My first woodworking show rant...am I getting too old?

[Nathan Conner]

Sorry in advance if this thing has turned into a philosophical rant and no, I'm not getting too old. In fact, I'll be 35 tomorrow. Perhaps I'm just too jaded by too much time relaxing by myself in the shop.

I went to the Portland Woodworking Show this weekend, hoping to be the proverbial kid in a candy store, hoping to see great techniques and new products and beautiful work. I was hoping to pick up a new hand plane, get some pointers, meet some fellow woodworkers, play with some tools.

What I saw, instead, was a carnival of consumption. Man, that sounds ridiculous, but it was true. This was my first woodworking show, and I expected less flash and pizazz and headsets and "Buy now! Easy terms!" and more...heck, I don't know what I expected. It wasn't what I found.

The saddest thing for me was watching all the demos of the latest, greatest gimmick to make your woodworking life a breeze. Everything from auto-carving machines and $20k laser engraving machines to $5 pieces of foam rubber for your clamp pipes. I listened to a sales pitch for 5 minutes for a $300 miter sled that would "eliminate the need to make test cuts". Yeah, that's right. A $300 miter sled. "HOW MUCH MONEY DO YOU THINK YOU'LL SAVE BY..." seemed to be the mantra everywhere. Everyone was busy signing up for this raffle or that special offer, dragging around new tool catalogs or that 50 lb. bundle of Taiwanese sandpaper. It was like one big Harbor Freight sale. Loads of $15 Forstner sets or $30 paneling bit sets. None of it to last beyond the first use, if that.

I tried to talk with the Lee Valley and Veritas guys about a new plane - my wife said I should pick out any plane in the place as a birthday present - but my heart wasn't in it. I picked them up and played with them a bit on some scraps they had around, but the noise, the hawking, seeing guys hunched over, running for their cars loaded down with bags of crap to go home and throw at their latest project just took the wind out of my sails. My wife and 12-year old were trying to be supportive, but they, too, looked like they were miserable. It was a far cry from what woodworking evokes in me, most days. I left empty-handed, but with a new respect for my own experience woodworking.

It really made me sad for everyone else, though. For me, woodworking is relaxing, enjoyable pastime. It's the sound of a newly sharpened gouge singing on a bowl or a single sneeze in an otherwise silent shop from too much hand sanding. Or standing back with a cup of coffee and admiring joinery you finally got juuuuust right. The different sounds the different table saw blades make when they're spinning up or down. That first dab of oil on a project you've spent hours or weeks on.

I don't know. Maybe it's different for guys who try to make a living creating things, and maybe that's who the show was aimed at. Plenty of us have more money than sense, (I'll place myself at the head of that line!) but maybe those few seconds you'd save with this new sandpaper technology or that new Incra gauge (now with flip-down stop!) or that new bandsaw blade guide that lets you make a reindeer out of a 2x4 in 4 seconds flat, and STILL be able to touch the blade immediately afterwards! (My son said what I was thinking, "That reindeer looks stupid, and why is he touching the blade?") But perhaps, someone who's trying to make 2400 reindeer a day needs to be able to keep the blade cool and reduce wear? It all seemed so consumptive and anxious and hectic. Full of "improvements" but not full of heart.

I understand that everyone there needs to make money. They're in business to do just that. I guess I was hoping and thinking that maybe we were, as a community, above all of that, at least at some small level. There was just this pervasive feeling of desperation...a need to save time, save money, save materials, work faster, cleaner and get more out of your day.

There seemed to be no place for the jig made from scraps, or sharpening on sandpaper, or a nice simple, clean finish with a rag. Where's the joy? Where's the ingenuity? Where's the common sense? It all seemed lost amidst the portable HVLP sprayers and Kreg display bigger than my shop. Gimmicks and doodads were everywhere, all designed to speed the process of creation and cut down on your time in the shop, which is some of my most precious time. Now why would I cut down on that?

Maybe I'm alone in this feeling, maybe I need to relax and not worry about the state of this wonderful hobby out in the rest of the world and just enjoy my own little world. Besides, I need another cup of coffee and to brush another coat of lacquer on that bowl.

[Ken Werner]

You sure hit the nail on the head, and without the latest pneumatic nailer! I haven't been to the kind of show you described in years, but my son and I do make an annual trip to Saratoga NY where there is a 2 day show full of 1 hour talks by skilled and sometimes well know woodworkers. [Roy Underhill, Garrett Hack and others].

The buying frenzy seems to grip much of American life these days, why else would Wal-Mart be so big, selling so much stuff destined for the landfill before long.

I guess my advice is to try to get what good you can out of the show, and if you can't get any, don't go.

BTW, when I went to the LV booth at the Saratoga show, I fiddled with a spokeshave, the blade popped off and cut my finger. The guy there felt pretty badly, as I dripped some red stuff on the floor.

Sounds like a smart son you have there. Sometimes seeing what not to do is as important as seeing what to do.

Ken

[Warren Clemans]

Absolutely fantastic post. I've never been to one of those shows out of fear that everything you say is true. I've never understand why you're expected to pay money in order to subject yourself to advertising.

[Bas Pluim]

Believe it or not, but I think it's a healthy sign that woodworking is alive and kicking.

You can give a real woodworker a knife and a hand plane, you blink, and they've completed a new set of bedroom furniture. Then there's people like me, who can't sharpen a chisel without a jig, or saw a straight line without a $400 fence. Everyone tries to make up with tools what they lack in skill. All these gimmicks show you there is a market here, that more and more people who weren't born with the grain-reading gene are trying to become woodworkers.

I bought power tools first. Table saw. Router. Drill. Now I have a couple of decent hand saws, semi-sharp chisels, and a real Lee Valley jack plane. It just took me a while to get there.

Yes, there are lots of people that have more money than skill or time. I include myself in that category. The same is true for people playing golf and fixing up cars. That $800 club won't make you play like Tiger Woods, but so what? There's worse things to blow money on.

The real woodworkers are still there, there are just more wannebe's that make them harder to find. But, their number is growing, eventually some of those wannebe's do graduate (and put all that junk on Craig's List to infect the next generation).

That's what I think anyway. $15 Forstner bits? I gotta get me some of those!

Bas.

[Randal Stevenson]

Heard one of the shows was bought out, but I don't know if it is the one that comes here.
Last year, ours shrunk in floor area, but was 2x as busy since they had moved it back to the original location (the other location had to be resodded after the show).
Some good things to see, but all ----------- to elbows, and to view the one free demo I wanted to see, you practically stood at the far side of the place.
The beauty of this place (and some of the other forums) is I find better deals here, then I do there. And the show may advertise it, but they don't have it in stock (we drop ship to you, aka not the point of going to the show).

[Mark Stutz]

Unfortunately, your experience is all to common, and I think worse than it was a few years ago. The only reason thatI will likely go to this years will be the usual breakfast get topgether with a variety of forum members, visit the LV booth, and possibly take in one of the half day seminars.

LN has pulled out of most of these shows and has sponsored several hand tool only shows. These have been great and are exactly what you envision and wish for in a WW "show". Don't miss one if you are all interested in Hand Tools.

