Amazon mishap

[Dan Lautner]

I ordered a 30 clamp Bessey set from Amazon for $ 208 with free shipping. A week later I received a box with 15 clamps that were packaged adequately. I called to see if another box was on its way. They told me there was a problem with supply and they could charge me half of the price for the 15 or I could wait a month for the other 15 clamps. In this case I kept the clamps but I would be very upset if this was something I needed and got that excuse from them. If Amazon wants to sell stuff at a discount to clear stock that is great but to not have the merchandise and give a lame excuse a week later is not acceptable. This is my first bad dealing with them in 5 purchases. Have others had this sort of problem with Amazon?

Dan

[Andrew Williams]

My most recent order from Amazon was also negative. I ordered three items which all stated "in stock and ships today". I chose "super saver shipping" and then after placing the order saw that my order was not to arrive for another 45 days! All three items still read "in stock" even after one day. Impatient, I changed the order to "standard shipping", to find out that two of the three items would ship that day, and the third one was now downgraded to "4-6 weeks", from "in stock". Had they been up front about this in the first place, I would not have placed the order for the third item and still taken advantage of super saver shipping. As it stands, I paid for shipping on two items and cancelled the third. I probably should have cancelled the entire order and am now reticent to place orders with them, knowing that they can change the status of an item after you buy it. Reading some other recent negatives is also not reassuring.

I know a lot of people sing the praises of Amazon on this board, but to me, they are just another enormous corporate entity who try to give "customer service" but who are simply too large to really address any specific issues, unless their computerized solutions are in place to deal with them as contingencies. I will most likely downgrade Amazon to a place to buy books and CDs, but not tools or bicycle parts or anything I really need.

I challenge some living human being from Amazon to take the time to read this board and put up a presence here. Other suppliers do that, and it shows that they care, and the result is usually increased business and positive perception.

[Bruce Page]

All of my dealings with Amazon have been positive.

Stuff happens but overall I think they do a good job.

[David DeCristoforo]

Amazon really has little control over stock because they don't stock anything. Everything you order from Amazon is drop shipped from a vendor. Most of the glitches in Amazon's stock reporting has to do with the failure of the vendor to keep this information updated. Even, so I know how frustrating this can be. We ordered a commercial wheat grass juicer for our cafe from an online kitchen supply "clearing house". We were charged for the item and the shipping estimate was a week or so. After four weeks passed we contacted the seller and were told that the manufacturer was backordered. After another several weeks has passed, we contacted the manufacturer to inquire as to the ETA. We were told that they were waiting for parts to come back from "the plater". When I asked for "something a bit more in the nature of a date", the guy told me that if I could promise him that he would get his parts from the plater by Wednesday, he could promise me that he could ship our juicer by the end of the week. That's almost an exact quote. Well, obviously, I could make no such promise so I continued to wait. That was two weeks ago and still no juicer!

[Dave Sweeney]

I read, reread and reread again you post and I can't see where the "problem" is. Companies run out of inventory all the time, it's a fact of life. I thought that their offer to credit you half your money back was an honorable alternative to having you wait a month for the backorder and not a lame excuse at all.

[Bruce Benjamin]

My most recent order from Amazon was also negative. I ordered three items which all stated "in stock and ships today". I chose "super saver shipping" and then after placing the order saw that my order was not to arrive for another 45 days! All three items still read "in stock" even after one day. Impatient, I changed the order to "standard shipping", to find out that two of the three items would ship that day, and the third one was now downgraded to "4-6 weeks", from "in stock". Had they been up front about this in the first place, I would not have placed the order for the third item and still taken advantage of super saver shipping. As it stands, I paid for shipping on two items and cancelled the third. I probably should have cancelled the entire order and am now reticent to place orders with them, knowing that they can change the status of an item after you buy it. Reading some other recent negatives is also not reassuring.

While Amazon did screw up in not updating their website, why didn't you just call them or email them before changing your shipping preference? You were so impatient that you didn't have time for an email or phone call? Then you could've at least had the benefit of dealing with a real person. They probably would've resolved the shipping issue with you then. It doesn't sound like you even gave them a chance to solve the problem.


I know a lot of people sing the praises of Amazon on this board, but to me, they are just another enormous corporate entity who try to give "customer service" but who are simply too large to really address any specific issues, unless their computerized solutions are in place to deal with them as contingencies. I will most likely downgrade Amazon to a place to buy books and CDs, but not tools or bicycle parts or anything I really need.

Your use of the word, "Any" is wrong. Absolutely, positively false. Amazon has dealt with countless problems on a specific level. I've had 2 or 3 problems with them myself and the person on the phone, (and once via email) bent over backwards everytime to do what it took to make me happy. Once, in a similar situation to yours, they not only shipped the item via Next Day Air as soon as it came in but they refunded about half of my money too. And instead of coming in 4 or 5 weeks later it came in about a week later. I figure I got it at least as fast as the Super Saver shipping and handling would've got it to me. You really should've called them instead of changing your shipping method in such a hurry.

