Direct Marketing???

[Mark Koenig]

Have you tried mailing fliers to a specific business specialty???


Seems like an economical way to advertise so could any of you share some experiences or resource links for printing and distribution???


Dang newspaper wants over $800.00 for a TWO DAY Advertisement!!! :mad:


Don't want to wast my time and money again like the Craft Fair Fiasco...


Any help would be GREATLY appreciated...


Thanks Mark...

[Jude Kingery]

Hey Mark, while not a marketing expert, I can tell you it's easier to go with word of mouth, friends talk with friends, relationships between people do a lot to spread news - and pictures.

It always used to irk me the newspaper wanted to charge our nonprofit to advertise we were having a Volunteer training, so I found other ways to get them to print it. Granted, that was not a for-profit venture, but $800 is too much for a two day run. I'm not sure fliers are a good venue as most people toss them without even reading them.

If you could get media exposure for free, that'd be the ticket would be my best guess. By teaching a highschool class or doing a demo or something like that - and getting a reporter interested in an unusual story. Then it costs you nothing (well other than time and fun), public gets some education, you get exposure. Just some thoughts to consider. Hopefully it'll go well for you! Jude

[Joe Pelonio]

Having been in business now for 14 years, I have done just about everything in the way of marketing. I've only had the laser 3+ years but it's much the same as signs. I always ask new customers where they heard about me so I can track it.

The main thing to avoid is the yellow pages. Expensive and the sales people try to start a war among the competitors for larger and more colorful ads which serve only to increase their commissions.

Direct mailing is a method used successfully for high cost items, like roofs, remodeling, new windows etc. The percentage of people that respond is very low, but the dollar return can be high. If you are looking for sales of small inexpensive items it will not pay. I found radio to be the same way. I only tried it because a station waned to trade banners for 30 second spots.

What I have found to be the most effective is the already mentioned word-of-mouth. That can be enhanced by actually asking customers to tell their friends and business associates about you.

On newspaper ads, I'd never use the local big city paper, expensive and too easy for readers to overlook it. If you have a local paper, like our weekly "Sammamish Review" the ads start at $17 and people actually read it cover-to-cover since it's so small, and it's mailed to all residents free.

Probably the most cost effective advertising dollars are spent on either magnetic signs or lettering for your car or truck. You pay once and whenever you are parked or on the road people see it. I tell people to keep it simple, and include a website, hopefully a simple one that's easy to remember.

Since I now work at home and only take out the truck for deliveries/supplies 1-2 times a week, I have found that most new customers not coming from referal come from google searches.

[Darren Null]

As a way of attracting new custom, have you tried eBay? I sold a car recently and a LOT of people got to see my pitch- it cost me €23 or so.

Make a product or 2 and ebay them- include a link to your website (if you have one) or just mention at the bottom that you do other things.

EDIT: If you have a subject you can write about (coping with wood for the non-handyman DIYer, for example), you might be able to swap filled column inches for advertising space in one of the local rags.

[Mark Koenig]

I understand about word-of-mouth being the best advertisement… Unfortunately, from a business standpoint anyway, our population and contact with more industrial areas is very limited. We live in a very small town with very little industry.

Was thinking of mailing fliers to electrical contractors in larger cities for legend tags and such…

My brother-in-law has a handful of fliers and samples to take to his job site… He’s the “Boss Man” on his crew so it might pan out… They travel all over the country doing large plant installations... Started putting out flyers on bulletin boards for some added exposure but really am new to this part of the game…

Have been very successful learning Corel and developing products but now need to develop a marketing plan… Geez, guess that should of been first...

It will be about $100.00 with a lot of licking and stamping to contact the companies via fliers in Winston… Am I wasting my time???

Thanks Mark.

[Joe Pelonio]

Now I understand your situation a lot better. I thought you were talking about a direct mail service where flyers are mailed out to huge lists of people hoping some will be able to use your services.

I may do specific targeted mailings when things slow down this winter, to the tenants of the two shopping centers here in our little town. Most of my sign business is in the larger cities 10-20 miles away, and the laser work is even more spread out. One of my best laser customers is in Durham!

What I'd suggest in the case of electrical contractors is a letter or flyer in an envelope with a sample. Talk about how much better the quality of the text is with laser rather than rotary engraving, and include some kind of electrical symbol on it.

You might also consider companies with many employees in the same building, for name plates.

[Marc Myer]

Make samples!

Take a bit of time and design a clever or humorous sample piece that will have your contact info somewhere on it. The key is to make something that your potential client will see and say 'cool!' when they see it, and will be likely to keep on their desk, and will show them, at a glance, a bit of what you can do. This is a tried-and-true technique for graphic designers; it works very well. It also shows that you are a real person they can relate to and work with.

Use the laser for it. Wood biz cards are great, or something targeted. On my desk is piece of 1/2" plexiglas with a presidential seal engraved in the back. I can't throw it away. Do one with a fake 'thank you' from the president. Make a wooden surfboard with a hula dancer engraved on it. Do an engraved metal piece; the possibilities are endless.

[Stephen Beckham]

Mark,

Careful with this one - but most computers come with some Fax software preloaded. They provide you with a simple and cheap Fax-Spam capability. Keep in mind - you're pushing black and white images that may be poor on the far depending on the setting of their fax machine's receive mode...

Use it wisely though - once a quarter or twice a year to advertise a special might be good - it's too easy to send 100 faxes with one click and you can quickly annoy people beyond approach.

I set up several group contacts with local schools, local clubs and another with local city office faxes plugged in.

Two other notes - you should include opt out contact information and as always - it might be safer for you to contact the receivers to ask if they are okay with you sending them information via fax before becoming a much hated spammer...