Mark

[Dusty Fuller]

Your experience sounds like what my dad and I did last year at the Atlanta car show. There's a good bit of sales pressure and business card dealing, along with bright lights and music, Hummers set up climbing fake mountains, that kind of thing. Every once in a while you'd catch something set up just right, that showed the merits of the car itself, but rarely. But shows are just that, "shows". They want to attract as many people as they can, which almost requires a broad and occasionally shallow experience. To get a better experience, I think I could hit one of the higher-end shows with fewer cars. Harder to find, but you really find the "car people" there. I think its the same with woodworking. The smaller the venue, the more select the crowd. I am fortunate to live about 1.5 hours from Highland Hardware in Atlanta, and though I've only been there once, it seemed like a place where you could touch the real tools and talk to real people, and no one tried to make me buy anything (I got enough of that from myself :D ). I'd go for an "all-neander" show any day, or perhaps a show that catered to the woodworker-as-a-second-job crowd.

[Justin Bukoski]

Nathan,

I went to the same show and was also very disappointed. I think this was a really minor, fringe show though because I went to one in Tacoma a couple of years ago and it was 10 times bigger and much more interesting.

In general though, I think all woodworking shows have that same flea-market feel...

[David Weaver]

So, my question(s) is (are) (as someone who has been WWing for a who whopping year):

- How did people produce fine products without all of these tools and gadgets?

- what is the percentage of people who are going to buy these products and use them more than one or two times?

- If you blow $5000 on jigs and gadgets, how do you have enough money left over to buy some nice stock to make anything?

- What do you do when the plans you have have a couple of joinery techniques, etc that you can't do in a jig that you have - do you buy bigger and better machinery?

This post is relative to everything - from NAMM to fishing conventions to huge estate auctions. Everyone gets excited, someone is yapping in every direction, and sooner or later, it's like being at a fraternity party that's overcrowded - you just want to go outside and clear your head and make sure it hasn't been poisoned or your judgment affected.

I still think that design and execution depend more on the commitment of the user, and that time is better spent working on those, with a basic set of functional tools. That may include a band saw and a table saw and jointer and planer, but maybe without all of those being the latest and greatest digital readout models.

I'm also only 30. I want to have basic things that allow me to make nice things, not have nice things and learn to use them to make basic things.

Too much learning curve with all of these gadgets and equipment.

[John Karam]

I went to the Portland show as well, it made me laugh a bit. Especially since I've been to the AWFS show in Vegas, now thats a BIG show.

Its not even the fact that it was a small show, just that it didn't seem to be worth the $14 for parking/tickets. It definitely gave off the flea market feeling.

[Roland Chung]

Your not too old - perhaps you are too young.

I think that these woodworking shows remind me a lot of the County Fairs. A few decades ago, before we all had high speed internet connections, home centers, discount warehouses and multiple malls in every city, we only had the County Fairs for us to see what was new, clever and more efficient. When the Fair came to town, everyone showed up and spent money. Just like the Fairs, I think that the Woodworking Shows are not as relevant as they used to be, but they still have enough draw to stay in business.

Sorry to hear about your bad experience. When I have time, I try to see the 2 or 3 woodworking shows that come to my area. Now that I have been going for several years, I have to admit that I don't take a second glance at about 90% of the stuff, but there are deals to be had.

At the last show, I picked up a Dewalt Planer 735 with extra blades, chip collector and a free random orbital sander for $335.00. At these shows, I have been introduced to some of my favorite tools - Grex 23 ga pinner, PC Production Pocket Hole Cutter ($495 deal), Festools. There are usually a lot of tools that you won't ever see at the home centers. And when the competing tools stores lower the boom on the last day, it can be like a shark feeding frenzy.

I know that I can get everything I see at the woodworking shows on the internet. I don't buy a big percentage of my tools from the shows, but I feel like I am doing my homework when I show up to examine some tools in person. I've never had to eat shipping (and return shipping) because I was dissapointed with an internet purchase.

Try to see a better show next time:)

[Drew Armstrong]

I am with ya BAS... I am relatively new to this... I like to see the stuff... I would not buy any of it before asking a more experienced friend but it is fun to see. My first show was AWFS in Vegas this past July... sounds totally different than your experience.

Drew

[David Giles]

Definitely too crotchety for 35! You got to be at least 50 to adopt that kind of attitude! How many times have we told you, "Wear your safety equipment!". And you up and left your earplugs at home, didn't you? Didn't take any dark wrap around shades either, huh?

Next year go on the offensive. Wear your protective gear and spend the day saying, "Huh? I can't hear you!" to all those vendors.

[Larry Fox]

I went to exactly one and I suspect that will be only one that I ever attend. My experience was the same as OP. I spend a lot of time and $$ on my WWing (more $$ than I need to) but only after careful research a d I am not comfortable making a purchase in an environment like a trade show. Regardless of the situation, I don't like crowds at all so tend to avoid them.

As an aside, if you think wwing ones are bad - you should attend a fishing or outdoor show. I have attended exactly one of those also.

[Rod Sheridan]

Hi Nathan, I partially agree with your posting regading wood shows.

I live in Toronto, however I no longer attend the Toronto show. I've seen enough people build birdhouses, and enough demonstrations of eyeglass cleaners, miracle router bits and bandsaw blades to last me several lifetimes.

I also had the pleasure of attending a seminar on Arts and Crafts furniture where the presenter, a cabinet maker who specialized in Arts and Crafts furniture, showed us how to make the stuff with pocket screws. No old fashioned, time comsuming mortises for that guy.

I think it was the same show where I accidently sat through a seminar on why you need a planer and a jointer, what will they think up next, why you need several sizes of Robertson screwdrivers?

On the flip side, I attend the Woodstock show, which still has some of the above, however it is balanced by other good seminars.

I wish they would stop selling stuff at the shows, I'd like to spend quality and quantity time with the machinery vendors as I look for items. I can do without the sideshow atmosphere.

Woodshows are kind of like woodworking magazines, after a while you don't need another article on how to use your biscuit maker, or why you should own a jointer, you want more quality articles, designs and reviews.

I guess we are getting older and less tolerant.........Rod.

[glenn bradley]

My only experience with WWing shows is "the Woodworking Shows" get togethers. There was some element of feeding frenzy but it was the minority. You may want to see if they come to your area.

[Cliff Rohrabacher]

I got you beat by a mile.

I just bought a machine that grows the trees, cuts 'em saws, 'em stacks & drys the wood, decides what projects I'll make and then does it all for me.

I almost bought the better model that also opens and drinks my beers but, I felt that to be a tad much.

[Nathan Conner]

I just bought a machine that grows the trees, cuts 'em saws, 'em stacks & drys the wood, decides what projects I'll make and then does it all for me.

You know, Cliff, I saw the demo of that one, but they said that next year's model will be available in an anodized-blue model, and I think it'll be more efficient, so I'm going to wait until that one comes out.

Or maybe I'll buy this one and then pick up the blue one next year so I can have a pair.

Did you get the one with the extruded aluminum handles? Or the stainless ones?

[Rod Sheridan]

You know, Cliff, I saw the demo of that one, but they said that next year's model will be available in an anodized-blue model, and I think it'll be more efficient, so I'm going to wait until that one comes out.

Or maybe I'll buy this one and then pick up the blue one next year so I can have a pair.

Did you get the one with the extruded aluminum handles? Or the stainless ones?