I've heard of positive stories many times from other people on various forums too. They're not perfect all of the time but there are very few Amazon screwups posted compared to the number or success stories. You aren't going to have any company manage an online inventory as huge as Amazon's with the sales volume that they have and have a 100% success rate. Name any other company that has the volume and consistently low prices that Amazon does that provides better customer service. In fact there aren't many smaller companies that so happily take back merchandise and offer free shipping on so many products while providing very low prices, frequently the lowest prices.

I challenge some living human being from Amazon to take the time to read this board and put up a presence here. Other suppliers do that, and it shows that they care, and the result is usually increased business and positive perception.

How many other companies do what you are saying? You can probably count them on only one hand. Does Wood Craft monitor this site? I've had outstanding CS from them. How 'bout Rockler? Again, premium CS. Hartville Tool? No, I think they only monitor that other WW forum and even then I don't think it's constant. But they still provide fantastic CS. Another company that really treated me right in the past was Woodworker's Supply. They don't monitor this forum either. Amazon has provided me with equally good CS. But just because they don't have a person monitoring a relatively obscure woodworking forum doesn't mean they don't care. You do understand that the revenue spent by the members of this forum at Amazon probably amounts to a very small drop in the bucket, right? There's a reason they have an email address and phone number. It's so you can contact them when a problem like yours arises. And to be honest, it sounds to me like part of the problem was your fault. Changing shipping methods without first contacting them to find out the problem probably wasn't the best choice. Is it too late to change the shipping back to Super Saver?

One difference I see when dealing with a smaller company versus a giant like Amazon is in how they deal with problems. With the smaller companies there are fewer people handling the phones, in some cases only one or two. With the giants there could be a hundred or more, who knows? This can be good or bad depending on the problem. Call a mom and pop store and they may not handle the problem to your satisfaction. What are you going to do? Call back and disguise your voice? You're talking to the same person! Call Amazon and the likelihood of talking to the same person is less so you may get a better result. Yet, if you need to you can probably ask to speak with the person you spoke to before. Another related offshoot to this is that if you get a CS rep at Amazon who either doesn't know what they are talking about or refuses to be reasonable you can't blame the company as a whole. It's hard to have a huge staff and have them all be gems all the time. But if you get a jerk at a small company the odds are the company either knows about it and doesn't care or that is the company policy.

It was just a few short steps with Jointech from the lady who answered the phone, to one or two techs, to the owner/inventor of the company. The first few were just difficult to deal with because they were rather dense, (or maybe just numb from working for the owner). The owner ended up providing me with the absolute worst customer service experience of my life or anyone else's I've ever heard of. This was over a period of time that included numerous phone calls and an exchange/attempted repair of a product. The end result was that I just gave up, realizing that my only other recourse was legal action. It wasn't worth it to me. But the point being, I'd come to realize that the whole company is rotten to the core because I'd dealt with them all. Amazon has so many people that you can always talk to someone else and you might get a better result. By the way, if anyone is interested in the Jointech fiasco, PM me and I'll send you a link to the detailed review I did when it happened

Bruce

[Bruce Benjamin]

Amazon really has little control over stock because they don't stock anything. Everything you order from Amazon is drop shipped from a vendor. Most of the glitches in Amazon's stock reporting has to do with the failure of the vendor to keep this information updated.


I don't think that any of this is true. I think they do have warehouses, in fact I'm nearly sure of it. Therefore the glitches are their fault and you can't blame the vendors. With the volume of orders they have, can you imagine how bad things would be if they had to rely on other companies for every one of their orders shipping out? No, sorry but you're wrong on this one.

Bruce

[Kim Spence]

I read, reread and reread again you post and I can't see where the "problem" is. Companies run out of inventory all the time, it's a fact of life. I thought that their offer to credit you half your money back was an honorable alternative to having you wait a month for the backorder and not a lame excuse at all.
In my view, the "problem" was that Amazon didn't bother to notify Mr. Lautner that there was a change in status of his order. He only found out the real story by calling them himself. They should have called or emailed him as soon as they discovered the problem so he could make an informed decision on whether to cancle the order BEFORE he received half of the order.

[David DeCristoforo]

"...I think they do have warehouses, in fact I'm nearly sure of it. Therefore the glitches are their fault..."

