]

Lewis,

I think your design looks good but is over-engineered a little. If you can fabricate in steel the benefit is you can use less material than wood. I would try and get away with 3 supports instead of the 6 you have shown. Also I agree with Matt that the bottom supports are unnecessary unless you want to keep your wood off the concrete.

I particularly like the window view you've incorporated into the sketchup drawing - nice touch.

Greg


Thanks Greg - that window is the actual view out of that window last winter - I was tinkering with Sketchup and had just learned the trick of painting .jpegs onto surfaces :)

Yes, the bottom supports were done when I was going to have some wood storage down there. depending on how I do the workbench for the chop saw etc., it might not be practical.

My research and tweaking of this design continues. That's the nice thing about Sketchup - you can try all kinds of options and spend no money.

[Jim Becker]

TThat's the nice thing about Sketchup - you can try all kinds of options and spend no money.

Oh, man, do you have the very dark glasses on!! You'll be spending money. No worries on that! :D

[Dan Forman]

Here is another 1/2" pipe and 2x4 rack. Holds lots of wood. Uprights are anchored to ceiling joists and resting on the floor.

http://i98.photobucket.com/albums/l279/T-Caster/P1010695.jpg

Dan

[Jon Lanier]

I'm so disappointed. I thought I was going to see a nice 10 point buck. :(

[Ray Knight]

With the concrete footer ledge, up off the floor a bit, you might want to think about bottom load bearing on that concrete ledge and the wall. The feet on the floor are structurally probably not necessary. That would eliminate corners for dust/trash collection, ease cleaning, and allow roll in tool and stuff storage below. And if you have ready access to welder/metal chop saw then go for steel. You will probably want to paint horizontals well to avoid rust staining stored wood. Looks like it ought to hold anything you want to put on it. Good luck Ray

[Lewis Cobb]

With the concrete footer ledge, up off the floor a bit, you might want to think about bottom load bearing on that concrete ledge and the wall. The feet on the floor are structurally probably not necessary. That would eliminate corners for dust/trash collection, ease cleaning, and allow roll in tool and stuff storage below. And if you have ready access to welder/metal chop saw then go for steel. You will probably want to paint horizontals well to avoid rust staining stored wood. Looks like it ought to hold anything you want to put on it. Good luck Ray


Hi Ray - thanks for the comments. I thought about placing the load bearing verticals on the ledge but there's only a small amount - say 1-2 inches and it varies as you move along the wall. I thought that if there was a crack or a weak part, it might just shear off a piece of the concrete in a couple of places. I know it takes a lot to shear off the concrete but it is a bit narrow in some places.

I actually got a FREE stick welder from my buddy to tinker with a few projects but have yet to light it up. It's not something I have ever done before and I can appreciate that there's a certain art form to it. I'm still going to have a go at it though to try it out. The chop saw is easily borrowed as well. I'm still on the fence on this project - if I could locate some decent wood stock I'd consider building it from lumber, but I have a reasonably cheap source of steel locally that I am able to access so I might just go that route in the end.

Lewis

[Paul Johnstone]

Like the other poster, I went to home depot and got the premade slotted rails you screw to the wall, with the canterlieving shelf supports that slide in. I have about $100 in mine, and it went up in about an hour or so.
Unless you want to have the fun of making one, I think this is the best solution.. gets the wood off the floor and gives you a lot more time to make furniture.