In Canada we have the more advanced model, once it's halfway through the project, it starts nagging you about why it's taking so long and costing so much.

Regards, Rod.

[Rick Levine]

Nathan,

An excellent review. Well written and informative. You should submit it to one of the woodworking magazines. You definitely have a knack for writing. Maybe if some of the show promoters read it, it might do some good.

[Bob Glenn]

I don't go to shows, but I share your thoughts. I opened a woodworking magazine the other day a saw an ad for some sort of gizmo that does carving.

I didn't give it much attention, but I got the impression you did your carving on a computer and then saved it to this little card, then put the card in the machine and then the machine carved the design in the wood?

What the hell is that? It isn't woodworking in my book.:eek:

[Roy Hatch]

Nathan, I really enjoyed reading your rant. My observation is that you are a woodworker and not a tool collector. (And a pretty good writer.) Tool shows rely on the impulse buyer (and there plenty of them) to make it worth having the show. If those in attendance bought only what they actually needed, the shows would cease to exist.

When I first became interested in woodworking as a hobby I went to shows, looked, asked questions, and I have to admit that I bought a few things that I didn't need. Older and wiser, the shows have little to interest me.

Roy

[Ed Blough]

I think your description of the woodworking tool show is valid.
I think it also reflects much of America's buying public. My dad always said they had more money than brains.

I see people paying outlandish prices for cars, houses, tools etc and wonder what are they thinking. Then I go to one of these shows and watch the pitch men work their magic and I soon realize they weren't thinking they were reacting to an emotional stimulant.

There is a new sanding tool I saw that basically is an 18-20" drum sander in a box where the side of whole drum slightly protrudes from the box. You lay your wood on the top and slide it over the drum.
They want $700+ for the thing. It can't have much more than a hundred dollars in parts in it yet people are buying. Why not lay a piece of sandpaper on the your workbench and lay your work on top of it and slide it back and forth. It would do the same thing.

I guess I shouldn't wonder I saw a BBQ brush that has a motor to move the brush back and forth so you don't have to do anything but hold it to clean your BBQ.

I will bet the same people that buy the brush also belong to a fitness club where they pay to move their arms back and forth.

[Bruce Shiverdecker]

My feelings are that there are two types of Woodworker:

Those to whom it is a VOCATION. Being that it's their livelyhood, they are looking for the most efficient way of making something good, while being able to compete. The problem is that there is a LOT of SIZZLE but not much SUBSTANCE at these shows, In most cases, they seem directed towards the neophite.

Those to whom it is an Advocation. The adventure of creating something worthwhile is more important than the sale. The BIG Regional Shows do not cater to us, at all.

Each year they seem to get worse. If, when I go to the Carlinville, Il show this year, it's not any better, it will be the last time I waste my time and gas to attend.

Bruce

[Steve Beadle]

Thanks, Nathan, for making me feel better this Monday-following-the-annual-woodworking-show. I was kind of kicking myself because I had the weekend marked on my calendar for quite a while and then I decided not to go. I decided not to go because down in my heart I just knew it would be a big disappointment after quite a bit of hassle--driving the freeway in the rain, paying for the parking, hobbling through the rain to the building, waiting in line (maybe) to buy a ticket, not being able to hear either the hawkers or the workshop leaders, not be able to see the demonstrations because of the crowds (maybe), feeling the sales pressure, putting up with a lot of negatives and paying for the privilege, etc., etc., etc.

I agree that the WW Show is too much of a sideshow atmosphere, and falls way short of appealing to the soul of the woodworker. Even so, I usually end up going to the show about 75% of the time, but that likelihood is diminishing.
I suppose that if everyone felt that way, before long there wouldn't be a woodworking show anymore--and I'm not sure how I feel about that!

Steve in Oregon City

[Ken Shoemaker]

Nathan,
You are my HERO!!! I'd rather read your next post than go to another time waster by Woodworking Shows.

And there you have it, my unsolicited contribution to the mob mentality... Ken :mad:

[Rob Bodenschatz]

I'm not gonna pile on here. I like going to the shows. I don't buy much. In fact, I don't think I've bought anything in the three I've gone to. Check that, I bought some kind of super glue at one. I do like looking at the tools, even the gimmicky gadgets. They give me ideas. I like handling the LN & LV stuff. I like watching the presentations, even the sales ones. I always learn something. I like going by myself so I don't feel pressured to leave. I'll walk around the place several times just in case I missed something the first time around.

Sorry you didn't like it but don't feel sad for me.

[Jim Becker]

Woodshows are kind of like woodworking magazines, after a while you don't need another article on how to use your biscuit maker, or why you should own a jointer, you want more quality articles, designs and reviews.

I tend to agree with this statement, particularly with regard to the "consumer" woodworking shows. I'll go if there is a particular exhibitor going to be there that I really need to speak with, but I'd much rather go to the "industrial" woodworking shows at this point and visit with a few vendors I enjoy both as suppliers and "friends" as well as get a chance to see what some of the "big boys" are using these days.

Nathan, thanks for your excellent synopsis of the show you recently attended. Very thought provoking!

[Greg Peterson]

Nathan, I went to last years show. While I somewhat enjoyed it, I feel safe in saying I don't need to go to another. I didn't buy anything at that show, not even a little gadget or two. Nada.

You pretty much summed up the experience. I was underwhelmed and disappointed in the chaotic consumerism. Not a lot of craft going on, IMO.

It was like a walking through living version of any woodworking magazine on the market today. Busy, brash, loud, countless interruptions and very little substance.

'Course, it could also be that I'm not big on crowds to begin with.

[Pete Brown]

I'm also 35, but have a different perspective on this. In generaly, the atmosphere you described seems pretty common across various industries.

I have far more hobbies than time. One of those hobbies is model railroading. If you go to those shows, you don't get quite as much hard sell, but you get twice as much junk and three times as many people soaking it all up. The busiest tables are the ones with just piles and bins of junky tools. I am in the software industry, so I also go to conventions that have vendor shows in them. The vendors there are often selling things you don't personally need (or could build in a short amount of time), but that perhaps someone else does need.

Of course, that all beats the machine show I went to in York a few years ago. I went there to see some of the CNC setups people had and what folks were doing with Sherlines and the like. What I got was a bunch of rude and unwashed people (don't people shower before they go out anymore?) both cutting in front and cutting lots of other things <g>.

That all being said, I still enjoy woodworking shows (and train shows). In some cases, it's my only chance to see the machines in person. It's one day a year, and it's like a carnival or local fair. You don't need to eat all the popcorn or stop and look at every gutter guard on display. You can enjoy the sounds of the machines (if you like machines) and also look and pick up techniques or maybe an odd tool.

Those $15 bits? probably no worse than the crapola sold at the local lowes/home depot. I won't buy them, but someone turns over the stock at all my local stores.

One other thing. My wife and I are best friends and we enjoy doing lots of things together. However, I can't have her at a train show or a woodworking show. The experience is totally different, even though she tries her best to enjoy it. You need to have time to walk around the place a few times, and stop and listen to a demo (if you want), or inspect something for 10 minutes. When my wife is with me, even though she is being patient, I feel rushed. I'm also a lot more critical (not in the best way) of what I see and hear in there when she's with me. Perhaps a little of that rubbed off on you this time?