I have never ordered anything from Amazon that was not shipped from another vendor. And I never said it was not "their fault", just that they have limited control over the vendors stock. My own personal experience with Amazon has been all over the map. Sometimes I get stuff right away and sometimes it gets snarled up. My big problem is that I hate shopping so if I need something, I'd rather order it on line and have it delivered than have to go somewhere to get it. My "pet peeve" is when you pay extra for "expedited shipping" and they don't actually ship the item for a week but still charge you the extra because it is "expedited" from the date of shipping, not the date of the order.

[Robert Conner]

I have two very positive recent experiences with Amazon. The items I ordered ( a Delta Cast Iron Extension Table and a Brett Guard) were free shipping with estimated arrival of 5-7 days. Both items were shipped within One Day. The prices were far cheaper then other vendors including a Well Known Delta seller who I am still waiting for a refund from for a POOR quality "Delta Extension Table" that I returned at his suggestion.
I would have No Problem ordering from Amazon again.
Robert

[Gary Keedwell]

Amazon has done good by me.:cool:

Gary K.

[Eugene A. Manzo III]

I have only had positive experiences with them. I have dealt with them for a few years and think they do great.

[Dan Lautner]

"I read, reread and reread again you post and I can't see where the "problem" is. Companies run out of inventory all the time, it's a fact of life. I thought that their offer to credit you half your money back was an honorable alternative to having you wait a month for the backorder and not a lame excuse at all."

The problem is that they told me "in stock" when I hit the buy button. To me in stock means if I buy it, they have it ready to ship out. When I buy from Lee Valley I never worry about getting the item. They tell you flat out if they have the item before you buy. Lee Valley should be the Holy grail for other net vendors to follow. I love the deals you can get from Amazon, but if I must have something I will now tend to look at big box or local retailers more often. One last thing about Lee Valley, They have the best CS I have ever seen from any company and that means a lot to me when plunking down hard earned cash.

Dan

[Tim Marks]

There's a reason they have an email address and phone number.
I swear that Amazon has a "dirty word" autoreplier on their email. Only after replying to each email to about 4-5 emails deep does a human actually read your email and reply. So don't feel frustrated when the email response just doesn't catch the gist of your problem. Bounce it back a few more times and a human will intervene. Possibly better then staying on hold for an extended period of time, but if you need an answer in a hurry, pick up the phone and call them in India...

That being said, once you make it past the "electronic shield", Amazon CS seems to go above and beyond the call of duty... Dewalt 735 that I purchased for $399 with another $25 off got dropped in shipping... since it was a few days before christmas the sent one OVERNIGHT without my asking (it wasn't a present) without even waiting for the damaged one to come back... overnight shiping on 100# has gotta cost at least $100.

[Rob Bodenschatz]

Amazon really has little control over stock because they don't stock anything. Everything you order from Amazon is drop shipped from a vendor.

Wow. People: Don't believe everything you read on the internet. Statements like that make me pause to wonder why I visit boards like this.

Here's an article in Business Week about one of Amazon's fulfillment centers:
http://images.businessweek.com/ss/05/12/amazon/index_01.htm?campaign_id=rss_tech

[Paul Johnstone]

Just always follow my rule:

Never order anything from Amazon that you're in a hurry for.

You can't trust their estimates.. it comes when it comes..
I think the OP has a legitimate complaint when the website shows it's "in stock" and will ship soon, and then it takes forever.

I've had it happen to me numerous times. In fact, I only deal with Amazon when it's one of their insane crazy deals.. I get much better service and comparable (or better) prices other places for routine purchases.

[John W Parker]

Amazon is horable as a tool supplier. I won't go into details but I went through a three week nightmare with them. After half a dozen phone calls and as many different excuses I gave up and cancelled the order. This was my first and last dealing with Amazon.

[David DeCristoforo]

Wow. People: Don't believe everything you read on the internet. Statements like that make me pause to wonder why I visit boards like this.

OK...I'll eat some crow. But I have ordered cameras, appliances, computer parts, you name it and the items have always been drop shipped from the vendor. Maybe it's just that Amazon does not stock the kind of stuff I usually order. I appoligize to anyone who's faith in reality was shaken by my comments. Please don't abandon the internet or this board.

[Bruce Benjamin]

"...I think they do have warehouses, in fact I'm nearly sure of it. Therefore the glitches are their fault..."

I have never ordered anything from Amazon that was not shipped from another vendor. And I never said it was not "their fault", just that they have limited control over the vendors stock. My own personal experience with Amazon has been all over the map. Sometimes I get stuff right away and sometimes it gets snarled up. My big problem is that I hate shopping so if I need something, I'd rather order it on line and have it delivered than have to go somewhere to get it. My "pet peeve" is when you pay extra for "expedited shipping" and they don't actually ship the item for a week but still charge you the extra because it is "expedited" from the date of shipping, not the date of the order.


