Didn't know shooting was so painful!

[Brian Kent]

Finished my first 90° shooting board today.

I started trying different planes to use on it. I read about using a Stanley #5, so I tried mine and found out how badly out of tune it is. I re-fettled bottom, which had been badly concave around the mouth. I re-fettled the sides, which were not square to the bottom and were badly convex. I re-flattened the back of the blade, reset the frog, re-tuned the chip breaker and got the blade nice and sharp. If nothing else today, I have a much nicer #5.

I tried the plane on a piece of ash. I found out that when I re-fettled the sides of the #5 I had effectively sharpened the upper edges of the rails. I kept on playing with it, stopping just before my hands started bleeding. I did file that upper rail, but it only helped a little.

It seems like there is a lot of pressure needed to plane the end grain, with very few smooth surfaces to hang onto that plane. Maybe that's why everybody who mentions using a #5 for shooting goes on to talk about Low Angle Jacks!:p

So, I did not start this project in order to spend money on a new plane, but…

What plane do you use successfully (and with minimum pain) on a shooting board???

[harry strasil]

LOL, I use a Woodie Jack. Really the right one would be a skew angle, skewed to the right so it has a tendency to force the work piece down.

[Randy Klein]

I use a #7 and wear a weightlifter glove on my shooting hand (padding only on the palm, fingertips are free). Otherwise, my hand goes numb after a while.

[Greg Crawford]

Veritas LA jack with the 25 degree blade. Still hurts my hand if I have a lot to do, but it does a fine job.

[David Weaver]

The purpose-built iron miter plane that LN makes works very very well, but it costs a mint. It's very easy to use, but it's a one-trick pony, and I guess not exactly cut out for folks looking to do anything on the cheap.

Also, a nice bit to have to break edges is the rubber abrasive blocks - they work like dry waterstones, where you run them over a surface and they break away and constantly exposing new grit. I always break the bottom edges on mine when I'm done lapping - obviously by just running the plane across the lapping plate, tilted at a 45 degree angle.

[Brian Kent]

Good idea with the gloves. I have some bicycle gloves with thick leather palm padding (also no fingers).

I have an old #7. I sharpen it up and try it. The woodie Jack does sound more comfortable. I have the block and the blade to make a Krenov style jack plane, but I have no idea on how to do a skew angle.

Not to start a classic argument, but does the "dimple" on the side of the Veritas low-angle jack make it any easier for shooting than the Lie-Nielsen low-angle jack? And does anyone know of a rock with a couple hundred dollars under it so I can go buy either one?

I won't even try to come up with the $350 or so for a L-N dedicated Mitre plane.

[lowell holmes]

I use a bevel up jack plane for shooting, but a #5 1/2 stanley bailey works well also. A 4 1/2 or a #6 will do nicely also.

[Chuck Hamman]

Brian,
Don't go looking for this one on ebay or at the flea market, you'll have to make your own. I made this one from a Handyman #4. The infill replacing the original frog provides a bed angle of 20 Degs. It is more comfortable to hold than the standard Stanley configuration. If I keep a good edge on the stock blade it works very well on my shooting board. One of these days I'll buy a Hock or LN replacement for it.

-Chuck

[Don Pierson]

I agree...shooting is painful. So I made a handle I can attach to the side of the plane...it uses a switchable magnet.

[Brian Kent]

Brian,
Don't go looking for this one on ebay or at the flea market, you'll have to make your own. I made this one from a Handyman #4. The infill replacing the original frog provides a bed angle of 20 Degs. It is more comfortable to hold than the standard Stanley configuration. If I keep a good edge on the stock blade it works very well on my shooting board. One of these days I'll buy a Hock or LN replacement for it.

-Chuck

Chuck, does the screw through the cap go directly into the infill wood?

[Steve Clardy]

Brian,
Don't go looking for this one on ebay or at the flea market, you'll have to make your own. I made this one from a Handyman #4. The infill replacing the original frog provides a bed angle of 20 Degs. It is more comfortable to hold than the standard Stanley configuration. If I keep a good edge on the stock blade it works very well on my shooting board. One of these days I'll buy a Hock or LN replacement for it.