Oh, and I think I have that miter sled you're talking about :D (it really does eliminate test cuts, which is a huge deal when you're building a whole kitchen for your house)

Pete

[Roger Bell]

Very well stated, Nathan. It really isn't often I encounter such a coherent and compelling post. Quite unusual for the 'Boards, I must say.

[Kevin Groenke]

I used to go to the consumer shows because occasionally good deals could be had, but it isn't worth my time anymore. Sure you might get some good ideas, see some new products and meet some interesting people, but overall, shysterism and hawking seems to have pervaded the "consumer" shows.

Oddly enough, "the Woodworking Show" that was scheduled in St. Paul, MN this past weekend was canceled due to lack of participation by exhibitors, whatever that means.

I have been to the AWFS and the IWF and both are so huge that you're likely to find something that interests you. If nothing else just the opportunity to see all that amazing production equipment is worth one trip if you happen to be in the area for any other reason. I'vehad the opportunity to attend the Providence Fine Furnishing Show and the ICFF, neither are primarily about making, but offer exposure to a huge array of 2 quite different categories of furnishings.

If you really want to learn something, take a class at a nearby woodworking school, or even sign up for a week or more at Arrowmont, College of the Redwoods, Anderson Ranch, N. Bennet St. School, Inside Passage, Marc Adams... I've attended a few evening and weekend classes at Woodcraft and Rockler stores that were much more valuable than wandering around a woodworking fair.

I've been to 5 or 6 annual conferences of the Furniture Society. The Furniture Society is biased somewhat towards "studio furniture" but there are plenty of reproductionists, production operations, serious hobbyists, etc... as well. This conference is hosted by a different furniture education program every year (recently-Savanna, Phili, San Diego, Victoria BC, Indianapolis, Madison WI) so it's a good excuse to take a vacation. Though not cheap (~400), I think this conference is a pretty good value, there are artist presentations, demonstrations, numerous galleries, panel discussions, hands-on work areas, etc. The membership is widely varied, so you get to meet a wide array of makers. Though there is an "inner-circle", all attendees are pretty down-to-earth and are open to discussion about "making" or whatever with anybody that feels like talking.

Being a multi-day event, members tend to rub shoulders day and night. Where else would you have the opportunity to: have breakfast with Garrett Hack, talk tools with Ernie Conover, have dinner with Michael Fortune, share a beer with Gary Knox Bennett or heckle slide wars participants with Jim Becker, all in the same day?

There are also tours like: Sam Maloof's studio, The Gambrel House, Taliessen, George Nakashima's shop, the Winterthur...

Definitely something I look forward to each summer.

[Allen Koriakin]

I've walked away from several woodworking shows feeling dazzed and confused. When I lived in NJ I felt that the shows in Edison had more "snake oil" salesman trying desperately to sell you gadgets that they really had no experince using.

My favorite part of the shows always seems to be the Wood-mizer guy that is slicing up lumber out of logs. I always try to visit on the last day so I can try and get a few good deals on lumber for upcoming projects.

[Jon Lanier]

I do believe that this is one of the best discussions I've seen on this site since I've been here. I actually read every one of the post in this thread. I enjoyed everyone of them and learned much.

Thank you All. :)

[John Renzetti]

Really good thread. I like woodworking shows. I've been to the IWF since 1986 and the AWFS that was in Anaheim and now Vegas since 1999. Great shows. The Woodworking Shows just aren't that good anymore. It seems that a lot of major vendors are pulling out leaving the shows to the guys in the headsets.
Does anybody here remember the shows that American Woodworker put on when the magazine was owned by Rodale Press. The first show that was held at the Ft Washington Center just outside of Philadelphia was probably the best show aimed at the non professional that I've ever attended. This was around 1997-8. Then Readers Digest bought Rodale and the show went downhill quickly, in a couple of years. It finally ceased. A couple of the Woodwerks shows have been decent.
A good show to see are the regional machinery shows put on by an outfit in NC Trade Shows Inc. They'll be called something like the Mid Altantic, MidWest, Machinery show. It's supposed to be geared to the small to medium pro shop but there is something for everyone.
Looking forward to the next IWF in Atlanta in August 2008.
take care,
John

[Nino Maini]

Maybe I'm alone in this thinking, but I think this is a great hobby/passion/what ever you call it where you can do the same thing in so many ways. If someone has the time and skills to do it by hand, that is great. if someone prefers to make something with power tools and the latest "it" gadget, that is great also. Different people enjoy things in different ways. i personally love the interaction I get using power tools to make something

[Dave MacArthur]

Hmmm... while I can appreciate your point of view on this, it seems overly negative to me. Maybe we just look at things differently. I very much enjoyed your post, but as a point of opposing thought, here are some rhetorical questions to ponder, which may allow you to look at the dirty cloud and see the silver lining beneath:


-Would you rather have a show, or no show?
- Do you think the folks who go to the shows with tools/equipment should try to make a living by selling their stuff?
- Would you rather NOT have a thriving woodworking industry that supports this hobby for so many folks?
- Do you see sufficient apprenticeships, mentor programs, or even school shop program still in existence to help maintain or expand woodworking as a hobby, if all the gadget-buying and hooplah that attracts young new potential woodworkers was suddenly deleted?
- In countries where there are no such capitilist crapola festivals, do the actual folks trying to do woodworking as a hobby wish there was more of a thriving market so they could even get the basics?

and so on...
While I don't buy stuff at the shows, I say "GOD BLESS THEM!" to all the thousands and thousands of folks working to sell this nicnac or that... they ALL help invigorate this hobby, increase competition and ideas, and keep woodworking fun for a wide spectrum of folks, hobbyists to pros. I see worse crud marketed to my kids without mercy every time I deign to watch an hour of TV on Saturday ;)

Again, thanks for your fine post and writing... you just got me so depressed I felt a need to fight back; sometimes when all we perceive in the world is dark and evil, still there is usually good being done from it beyond our vision.

Dave

[Greg Pavlov]

We (the United States-wide "we") tend to look to new equipment and technology to make us better at whatever we're doing, and you can see that in almost every hobby and sport (especially at those dominated by men). You can see some of that here, where someone will say that one can't do good work with a contractor's saw, it's junk, so put down the money for a cabinet-grade model. And so forth. Some of it is real, some of it is not quite so, and a lot of it is fantasy. But all of that churning does keep the industry going, and there is no one that forces anyone to buy anything. And it causes a lot of people to buy stuff they don't need that they end up selling at a really good price to someone who *can* use it to good stead down the road a ways.

[Pete Brown]

I see worse crud marketed to my kids without mercy every time I deign to watch an hour of TV on Saturday ;)

This is so true! During news shows they sell a pill for everything. During kids' shows they sell a sweet for everything. At least you can walk past the vendor at the show and ignore them :)

Pete

[Greg Robbins]

I personally love go to the shows. If for no other reason than to pick up some sand paper, watch a few demos and touch some to the heavy metal. I think they're great.

[Rob Wright]

I do think that the shows have a flea market feel to them. However, I truly enjoy meeting up with my father for a long afternoon of walking around and discussing some of the junk, and some of the really neat items that are for sale. I have bought a set of drill bits and a all in one clamp with a guide for my saw and that's it - in 4-years of going. I pay the $5 to park and the $5 or $10 to get in and I enjoy the walk and discussion. I rarely get time to do that anymore with my father and I appreciate the show for just that reason. I do drool over some of the larger tools and try to sit in on a demonstration or two and have larned some great tips in the limited time watching them. The people watching isn't too bad either.