David, you may have only received items drop shipped from another vendor but when an item on Amazon is shipped from a vendor it says very clearly who the item is sold by and that company is the one responsible for the shipping. Usually it's right near the price and shipping info above the item description. Otherwise, it's in a huge Amazon warehouse, as is evidenced by the article. If you look at the, "New and used" link near the, "Sold by" area, it will take you to alternative vendors for the product, if there are any.

Bruce

[Samuel Mill]

Amazon really has little control over stock because they don't stock anything. Everything you order from Amazon is drop shipped from a vendor. Most of the glitches in Amazon's stock reporting has to do with the failure of the vendor to keep this information updated. Even, so I know how frustrating this can be. We ordered a commercial wheat grass juicer for our cafe from an online kitchen supply "clearing house". We were charged for the item and the shipping estimate was a week or so. After four weeks passed we contacted the seller and were told that the manufacturer was backordered. After another several weeks has passed, we contacted the manufacturer to inquire as to the ETA. We were told that they were waiting for parts to come back from "the plater". When I asked for "something a bit more in the nature of a date", the guy told me that if I could promise him that he would get his parts from the plater by Wednesday, he could promise me that he could ship our juicer by the end of the week. That's almost an exact quote. Well, obviously, I could make no such promise so I continued to wait. That was two weeks ago and still no juicer!

It is, or at least it used to be, against fair trade and credit regulations in many states to charge a credit card for merchandise before that was not available to ship. You might want to check on that, and if true for your location (or the vendor's) gently remind him of it...

-Sam

[Samuel Mill]

OK...I'll eat some crow. But I have ordered cameras, appliances, computer parts, you name it and the items have always been drop shipped from the vendor. Maybe it's just that Amazon does not stock the kind of stuff I usually order. I appoligize to anyone who's faith in reality was shaken by my comments. Please don't abandon the internet or this board.

Amazon informs you "this item ships from Amazon" or "this item ships from vendor X" at some point in the process. I can't recall with certainty whether that is before or after it is placed in the shopping cart. I'm sure that what you posted is valid for items that do ship directly from another vendor. Amazon would need to get accurate, real-time stock reports from that vendor; it wouldn't do Amazon much good to run even a short term perpetual inventory from a known physical count, as most of those vendors are probably fulfilling their own orders from that same stock. Multi-vendor electronic supply chains can easily develop kinks.

-Sam

[Bill Arnold]

Amazon informs you "this item ships from Amazon" or "this item ships from vendor X" at some point in the process. I can't recall with certainty whether that is before or after it is placed in the shopping cart. ... -Sam
The item description page states clearly whether an item ships from Amazon or one of their partners. If I order something that will be shipped from one of their partners, I check the partner website to compare pricing and shipping rates. Everything usually matches but, on a recent purchase, the shipping rate quoted by Amazon was half that quoted by the partner site.

The only negative experience I've had was actually not Amazon's fault. FedEx was to deliver a scroll saw but never showed up on the scheduled day. I emailed Amazon CS and got a response within a couple of hours. When they traced the shipment, they found that FedEx had literally dropped the box off a truck at the distribution facility. The expedited delivery of a replacement and I received it two days later. When I checked the saw, there was some very minor cosmetic damage (1/4" paint scrape) on the end of the motor. I took a digital photo and e-mailed it to Amazon CS. Within an hour or so, I got a response where they gave me the option of exchanging the saw or accepting a 20% discount. I took the discount and dabbed a drop of black paint on the scrape!

:)

[Bruce Benjamin]

The item description page states clearly whether an item ships from Amazon or one of their partners. If I order something that will be shipped from one of their partners, I check the partner website to compare pricing and shipping rates. Everything usually matches but, on a recent purchase, the shipping rate quoted by Amazon was half that quoted by the partner site.

The only negative experience I've had was actually not Amazon's fault. FedEx was to deliver a scroll saw but never showed up on the scheduled day. I emailed Amazon CS and got a response within a couple of hours. When they traced the shipment, they found that FedEx had literally dropped the box off a truck at the distribution facility. The expedited delivery of a replacement and I received it two days later. When I checked the saw, there was some very minor cosmetic damage (1/4" paint scrape) on the end of the motor. I took a digital photo and e-mailed it to Amazon CS. Within an hour or so, I got a response where they gave me the option of exchanging the saw or accepting a 20% discount. I took the discount and dabbed a drop of black paint on the scrape!

:)

What!!! That's HORRIBLE customer service!!! I would NEVER buy from them again!!! 20%?? It should be FREE!!! This would NEVER happen with LEE VALLEY!!! They personally deliver each and every package wearing padded moleskin gloves and give you a lesson on how to use it! Blah blah blah...I think I've read a lot more Amazon success stories like your's than negative ones. Good deal.:cool:

Bruce

[Jeffrey Schronce]

I don't think that any of this is true. I think they do have warehouses, in fact I'm nearly sure of it. Therefore the glitches are their fault and you can't blame the vendors. With the volume of orders they have, can you imagine how bad things would be if they had to rely on other companies for every one of their orders shipping out? No, sorry but you're wrong on this one.