-Chuck


Very nice Chuck. I like that. :D

[Chuck Hamman]

Thanks Steve,
I have to admit I was surprised how well it turn out. The whole investment was under $20.00. I thought about making a bun to replace the front knob, but the knob is more Stanley-ish don't you think :)

Brian, I ran a threaded insert into the infill to accept the lever cap screw. I don't recall exactly what size, but whatever is closest to the original. By the way, I turned the blade bevel up.

-Chuck

[Steve Clardy]

Chuck. I liked it so well I stole your pictures and made a file in my shop round-to-it projects folder.:o

I need to make a scrub plane from an old #4 also.
I may work on a 20 degreer first though after seeing your excellent example you have made.:D

Sure glad you posted. :D :D :D

[Chuck Hamman]

Steve,
That's great. If nothing else we can take pride in knowing that we own the only two Stanley Improved Mitres in existence :-)

[Randal Stevenson]

It's amazing all the money spent for a piece of Ash! :D

[Steve Clardy]

Steve,
That's great. If nothing else we can take pride in knowing that we own the only two Stanley Improved Mitres in existence :-)

Twins? :eek: :D

Here I am hijacking Brian's thread :o

[Phil Clark]

Don & Chuck - oh how I wish I had looked at this thread this morning instead of tonight. I just finished a workshop where I was teaching use of handplanes including a shooting board. Both ideas are excellent and will be pursued in my shop.

[Steve Clardy]

Steve,
That's great. If nothing else we can take pride in knowing that we own the only two Stanley Improved Mitres in existence :-)


Chuck. How about putting a Boss 429 emblem and some flames :eek: on the side of that. ;) ;) ;) :D

Just kidding. I keep coming back to your original post for some reason.:confused:

[Chuck Hamman]

Steve,
I think I'm too old to put flames on anything :D but you should feel free.

It's funny you should mention that Mustang. I never had a Boss 429 - I owned a Dodge "Swinger" - 340cc, Holly 4B, 4-speed tranny. There was one night, many years ago out on the bypass (in my less responsible days) -a Boss 429 blew my doors off. :(
Ahh,the muscle car days!

But back to handplanes: I made this plane because I was looking for something to dedicate for use with a shooting board and I really like the look of the old Improved Mitre planes. To be quite honest I don't see how this shape is an improvement over the box shaped mitres such as the Stanley #9. I wonder if anyone knows why they were called "Improved" mitres?
Harry's suggestion of a skewed bladed plane, IMO would be the ultimate configuration. If I was going to start from scratch to design a mitre plane that is where I would start.

-Chuck

[josh bjork]

Brian,
Don't go looking for this one on ebay or at the flea market, you'll have to make your own. I made this one from a Handyman #4. The infill replacing the original frog provides a bed angle of 20 Degs. It is more comfortable to hold than the standard Stanley configuration. If I keep a good edge on the stock blade it works very well on my shooting board. One of these days I'll buy a Hock or LN replacement for it.

-Chuck

Those pictures are a good wakeup call on monday morning!

[Brian Kent]

Is there a plan or instructions out there for building a skew plane or a low angle plane?

I assume I could build a Krenov style plane, angle the part that supports the blade, then mark and grind the blade to fit.

For a low angle plane I can picture how to build it but I have questions about holding the blade in place. Would the regular Krenov-style wedge be firm enough? Actually, I really like Chuck's idea of using the stanley blade, chip breaker and cap. I hope to copy that idea.

Any step-by-steps out there???

[Chuck Hamman]

Brian,
The only example I could recall was this panel raising plane
http://www.taunton.com/finewoodworking/FWNPDF/011030059.pdf

If you eliminate the modification to the sole.

-Chuck

[Danny Thompson]

Semi-hijack alert:

So, I did just happen to trip over $250 last weekend and am trying to decide the best use for it. After briefly considering the Nintendo Wii, my attention has shifted to the Veritas Bevel-Up Planes. Currently, in the hand plane department I have access to a circa 1965 Stanley #5, I own a cheap standard block plane, and, a couple of months ago, through an act of pure impulsive lust, picked up a Lie-Nielsen #140 Skew Block Plane (She is a blonde, after all.).

Now I'm looking for one that cooks and cleans.

After reading Derek Cohen's review, I am thinking the Veritas BU Jointer may be the most versatile plane of the 3 Verital Bevel-Up Planes--Jointer, Smoother, and LA Jack--and may be the most versatile plane on the market.