If the show (The woodworking show) has lost the major sponsors - I might have to think of another activity for that weekend, but I am sure that it will somehow involve woodworking and my father.:D

[Bill White]

Yes friends we at ____________________, inc. guarantee that this is the LAST ______ that you will EVER need. Just ten minutes with our new _________ will enable you to _____________ with accuracy unavailable in the past. AND, just for trying our new ___________, you will get a set of ginsu knives as well as a new and improved screw, bolt, and nail sizer.
Hehehe.
Bill

[John Callahan]

My first woodworking show rant...am I getting too old?
Nah, you're wise beyond your years and right on the mark. To borrow a bit from Justin's post the WW shows I've been to are basically flea markets for woodworkers where the latest widget will seemingly turn you into Sam Maloof (don't I wish). A lot of WW shows seem to be struggling- it wouldn't hurt for their promoters to read this thread.

[Ellen Benkin]

WOW, a crowded woodworking show. Must be nice for the vendors. The last one in the Los Angeles area (Pomona, last Spring) you could have shot off a cannon and not hit anyone. It was kind of depressing, even though I didn't have to fight any crowds. They have to be busy or we won't have any shows anymore.

[Mike Seals]

Don't fret Nathan, the shows are not for you.

I used to build street rods, pre 198 cars, every year I'd go to the Pate swap meat near Dallas Texas, 22 acres of old car parts. It was like a trip to Mecca for us street rodders. The atmosphere was one of the most enjoyable aspects of the meet, Started on Wednesday and ended on the following Sunday. Folks walked around and talked, share stories, gazed at the finds and bickered over prices like an old world tent sale. In the evening folks ate, had a few beers and relaxed until the next day.

An older friend of mine once picked up a silver dollar size piece of stainless looking metal on a table. The owner (another old guy) quickly ran over and began chatting with my friend and the haggling began only for my friend to put it back down after a few minutes. The piece was a protective cover for the hinges on a model a Ford very few folks would know that, and they both did.

The next day as we were walking past the same booth, the booth guy yelled at my freind and tossed him the part, free of charge. They became good friends and swapped out parts with each other for years afterward.

Those days are gone and so are the relationships that grow from that kind of atmosphere. You went to the show hoping to find the type of atmosphere that I used to enjoy at Pate, the sharing of knowledge and spirit, instead you found a sales outlet. It's the same reason I quit going to the swap meets, the atmosphere is gone.

[Kelly C. Hanna]

What I saw, instead, was a carnival of consumption.

I haven't been to one in years....mainly for the exact same reasons you hate it.

[Chuck Nickerson]

What were you expecting, professional woodworking instruction for free? If you think shows should be different, just try organizing and paying for one.

[Bruce Wrenn]

We get a group together and go to show. Take our own sandwichs. Spend some time with friends. Usually visit the "trinket vendors", and get the things that cost more to ship, than to buy. Always seems to be "one bargin" that I can't live without. Almost always buy some 1/2", or 3/4" HDPE in four foot lengths. Also mini tee-track, usuially with bolts and knobs. I consider show to be what it is- entertainment and time to spend with friends. One of our group takes in every demonstration by vendors. Before buying anything, I look at whole show. This way, I get best price- it's my money.

[Nathan Conner]

What were you expecting, professional woodworking instruction for free? If you think shows should be different, just try organizing and paying for one.

No, of course I wasn't expecting professional, free woodworking instruction, only by my favorite cabinet makers, teachers & designers. I don't want to watch Sam Maloof and Jim Krenov cook me breakfast. (Well, ok, I'm lying. I'd LOVE to see that!)

Compare these two things - I don't know how many of you have a Rockler or Woodcraft near you - I'm lucky enough to have both within an hours' drive. But, picture that store on a Tuesday afternoon after lunch - not too busy. It's quiet, there's shiny stuff EVERYWHERE, and you walk through the aisles slowly, looking at stuff, reading labels, feeling tools, taking it all in, enjoying yourself. Occasionally someone there will stop by and comment on something over your shoulder and spark a chat.

Now, picture, if you will, Wal*Mart the day after Thanksgiving, getting stopped in the aisle to buy a cell phone by four different folks, time and again, tripping over useless crap every which way you look, blaring specials over the loudspeaker every 30 seconds and Santa placed strategically at every aisle's endcap just so you can hear an electronic laugh every two minutes.

Those two pictures - what I was expecting, and what I got.

Yes, I agree on many counts with what's been said. If it weren't for consumerism and drive for new tools, I wouldn't be able to afford (or have heard of) Powermatic. We wouldn't have the Rocklers, Woodcrafts, and other places to go as refuge. We'd all be stuck buying Ryobi and Black and Decker at the BORGs. All the weekend warriors filling their shops with stuff is what allows the Incras and Lie Nielsons to come down the 'pike. Maybe people have thought the same thing I'm thinking about these vendors as they thought about the tools I love and enjoy 20 or 30 years ago. Maybe it's just a sign of the times.

So, of course I'm not going to run out and organize and pay for a woodworking show that caters to the VERY few like me who want and even fewer who can afford such an experience. I wasn't expecting perfection.

I was, however, HOPING for a modicum of professionalism. Some sort of bond of something that felt more like guys who love something getting together and less like walking around with carnies yelling at me. A handful of displays and guys anxious to show their wares is one thing...this was commercialism run amok - everyone trying to be louder, slicker, and more full of promises and shortcuts than the next guy.

So, I'll quit my whining, have a Coke and contemplate my navel for a few hours. And I'll stay away when they come to town next year. Honestly, it was a good experience. It's made me look at my tool buying habits and my tool collection a lot more closely. I haven't thought so hard about something after having a bad experience as I have reading all of your responses.

Thanks for the input, guys. It's nice to see and realize I'm surrounded by likeminded folks and other folks with really, really good counterpoints.

[Dave MacArthur]

Thinking about your post up above (all good points), it occurred to me... All the things you hoped to find at the show, are the reasons I enjoy SMC so much-- reading the discussions, chatting about this or that tool, listening to someone's bit of philosophical observation, shopping for tools by having some good discussions with friends who actually have used them. If truth be told, given the choice between going to a show, and sending YOU to the show to report the highlights and suffer the lows, I'd actually rather sit here at home heh.

Now if folks would just post more threads about 16" or bigger bandsaws, things would be perfect!

[Gene Michael]

Excellent comments about shows. The last 'show' I caught was for Shopsmith products and I was far more impressed by the demonstrator's salesmanship than by the product. By far, the best place I've found to hear about new products and better techniques to use old one is the SMC forum. No one is trying to sell anything and the wealth of knowledge and willingness to share is awesome!

[Stan Suther]

Just a thought here before you go. See if you can find a meeting of the local tool collectors association. Yes, it is mostly Neander in terms of what's there (all cordless), but I think you'll tend to find the spirit you're looking for. There will be lots of tools offered for sale, and many of them are just good user grade at very fair prices. They'll probably have a demonstration or two to show how some of these old cool tools can be used. No pressure there- just sharing a common interest. The local big time tool show left my area last year, but I don't mind, because a couple of times a year I can go to a gathering of the hand tool faithful, share some stories and come away with a few good deals, and its way better than eBay ;) .