Bruce

Correct. I am 100% positive they have many warehouses. Most tools are in Carlisle PA and somewhere in KY. That is where 90% of my Amazon tool purchases come from. I notice a lot of Incra stuff ships from a Nevada warehouse. I have seen the physical warehouse in Carlisle a few times so I know it exists!

[David Weaver]

I have had mixed experiences with Amazon, mostly due to the customer service being overseas AND to them being unfamiliar with tools, and I'm not being a biggot about the overseas part.

I have ordered probably 15 large items from them - $200 or more, and I had issues only with two. One was a table saw - some of the boxes came from one place and some came from another. They weren't really aware of where the boxes were coming from and the carrier wasn't aware when they shipped the first part of the order that it wasn't the entire order. Because of that, I got excited and thought I had been charged for an entire table saw (which the receipt on the box said) and sent only a Biesemeyer fence. The rest of the saw arrived three days later, so I had to take a second day of vacation to get the saw, and was lucky my work schedule allowed.

The second issue I had was ordering a grip-tite system. I ordered the whole system, got charged for the whole system, and received only one of the grip-tite featherboards (the system is two featherboards, a DVD and a metal overlay for a Bies fence). The featherboard had the wrong scan tag on it, and to their system, looked like a whole system. To anyone with sense, it would've been obvious they were labeled wrong (a 42" piece of stamped steel doesn't fit in a tiny box), but no matter what I tried, I couldn't explain to C no S that it was labeled wrong and what the difference was between one featherboard and the whole system. I knew it was labeled wrong, and the entire group of stock was probably labeled wrong, too, but the CS rep wanted to send another one and have me send mine back.

Two days later I get the same thing again. One magnetic featherboard and paperwork stating that the whole 42" system was in box smaller than a shoebox, and a receipt that said the same thing, with a comment that I could only send the product back if I didn't open it. This time, I didn't open it, I just sent it back, clipped a 25% coupon out of the Rockler circular and got it there.

It was almost impossible for me to understand the CS representatives both times, and when I called the tool center, they informed me that they took orders but didn't do CS. I spent a total of probably 4 or 5 hours on the phone with respect to the two orders, and for the money I saved getting from there, it wasn't worth it.

The other 13 or so orders have come just fine, without a hitch.

I have taken, from those two experiences, the lesson that if I do something that involves CS, I should order from elsewhere. If the item is not likely to be confused with something else, then I will still order from Amazon if they offer a good deal. No more large tools that involve coordinating delivery, and no more items where a part could be confused with a system or a kit.

[Mike Heidrick]

I love amazon and the only problems I have had were when there was pricing mistakes but I still wanted the item at that price.

The largest Delta tools I own I have purchased from Amazon (on those crazy pricing deals in the middle of the night usually on weekends - 50%-75% off!! CRAZY!! - 20" planer, 12" jointer, 5hp cyclone, 5hp shaper).

They said shipped from and sold by amazon.com and the shipping manifest showed they were all dropped shipped directly from Delta. Now many of those same tools say shipped from and sold by CPO Delta Woodworking. Maybe they switched recently?

I know Amazon has at least four warehouses of their own they ship from - KY, OK, OH, PA on a recent order.

Amazon is great. I have saved a TON of money but in the same regards thay get most all of my WW tool business (except what I can send to Brian and Mark).

[Carl Crout]

How many other companies do what you are saying? You can probably count them on only one hand. Does Wood Craft monitor this site? I've had outstanding CS from them. How 'bout Rockler? Again, premium CS. Hartville Tool? No, I think they only monitor that other WW forum and even then I don't think it's constant. But they still provide fantastic CS. Another company that really treated me right in the past was Woodworker's Supply. They don't monitor this forum either. Amazon has provided me with equally good CS. But just because they don't have a person monitoring a relatively obscure woodworking forum doesn't mean they don't care. You do understand that the revenue spent by the members of this forum at Amazon probably amounts to a very small drop in the bucket, right? There's a reason they have an email address and phone number. It's so you can contact them when a problem like yours arises. And to be honest, it sounds to me like part of the problem was your fault. Changing shipping methods without first contacting them to find out the problem probably wasn't the best choice. Is it too late to change the shipping back to Super Saver?