Do you agree?
Would you recommend something different?
A2 or O1?

Danny

[Brian Kent]

Since I own "none of the above" I can pretend I know what I'm talking about - get the Jack with one extra blade.

If you had won $500, I would recommend buying two bevel-up jacks and sending me one.

[Joe Meazle]

Danny,
Let me start by saying I love my BU jointer form LV. It is probably the finest plane I have used straight out of the box.
Of the three I fell the Jack is the most versatile. You cannot shoot with the jointer and you can't use the edge of the plane for a makeshift straight edge while flattening boards. This is due to only a small portion for the sides being machined.
Joe

[Peter Tremblay]

I can't recommend the LV Low angle Jack enough

it is long enough to do some shorter jointing work and small enought to do some smoothing work. end grain is a joy (shooting) and it works great to hog off wood because of its low center of gravity and its weight, it just feels great at work. With two blades (that is what i have) it is by far the most versitile plane that i can think of.

at one point i was working hard at expanding my plane selection but after getting the LV LA Jack ive focused on other things (namely saws). i have yet to use it for something and think that i really needed another plane.

of course the only exception is i do have the low angle block but i see you have one of those.

peter

[Danny Thompson]

Ah! I see. I was wondering why they made a fence for the jointer. But if I already "have" a Stanley #5? and the Skew LA Block can handle end grain, right?

I guess a big concern for me is that I don't own a power jointer, either, so I thought I needed the length of a jointer for jointing long boards. No?

Joe, curious, when do you use your BU jointer? and are there any other benefits of the Jack over the jointer? Jointer over the Jack?

[Joe Meazle]

Danny,

A lot of times will flatten a board with a Millers Falls #22 or #24 (same as a Bailey #7 or #8). Then take the last few passes with the BU jointer. The MF planes I have are pretty good but that LV is super tuned. This really minimizes the amount of time with the smoothing plane. I also had some curly maple to flatten and was able to put a higher angle iron in and close the mouth up. With a sharp iron I got no tear out. I also did a sitting bench out of southern yellow pine. The low angle iron and a tight mouth did a great job on that project. The low center of gravity makes it a great for jointing edges too.

What do you use your # 5 for? Stock removal? Small scale jointing? Shooting?

It sounds like you are looking for a Jointer and the LV BU is a good one. Be warned I know very few people with just one BU plane. I got the Jack first and ordered the jointer the day it came out. The smoother act like it being magnetically pulled to the surface. It is very easy to adjust and is very precise. I still enjoy using my old Miller Falls Bailey style bench planes but if I could only have 3 bench planes they would be the LV BU Jointer, jack and Smoother. Various angel irons are all interchangeable.

The BU Jack is great for shooting and flatening small boards and enital flatening of mid sized panels table tops etc.

[Danny Thompson]

I have only used the #5 on a couple of occasions--chamfering an edge and smoothing another. I have a long way to go on the learning curve, and am really not at the level that would require a fine tool like an LV or LN.

On the other hand, I am done with buying cheap tools that require me to be more expert than I am and eventually rebuy later. I figure a great tool in great hands is best; a mediocre tool in great hands is second; a way back is a great tool in mediocre hands; but worst of all is a mediocre tool in mediocre hands. So, I'll go with a great tool and try to work up to better hands.

Anyway, you've given me some food for thought. Now, who was that that prefered bevel-down? Maybe they want to downsize their collection.

[Joe Meazle]

There is little risk in buying a quality hand plane. Resale is usually pretty darn good, much better than tailed tools. Put that # 5 to work and see where it is coming up short for you the fill that gap and then fill the next gap. You will end up with more and more planes and smaller and smaller gaps. I think your work will get better too. Or maybe you will just get better at justifying tool purchases.;)

[Peter Tremblay]

in regards to that last comment from joe i could not agree more.

i once heard a wise women (on another forum) say something like "buy the tool and see what it won't do rather than buying all the tools that you think you might need"

to me that means that it is easier to make do with one tool that does lots of things than buying lots of tools, then go from there and buy the tools that you know you need.

i hope that makes sense

peter

[John Borgwardt]

If I can pull it off there will be triplets. LOL :-)