[Richard Blaine]

... a carnival of consumption.

That's the feeling I get everytime I walk into Best Buy.

[James Davis]

I went to my firs woodworking show a couple weeks ago and it could not have been further from what you described. I was lucky enough to find out about the Lie-Nielson event in Philadelphia. My daughter and her boyfriend were visiting me from College (Fall Break) and I got them up and we drove up to Philly, got a cheese steak, and went over to Philadelphia Furniture Workshop. We walked in and there were maybe 25 people there, among them were Chris Schwartz, Tom Lie-Nielson, Mario Rodriguez, Adam Cherubini, and other notables from various woodworking publications. There were many workbenches sitting around with tools just lying there waiting to be picked up and fondled. We went around to the different benches and played with the tools, we watched demonstrations at various techniques, we talked to the celebrities, I drooled on a bunch of tools, and left with exactly the opposite feeling you got from your show. By the way, all of the Lie-Nielson tools were there. (Those are some sweet tools)

My daughter and her boyfriend have never been interested in woodworking until then. They left wanting to learn more and do more. I was impressed with the impression the right show had on them. I left the show empty handed, but the boyfriend got a call a week or so later and he had won a door prize. He called and said that the next time I go home I will be getting a Lie-Nielson Shoulder Plane.

If you have a chance to get to one of these shows, by all means GO

James Davis

[Brodie Brickey]

Some of the woodworking shows have gotten really crazy. They have also gotten smaller in the last two years. I attended the Woodworking Show last year, it wasn't up to par with past years. I was talking to one of the smaller vendors and they said they were only doing two shows that year because it wasn't worth their time. With this show, you get a couple very large tool sellers carrying almost everything, and then you get a couple specialty groups and you're done. I hear woodworks is better.

When you are in the market for a new dovetail jig/system and you want to check out the options, these shows can be your best way to see them in use or try them out before you buy.

I try to buy quite a bit of my stuff after I've handled it and sometimes the local WoodCraft or Rockler just doesn't have the variety available. If I was running a tool shop I certainly wouldn't carry 8 brands of table saw & bandsaws & planar & drill press, etc it wouldn't make sense economically.

I find that when I go to a show, I'm looking for certain things. A new tool I'm considering like a bandsaw. I won't buy there, but I can check out the options and recognize what features I want. The other are the little things, dust collection connectors that my local show doesn't carry. These smaller items will cost almost as much shipping as the item, so its more economical to pick them up at a show. I can also bring a part with me to match it up with if I have a question.

If you want a quieter show, you need to shift to things like a Symposium with an attached shopping area. The AAW Symposium in Portland this year offered the demonstrations and a small trade show that was quiet without the hawking cries of the ginsu knife guy.

[Rob Bodenschatz]

I went to my firs woodworking show a couple weeks ago and it could not have been further from what you described. I was lucky enough to find out about the Lie-Nielson event in Philadelphia...

I assume you're referring to the event at Alan Turner's shop. While I wasn't there, I think it's safe to say that that is not the type of show everyone is talking about.

[Gary Keedwell]

Hmmm... while I can appreciate your point of view on this, it seems overly negative to me. Maybe we just look at things differently. I very much enjoyed your post, but as a point of opposing thought, here are some rhetorical questions to ponder, which may allow you to look at the dirty cloud and see the silver lining beneath:


-Would you rather have a show, or no show?
- Do you think the folks who go to the shows with tools/equipment should try to make a living by selling their stuff?
- Would you rather NOT have a thriving woodworking industry that supports this hobby for so many folks?
- Do you see sufficient apprenticeships, mentor programs, or even school shop program still in existence to help maintain or expand woodworking as a hobby, if all the gadget-buying and hooplah that attracts young new potential woodworkers was suddenly deleted?
- In countries where there are no such capitilist crapola festivals, do the actual folks trying to do woodworking as a hobby wish there was more of a thriving market so they could even get the basics?

and so on...
While I don't buy stuff at the shows, I say "GOD BLESS THEM!" to all the thousands and thousands of folks working to sell this nicnac or that... they ALL help invigorate this hobby, increase competition and ideas, and keep woodworking fun for a wide spectrum of folks, hobbyists to pros. I see worse crud marketed to my kids without mercy every time I deign to watch an hour of TV on Saturday ;)

Again, thanks for your fine post and writing... you just got me so depressed I felt a need to fight back; sometimes when all we perceive in the world is dark and evil, still there is usually good being done from it beyond our vision.

Dave
Good post Dave,
Whether you like the shows or not...I'm just happy that the shows are still going on. I've been around long enough to see the other side of the hoopla. I know this is a stretch but I don't like that empty feeling when interest fades and business goes elsewhere. There was a period 25 years or so ago that was not very kind to woodworkers and DIY's. Seems like only a few did home renovations and the tool market for non-professionals was limited to Sears and Black & Decker.
Then came the late 80's and 90 's. " This Old House" and "new Yankee Workshop" inspired a whole generation of woodworkers. It was an exciting time when I did my old ranch over from head to toe in the early nineties.
New exciting products hit the new market to make things better for the craftsmen that is in every one of us.
Just one more thing....I think the shows are what they are and it is up to you to make what you want of them. The attitude you bring there is what your going to bring home, too. LOML and I make a Holiday of the whole event. Sometimes we sleep over at a nice Hotel and there is also our favorite restaurant that we look forward to. When I go there I just filter the things out that I have no need for and concentrate on my own agenda.
The thing is that if people start losing interest in woodworking...we all lose.
Gary

[andy brown]

Hi,
Every tool ever made-from that Roman plane to the latest eezi-peezi 15$ set of Forstner bits ( which I like the sound of, by the way) is made because the maker hopes to sell it! The human race has always loved a show and a 'canival of consumption' to quote Nathan Connor, is probably what we think we like best of all. It may not turn out to be worth the entrance fee, but we'll be back next year, more than likely.
In amongst all the tacky geegaws in the side tents you may come across a treasure- a stand selling second hand woodworking books, perhaps, or an old guy (and I'm 61) whittling stuff in a corner with his Missus reading a magazine behind the old table with a collection of whittled things for sale.

Outside, where you hope to get some fresh air, you find yourself surrounded by up-ended Jaccuzzis and whirlypool spas, guys selling the same small tractors on 7 different stands, stands selling Austrian sausage burgers next to the pot-roast stand. wandering among all of this are beautiful girls offering free sachets of a new, miracle chocolate drink made without any chocolate at all.

You have some great writers in the States who have told us already what it's like in a consumerist society--Edward Abbey, Nelson Algren, John dos Passos and many more and in England William Thackery with 'Vanity Fair',
Tobias Smollett and R S Surtees amongst many.
We know already what our society is about-selling stuff- and either we go to live in Alaska to get outside the box, or we take it all with a pinch of salt, find the things we want to enjoy doing and leave the rest for someone else.

I picked up a Record 405 at a car show near me a few years ago and I go back each year scratching about for something interesting!!

Now then, where are those Forstner bits?
Good Health to All,

Andy.