One difference I see when dealing with a smaller company versus a giant like Amazon is in how they deal with problems. With the smaller companies there are fewer people handling the phones, in some cases only one or two. With the giants there could be a hundred or more, who knows? This can be good or bad depending on the problem. Call a mom and pop store and they may not handle the problem to your satisfaction. What are you going to do? Call back and disguise your voice? You're talking to the same person! Call Amazon and the likelihood of talking to the same person is less so you may get a better result. Yet, if you need to you can probably ask to speak with the person you spoke to before. Another related offshoot to this is that if you get a CS rep at Amazon who either doesn't know what they are talking about or refuses to be reasonable you can't blame the company as a whole. It's hard to have a huge staff and have them all be gems all the time. But if you get a jerk at a small company the odds are the company either knows about it and doesn't care or that is the company policy.

It was just a few short steps with Jointech from the lady who answered the phone, to one or two techs, to the owner/inventor of the company. The first few were just difficult to deal with because they were rather dense, (or maybe just numb from working for the owner). The owner ended up providing me with the absolute worst customer service experience of my life or anyone else's I've ever heard of. This was over a period of time that included numerous phone calls and an exchange/attempted repair of a product. The end result was that I just gave up, realizing that my only other recourse was legal action. It wasn't worth it to me. But the point being, I'd come to realize that the whole company is rotten to the core because I'd dealt with them all. Amazon has so many people that you can always talk to someone else and you might get a better result. By the way, if anyone is interested in the Jointech fiasco, PM me and I'll send you a link to the detailed review I did when it happened

Bruce

Turn off the bold text. It's hard to read and nearly as rude as all caps.:(

[Bruce Benjamin]

Turn off the bold text. It's hard to read and nearly as rude as all caps.:(

Or, you could just not read it...The reason for the bold text was that much of my reply was embedded in the quote of the post to which I was replying. That seemed pretty obvious to me. Would you rather just try to guess what part was mine and what part was the quote? But thanks for the lesson. By the way, I've been using the internet for at least a dozen years so I'm pretty familiar with what text means what. Did this really warrant a :( ?

Bruce

[Nancy Laird]

How many other companies do what you are saying? You can probably count them on only one hand. Does Wood Craft monitor this site? I've had outstanding CS from them. How 'bout Rockler? Again, premium CS. Hartville Tool? No, I think they only monitor that other WW forum and even then I don't think it's constant. But they still provide fantastic CS. Another company that really treated me right in the past was Woodworker's Supply. They don't monitor this forum either. Bruce

Bruce, the "company" itself may not monitor this forum, but I can tell you that two members certainly do. LOML works for WWS and I do demos for them, so we watch for all the comments about them--good or bad--and they ARE relayed to the owner/president.

Nancy (108 days)

[Nancy Laird]

Turn off the bold text. It's hard to read and nearly as rude as all caps.:(

And your comment is ruder than the bold text, Carl. Why don't you find something positive to say?

[Bruce Benjamin]

Bruce, the "company" itself may not monitor this forum, but I can tell you that two members certainly do. LOML works for WWS and I do demos for them, so we watch for all the comments about them--good or bad--and they ARE relayed to the owner/president.

Nancy (108 days)

Well, that's good to know. I like them and have been well treated in the past. But how many of them actually reply or participate in some way? In this case, you do since you do some work for them. But there are very few that have an actual presence here. Dino from Eureka Zone is a good one that comes to mind. Not only does he answer questions about his company but he donates very expensive tools to help a charitable cause, (the Freedom Pens).

Bruce

[Wilbur Pan]

Or, you could just not read it...The reason for the bold text was that much of my reply was embedded in the quote of the post to which I was replying.
Bruce, I would agree that all bold text is hard on the eyes. Much like typing in all caps when the only forums were one Usenet, all bold face looks like screaming.


That seemed pretty obvious to me. Would you rather just try to guess what part was mine and what part was the quote?
Luckily, when replying point by point to a post, one can cut and paste the codes that begin and end the text to break up the quotes, and insert your comments in between that way. In fact, the process is nearly identical to posting comments in bold, except using quote and /quote for the tags, instead of b and /b.

You can also use the "Preview Post" button to check your post to make sure all the quote and /quote tags match up.


But thanks for the lesson. By the way, I've been using the internet for at least a dozen years so I'm pretty familiar with what text means what. Did this really warrant a :( ?
Well, I don't know if it warranted a :(, but I learn new things every day, even if I had been doing something for a dozen years.


Bruce
Wilbur

[Bruce Benjamin]

Bruce, I would agree that all bold text is hard on the eyes. Much like typing in all caps when the only forums were one Usenet, all bold face looks like screaming.


Luckily, when replying point by point to a post, one can cut and paste the codes that begin and end the text to break up the quotes, and insert your comments in between that way. In fact, the process is nearly identical to posting comments in bold, except using quote and /quote for the tags, instead of b and /b.

You can also use the "Preview Post" button to check your post to make sure all the quote and /quote tags match up.


Well, I don't know if it warranted a :(, but I learn new things every day, even if I had been doing something for a dozen years.


Wilbur

Yes, Wilbur. I realize that you can cut and paste the codes. It's a pain in the xxxxxx and I don't usually bother. It's much easier to post the embedded text in bold the way I did and I will continue to do so. Reading your post all chopped up like that isn't exactly easy on the eyes either. I gave the reason why I posted the way I did. I've wasted enough time responding to librarians as to why I posted the way I did. You didn't teach me anything today that I didn't already know. If you don't like it, don't read it. Thank you.:)


profanity is prohibited even in the form used

[Wilbur Pan]

Yes, Wilbur. I realize that you can cut and paste the codes. It's a pain in the xxxxxx and I don't usually bother. It's much easier to post the embedded text in bold the way I did and I will continue to do so.

If some cutting and pasting is too much of a bother, have you considered an alternative to bold, such as changing the text color? It seems to be just as easy as bold facing everything. It's also an accepted modality of helping to keep comments associated with their author in chat rooms, which is the closest thing to interspersing comments within a quote that I can think of.

Reading your post all chopped up like that isn't exactly easy on the eyes either.

True, but it is preferable to the constant use of bold face. A change in text color is also much more readable than all bold face for this purpose.

I gave the reason why I posted the way I did. I've wasted enough time responding to librarians as to why I posted the way I did.

I'm not a librarian.

You didn't teach me anything today that I didn't already know. If you don't like it, don't read it. Thank you.:)
No, thank you for clarifying that you were in full possession of this knowledge, and for taking the time to explain your position! :)

[Gary Keedwell]

No, thank you for clarifying that you were in full possession of this knowledge, and for taking the time to explain your position! :)[/quote]
http://www.free-animations.co.uk/messages/miscellaneous/images/message_146.gif And very diplomatic.:rolleyes: :D

Gary K.

[Bob Childress]

And very diplomatic.:rolleyes: :D

Gary K.

Just like you and me. :D :D

[Gary Keedwell]

Just like you and me. :D :D
You got it mate.;) :p

Gary K.

[Raymond Fries]

I ordered a DW625 from in June of 2006 which I needed for to make christmas gifts. It was a really good deal and I was in no hurry. When the first week of November arrived and I was still getting pushed off, I cancelled the order and paid about $30 more and ordered from from another supplier as I needed it to make the gifts. Every four weeks or so I would get an email that the ship date was pushed out another 4 weeks.

This was the only bad experience with them and I have ordered quite a few things.

[Brad Sperr]

I'll cast another positive vote for Amazon, mostly for the occasional great deal. However, I also think their customer service is very good, especially with price adjustments and returns. I've waited months to get tools that were labeled "in stock soon" but it doesn't upset me since I'm just a hobbiest and my credit card doesn't get charged until shipment.

[Ralph Lindberg]

Lately we have had a number of problems with Amazon and "in stock" items.

The DW ordered a cooking tool she wanted, it was listed as "in stock", then she got the notice that it was back-ordered 45 days. Then I noticed that Amazon was showing three in stock and she contacted them, they said the in-stock listing was in error.

But she ordered a 2nd one to check, we got another 45 day notice, so she canceled the 2nd item.

A week before the first order was to ship, we got another 45 day back order. The web-site still said there were three in stock.

So she canceled the order I went to Camping World and picked it up that day (paid $10 more, but we were tired of waiting).

[Daniel Simon]

I've always had great success with Amazon. I order a lot of tools from them and will continue to do so in the future. Once or twice I had problems with damaged goods but they always seemed to find a way to correct the problem whether it be through refund, credit, or replacement. I always check with them beforehand on every tool purchase to see if they have the lower price. Needless to say, I usually order from them. To me, their customer service is second to none. Where else can you call a large company and actually speak to a live person without going through a recording? Their customer service reps are empowered to do what it takes to resolve the issues. Several times, I actually received more than I expected. That being said, I would not order something from them if I needed it quickly or overnight just because I know that in a large company, things do happen.

[David Weaver]

If I was looking for a big planer and they had a deal like you got on the DC580, I would have a lot of trouble laying off of it. A lot of trouble. That only comes in one crate, though, right?

In the end, they made everything right each time I ordered something, but I was frustrated with the grip-tite situation because if I could've talked to one person who spoke english well and knew tools, I could've had them straighten out a warehouse labeling issue and send me the right thing. Once they send you something wrong twice, you have no choice - they won't try it again, they just refund your money.

Two extra trips to ship a package (fortunately, they paid for that), lots of time spent on the phone, and a week and a half before I just went to Rockler, all the while with a pile of wood waiting to be ripped into thin strips.