[James Davis]

I realize that it is not the type of show that everyone is talking about, but it should be the type everyone is trying to get to. It leaves a different impression on you and I was just pointing out the difference. My first woodworking show, as compared to the others. He told of his first and I told of mine. I certainly didn't need your input to know the difference and neither did any one else.


James Davis

[James Davis]

I assume you're referring to the event at Alan Turner's shop. While I wasn't there, I think it's safe to say that that is not the type of show everyone is talking about.


I don't feel that you have to assume anything since I clearly stated that I went to the show at the Philadelphia Furniture Workshops.

James Davis

[Rob Bodenschatz]

I don't feel that you have to assume anything since I clearly stated that I went to the show at the Philadelphia Furniture Workshops.

James Davis

Wow, James. I obviously missed that in your post but I don't know why you need to be so antagonistic about it. You sure are a friendly guy.:rolleyes:

[Rob Bodenschatz]

I realize that it is not the type of show that everyone is talking about, but it should be the type everyone is trying to get to. It leaves a different impression on you and I was just pointing out the difference. My first woodworking show, as compared to the others. He told of his first and I told of mine. I certainly didn't need your input to know the difference and neither did any one else.


James Davis

My point was that the PFW show was obviously in a different category than the bigs vendor shows that the thread is about. Since you said it was your first show, I thought I was being helpful in pointing that out to you. Obviously you took it the wrong way and decided to be a jerk about it. Nice knowin' ya.

[Gary Keedwell]

I realize that it is not the type of show that everyone is talking about, but it should be the type everyone is trying to get to. It leaves a different impression on you and I was just pointing out the difference. My first woodworking show, as compared to the others. He told of his first and I told of mine. I certainly didn't need your input to know the difference and neither did any one else.


James Davis
Gee James....Did somebody deposit something nasty in your Wheaties this morning.:confused: I just came back from vacation and I have read this whole thread and I have found no animosity......well...huhhh until......:rolleyes:
Gary

[Bill Jepson]

Thanks guys for all the good posts. Good points on both sides of the issue. The thing to remember is that there is a market for BOTH Walmart, and Lie-Nielson. I own several of the planes, and the shirt I'm wearing as I type this came from Walmart. One item is intended to last a lifetime, the other until the fashion trends change,...both have their place.
We can use shows to see new things, but we must use our brains to buy the items we need most. Unless you have more money than brai..oops that is just wrong.
Most of us know what a quality piece of equipment looks like. SMC helps those who don't have the years of experience to be sure on their own. For all those new to tools I'll just say that I like the Levis (Jeans) motto,
"Quality NEVER goes out of style." Amen to that.
Bill

[James Davis]

WHen you assumed I was talking about what I had stated in my post. You made the old saying about "assume" ring true. I did not feel that I left anything up for asssumption. So I guess I resent the assumption.

[Rob Bodenschatz]

WHen you assumed I was talking about what I had stated in my post. You made the old saying about "assume" ring true. I did not feel that I left anything up for asssumption. So I guess I resent the assumption.

Dude, I missed the words PHILADELPHIA FURNITURE WORKSHOP in your post. Probably because it crossed over two lines of text in my browser. I went back and saw it after the fact. Because I missed it when I read it the first time, I was just clarifying what I thought you were talking about. SO WHAT???? Why would you possibly get upset about that? What difference does it make? It was not an antogonistic comment on my part. Does it make me an xxxxxx because I tried to clarify something???

NOTICE TO ALL: Don't make any assumptions around James. He don't take it too well.

Man, I'd hate to have to live in your house.
:confused::confused::confused::confused:

[James Davis]

Go back and reread the whole thing..................When you start your post with "I assume you are talking about" you're right. I should take it that you are so much smarter than I am and I am just a dummy and didn't know where I was. Well sir I resent the fact that you feel that you need to tell me where I was. Especially since you so eloquently stated that you were indeed not there. So I was just wanting to know how it was that you had grounds to correct me.

[Rob Bodenschatz]

I hope you all are enjoying this.

[James Davis]

I have reread your replies and I have a question for you. Why is it that you can't have a discussion with out trying to attack the character of the person that disagrees with you? You obviously felt the need to tell me where I was and now because I take offense to your corrections you feel that you need to come after me. I have not warned others to avoid you, should I? Just because I will never value your opinion, it doesn't mean that others might not be able to get something from your posts.(or should that read rants?)

[Rob Bodenschatz]

I have reread your replies and I have a question for you. Why is it that you can't have a discussion with out trying to attack the character of the person that disagrees with you? You obviously felt the need to tell me where I was and now because I take offense to your corrections you feel that you need to come after me. I have not warned others to avoid you, should I? Just because I will never value your opinion, it doesn't mean that others might not be able to get something from your posts.(or should that read rants?)

What correction exactly do you take offense to?

[Gary Keedwell]

I hope you all are enjoying this.
All's been quiet for awhile....They must be taking a nap.:rolleyes: :D

Gary

[Zahid Naqvi]

guys let's keep it nice and civilized, difference of opinions are fine just don't make it personal.

[Rob Bodenschatz]

All's been quiet for awhile....They must be taking a nap.:rolleyes: :D

Gary

No. Just waiting for an answer. Still not sure what got this guy all riled up.

[Greg Peterson]

He must have his forums mixed up. Ah, how I don't miss those days.

[Gary Keedwell]

He must have his forums mixed up. Ah, how I don't miss those days.
Then you better not stray toward politics:eek: :D :D
Gary ( Only joshing, Greg:) )

[Greg Peterson]

Me? Politics? Here? Never! I know where to get my ya ya's out on that subject.

How was your trip Gary?


Reading James posts was very reminiscent of other places where the water isn't as calm, cool and relaxing. I can understand his reactions if he was indoctrinated in a different realm.

[Gary Keedwell]

Me? Politics? Here? Never! I know where to get my ya ya's out on that subject.

How was your trip Gary?


Reading James posts was very reminiscent of other places where the water isn't as calm, cool and relaxing. I can understand his reactions if he was indoctrinated in a different realm.
My trip was fantastic and thanks for inquiring. We went from 80º to 60º and the Red Sox game got over right after we landed and before we departed the plane. Even the pilot was getting his Sox on. I was freezing my buns off standing around in my shorts. LOL
Yes, I agree about James. He is a newcomer. I guess you could compare it to getting out of prison and acclimating to normal people. (Not that I have any actual experience).
The hardest thing is to drop your shield and let your defenses down a few notches.GO PATS!!!!!!!!!:cool: :D

[Rob Bodenschatz]

Yes, I agree about James. He is a newcomer. I guess you could compare it to getting out of prison and acclimating to normal people. (Not that I have any actual experience).


That had me ROTFLMAO. :D:D:D

[Al Garay]

I just got back from my first woodworking show held in Seattle starting today.
Since it had radio and newspaper advertising, I was expecting a big show like the home show with all the local manufacturers such as Grizzly (corporate headquarters just North of Seattle), Jet (who is just South of Seattle), Powermatic, Sunhill Machinery who also owns Oliver (also just South of Seattle), and the usual vendors such as Rockler, Woodcraft. Woodcraft was there but had a very small area and no demonstrations.

I was already preparing my excuse I would give to my wife for buying new Bandsaw or table saw. No such deal. There were some cool tools such as Powermatic showed their pm2800 drill press for only $650. It was impressive.