But again, I would have a lot of trouble laying off the planer or DJ-30 if I was wanting something like that and it was half price. I wouldn't be able to resist.

[David George]

I'm surprised that anyone is...well, surprised by Amazon. You can do a comparison shop on just about anything and if Amazon is the cheapest, what are the chances that you'll actually get the entire order?

Had a customer that needed a price on a Porter-Cable router. Quoted him. He said, "well Amazon has it for 30 bucks cheaper". Really I said, then you should probably buy it there. "It's not in stock" he said. Really? How about I beat Amazons price by 5o bucks, would you buy it from me? "Sure I would!"
Well, I don't have it in stock either!!

Plus, is Amazon going to warranty that tool? Nope. What's it going to cost you to get it to a place that does?

I understand here the problem was with clamps but the bottom line is you can advertise any price you want. Having it in stock is another matter.

Dave

[Steven Triggs]

I just checked my order history, and I have placed 45 orders with Amazon over the past 6 months. Some of the orders were for as few as one item, some were for several items.

Every order arrived within the time frame that was listed when I made the purchase. I have never placed an order with them for something that claimed to be in-stock and later been notified that it was back-ordered.

Out of all of those orders, one was damaged in shipping (a miter saw). Amazon immediately shipped out a replacement, and sent UPS to pick up the damaged one. All I had to do was leave it on my porch for the driver.

One of the orders contained an item that was missing a feature claimed by the product description. I have since verified that this was a manufacturer mistake, not Amazon's mistake, in that the manufacturer's web site makes the same inaccurate claim. Anyway, Amazon offered to either provide a postage pre-paid return label and refund my money, or give me a 20% refund if I kept the item. I chose to keep it.

On at least half of the items, at some later date the price went down temporarily due to a sale. In all cases, all I had to do was contact Amazon and they immediately refunded me the difference. Sometimes I did this via the phone, and sometimes I did this via the web site. In all cases, it was easy. I can assure you those price adjustments went much more smoothly and quickly than they ever have for me when dealing with a "brick and mortar" employee face to face.

Christmas before last, I placed an order for several presents. A few days before Christmas, it was looking like the order might not make it in time. I called Amazon. They said they weren't certain the order would make it in time, so they offered to send a replacement order via overnight shipping (at their expense), along with a return label for when the original order arrived. Indeed, the replacement order arrived the next day. The original order ended up arriving before Christmas as well.

In the years I've been shopping with Amazon, I have only had a few problems arise. With the few problems I have encountered, they have gone "above and beyond" every time. I genuinely feel that I get better service from them than any other retailer; online, brick/mortar, big, or small.

Several posts have seemed to imply that the savings with Amazon are somewhat trivial. Often the savings are VERY significant. They offer so many promotions on top of their good prices, that you can come out with ridiculous deals. For example, I recently purchased a miter saw from them. It was $360 and due to a promotion included a free drill that I was able to sell for $140, resulting in a net price of $220. This is a saw that Lowe's sells for $399, so with tax would cost $426.93.

Finally, claims that their prices are so great because everything is out of stock are just wrong. They have an incredible amount of stock on hand. I would estimate that less than 5% of the "deals" that I've found on their site were out of stock. And about half of those were in-stock when I started considering them, but sold-out before I made up my mind. It is COMPLETELY understandable that when a company offers an incredible price to the entire country, and those deals get posted to countless web sites, such as happens on our forum, the item will sell out.

I'm done, at least for now...

[Jesse Espe]

Amazon has given me great CS. Handled problems by using both the super-secret phone number AND email. Both gave me lightning quick resolution.

Guess it just doesn't work out for everybody.

[Bob Moyer]

Wow. People: Don't believe everything you read on the internet. Statements like that make me pause to wonder why I visit boards like this.

Here's an article in Business Week about one of Amazon's fulfillment centers:
http://images.businessweek.com/ss/05/12/amazon/index_01.htm?campaign_id=rss_tech

Rob,

You are correct, they have one near me here in PA, it is located in Carlisle, I received my Bosch table saw in 24 hours from them; but I have also received DVD's and books from the same location.

[Mike Heidrick]

If I was looking for a big planer and they had a deal like you got on the DC580, I would have a lot of trouble laying off of it. A lot of trouble. That only comes in one crate, though, right?
..............
But again, I would have a lot of trouble laying off the planer or DJ-30 if I was wanting something like that and it was half price. I wouldn't be able to resist.

The planer and jointer come fully assembled and both come crated and palletized. On the DJ30 you uncrate and screw on the fence and on the DC580 you uncrate and attach the Dust Chute and a hand wheel. The prices were crazy - the kind where you just pull the trigger without hesitation for fear of loosing the price - and then just hope it ships.