Because vendors outnumbered the people attending, it was great to talk to the Bosch rep details about their latest power tools. It was sad seeing so many vendors standing around without anyone to attend to. Of course it did not help that on the other side was the much larger Ski Show which had at least 20 signs posted around compared to one sign for the woodworking show. Who ever did the marketing, should be shot.

Although, I was not blown away or drawn to pull out my card in haste, the Finishing education sessions taught by Jim Heavey of Wood Magazine made my time and effort all worth it. He really knows his stuff enough to draw the attention of people at different skill levels, had clear demonstrations and combined it with a great sense of humor and humility from his lessons learned, meaning learning from mistakes and giving yourself credit. I also was able to spend 10 minutes talking with him one-on-one as I waited until everyone else has gone. Jim Heavey is good reason attend.

In terms of equipment envy, I was far more impressed when I visited Grizzly store in Bellingham. I was ready to go all green. Our Woodcraft store also has enough tool selection to raise my credit card warning.

I will not give up on woodworking shows. There may be others like Jim Heavey. There is a woodworking show during the summer that takes up the Puyallup Fairgrounds, very big venue. That has to be much more like a flea market atmosphere.

Anyways, I also went alone after work. No way would I lasted more than 30 minutes had I brought my wife and daughters. That's plain wrong.

Al

[David Klug]

OK Jim what is cheese steak?

DK

[Jim Dunn]

For me, woodworking is relaxing, enjoyable pastime. It's the sound of a newly sharpened gouge singing on a bowl or a single sneeze in an otherwise silent shop from too much hand sanding. Or standing back with a cup of coffee and admiring joinery you finally got juuuuust right. The different sounds the different table saw blades make when they're spinning up or down. That first dab of oil on a project you've spent hours or weeks on.


I think I just figured out what woodworking is to me just by reading the above. That oil part just about brought a tear to my eye. Seriously!!

I admit that I am old and sentimental when it comes to a lot of things. Enjoying a hobby is supposed to be fun not frustration. I'll end here as I haven't had enough coffee------------yet.:rolleyes:

[Chuck Lenz]

We (the United States-wide "we") tend to look to new equipment and technology to make us better at whatever we're doing, and you can see that in almost every hobby and sport (especially at those dominated by men). You can see some of that here, where someone will say that one can't do good work with a contractor's saw, it's junk, so put down the money for a cabinet-grade model. And so forth. Some of it is real, some of it is not quite so, and a lot of it is fantasy. But all of that churning does keep the industry going, and there is no one that forces anyone to buy anything. And it causes a lot of people to buy stuff they don't need that they end up selling at a really good price to someone who *can* use it to good stead down the road a ways.
Greg, you certainly got that right about the Contractors tablesaw. I own one, and I feel like I'm being preasured in here to buy a hybrid or Unisaw in order for anyone to take me seriously as a woodworker. I understand the bennefits of some of the hybrids and the bennefits of the Unisaws, but for me, my Delta Contractors saw has served me well for 12 years with a couple small improvements. In a nut shell, it's all I need for a hobby saw. If I was running a fulltime cabinet shop it would be a different story. There will allways be people that have more money than I do to spend on fancy machinery to brag about, but that doesn't make them any better of a woodworker than I am in some cases. As far as woodworking shows go, we have a ACME Electric, Tool Crib of The North here intown that has a show every year, it's a small show. I've been to one and I couldn't of got out of the store soon enough. I luv looking at new tools and gadgets, but I'd rather do it without being preasured by salesmen.

[Nathan Conner]

You know, I went over that prospective Lie Nielson purchase in my head for awhile. Then I went down to the shop and pulled open all the drawers and cubbies and checked on the wall. I have no less than 8 iron hand planes. Most are 40+ years old. Most are little balls of rust. They've been picked up here or there when I find them, one Buck Bros. jointing plane from the BORG, and a newer Stanley jack. Nothing but Pot metal and paint, in some cases. Oh, and about 5 wooden planes.

So I spent 2 hours this morning cleaning and tuning each one up - flattening all the soles on the belt sander, re-grinding, re-beveling, sharpening each of the blades. Then I spent another hour on a single 8' piece of 6/4 Alder. Was able to get each plane just singing, without exception. Even the Stanley 110 with the broken front knob. Turns out I have an old low-angle 8" Stanley somethingorother with an adjustable throat - that one's my favorite so far. Nice and heavy for its size.

A morning spent figuring out how to clean, tune, sharpen and, most of all, USE the tools I already own. What a joy! Didn't cost me a cent, and now I have a bunch of old, previously-junked planes on a shelf, just begging to be used. I doubt that I'll chuck my jointer in the trash, but this was more challenging and fun by any turn than 20 seconds in front of the jointer.

Maybe that new plane isn't so important after all. Seems likely that I'm too focused on fancy new tools and not on what I want the wood to do or how to do it...maybe I'll make a couple of extra tractor payments and forget about new tools for a bit.

[Gary Keedwell]

Some people like the idea of playing around and fine tuning their equipment. I got into a "building rut" a few years ago after a move and I enjoyed myself. I spent alot of time with the new house and spent alot of time away from my new shop. I didn't have alot of space so I really got into sharpening. I did alot of experimenting with different methods and really got into it.
I look back now and think it was really therapy because I didn't want to really set up a shop in my small designated area. After 3 years we moved and the building bug came right back and hasn't stopped. I had the privilege of getting a whole new basement to do as I wanted. I can tell you with certainty that a different invironment was all I needed to get my juices flowing 100%.
I guess we all take our own detours, but I can tell you for sure that when LOML and I look around and see the PRODUCTION results...it sure is gratifying.;) :)

Gary

[Bill Bryant]

Here's another take on this. I'm new to woodworking and I've never been to a show. I'm a fifty-year-old man trying to sort out the gimmicks from the solid and real. I'm neither an old f*** who won't try anything new (if nobody tried anything new we'd still be making stools with flint knives) or a wided-eyed kid who thinks I have to have three sizes of Domino cutters to make a cutting board.

When I go to my first show I'll be all ears and eyes at as many booths as possible, and I'll probably take a truckload of stuff home with me in an excited flurry of enthusiasm (some of the stuff bought in a stupid burst of idiotic insight, some of it bought sensibly--them's the breaks for a newbie: we do the best we can) that might look silly to both the relaxed hobbyists with "heart" and the making-a-living-at-it men who approach the shows with serious efficiency.

Anyway, when you see a man like me at a show, cut me some slack if a seem too amazed by a gimmick that will soon pass from the scene. And give me a break too if I'm too new to have settled down into either the enjoyable pace of the satisfied hobbyist or the clinical expertise of the man with a serious vocation and responsibility to his wife and kids.

I'm not going to go back and edit this. If it makes no sense, so be it. Take it as a snapshot of the musing of one man just getting into this fascinating world.

[Gary Keedwell]

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I'm not going to go back and edit this. If it makes no sense, so be it. Take it as a snapshot of the musing of one man just getting into this fascinating world.
:D :D Bill, You made my chuckle. I'm almost 58 and I envy you. The excitement and wonder of a new hobby is indeed a great trip. I have made a few blunders here and there with my purchases, but I have no remorse and would do it all over in a New York heartbeat!!!
Gary