[James Stokes]

There are laws against sending out spam faxes. In some states you can be fined $1500 for spam faxes.

[Stephen Beckham]

Good point - but like I said - it's best to develop lists of individuals or businesses that are willing to accept. The only ones I have sent these out to are those that have agreed after I made first contact.

Please don't accept that it okay just because it's available. That goes back to the comment that it's easy to get caught in the trap of sending it as SPAM versus acceptable information because it is so easy to send...

It's best to ensure you're not running more business off and like you said breaking the law instead of making new contacts... Also goes along with the comment about not abusing the process and upsetting those that said it would be okay...

EDIT>>>>>

Since 1991, a federal law, the Telephone Consumer Protection Act (TCPA), has prohibited unsolicited ("junk") fax advertisements in all fifty states, and allowed recipients to sue the businesses that send them. Individual states may go even further in regulating junk faxes.


Right off the FindLaw website - I guess it was a good thing I didn't blast them as SPAM - so this proves the point that you absolutely require permission. With that being said, more research shows that several states have challenged this TCPA for fax purposes as it violates the 1st Amendment. Others have sued to have Email added to this. Both sides of the coin... Back to the bottom line - if you are going to use this - better keep it on the up-n-up until/if/when the 1991 law is reversed...

[Mike Null]

I have received 3 separate payments of $100 each because somebody sent spam faxes. Had I saved the spam faxes to prove I received more than one I could have received $100 for each. I didn't solicit any of them and was surprised when I received the checks.


From my perspective spam is an invasion of my right to privacy not anything to do with free speech.

[Mark Koenig]

Mark,

Careful with this one - but most computers come with some Fax software preloaded. They provide you with a simple and cheap Fax-Spam capability. Keep in mind - you're pushing black and white images that may be poor on the far depending on the setting of their fax machine's receive mode...

Use it wisely though - once a quarter or twice a year to advertise a special might be good - it's too easy to send 100 faxes with one click and you can quickly annoy people beyond approach.

I set up several group contacts with local schools, local clubs and another with local city office faxes plugged in.

Two other notes - you should include opt out contact information and as always - it might be safer for you to contact the receivers to ask if they are okay with you sending them information via fax before becoming a much hated spammer...

Never said anything about FAXing my flyers... Last guy that did that to me got a phone call from us asking for him to come on up for a visit... He drove all the way from Raleigh!!! Met him at the front door, handed him his FAX, and closed the door...

Back on track...

This is what I was thinking:

Buying a mailing list for $25.00 from www.melissadata.com (http://www.melissadata.com)
(minimum $ order but can get other cities but work on just one first.)

Go to Office Depot and have them print the flyer for .10 cents each.

Use USPS to mail at .42 cents each.

I'll be under $100.00 for the whole deal... Am I missing something???

Thanks Mark.

[Mark Koenig]

Now I understand your situation a lot better. I thought you were talking about a direct mail service where flyers are mailed out to huge lists of people hoping some will be able to use your services.

I may do specific targeted mailings when things slow down this winter, to the tenants of the two shopping centers here in our little town. Most of my sign business is in the larger cities 10-20 miles away, and the laser work is even more spread out. One of my best laser customers is in Durham!

What I'd suggest in the case of electrical contractors is a letter or flyer in an envelope with a sample. Talk about how much better the quality of the text is with laser rather than rotary engraving, and include some kind of electrical symbol on it.

You might also consider companies with many employees in the same building, for name plates.

Thank you for your comments Joe...

That helps...;)

[Stephen Beckham]

Boy - you guys are cut-throats... Please read my post again - it started out with Be careful... Yes I used the word SPAM for lack of a better term - BUT I included to get their permission like I had - and yes there were some that asked nicely to not be added to any contact list.

The warning was to try and keep anyone from SPAMMING not to encourage it - but you guys cut-me-away like a bad habit....

My understanding was that you wanted to keep your customers informed and up to date on your products and capabilities. Like it or not - fax is a acceptable means - when permission is granted.

I see comments about invasion of privacy - honestly - the definition of privacy protects your private information from being released - it does not protect you from people contacting you.

Oh and by the way -

Unsolicted mail...!
With addressed you bought from someone...!
Without the recipient's permission or knowledge...?
Same as SPAM Fax and SPAM E-mail - it has just been around longer except it takes longer to reach the customer and it costs money. It's just as easy to throw fliers away that I didn't ask for as it is to hit the delete button.

Sorry gents - goes back to my bottom line - customer's permission... Once you have that - you can give the customer his/her choice of contact methods... Sorry to ruffle feathers...

[Ed Newbold]

There are laws against sending out spam faxes. In some states you can be fined $1500 for spam faxes.Now if we could only get them to extend that law to cover email spam. Whew, would I get rich quick! :rolleyes:

[Joe Pelonio]

Now if we could only get them to extend that law to cover email spam. Whew, would I get rich quick! :rolleyes:
We have such a law in WA, $500 per e-mail spam. Unfortunately it's up to the recipient to sue the sender in superior court. If you had nothing better to do you could make a living on it.

http://www.mcnichol.com/spam.htm

[Mark Koenig]

Boy - you guys are cut-throats... Please read my post again - it started out with Be careful... Yes I used the word SPAM for lack of a better term - BUT I included to get their permission like I had - and yes there were some that asked nicely to not be added to any contact list.

The warning was to try and keep anyone from SPAMMING not to encourage it - but you guys cut-me-away like a bad habit....

My understanding was that you wanted to keep your customers informed and up to date on your products and capabilities. Like it or not - fax is a acceptable means - when permission is granted.

I see comments about invasion of privacy - honestly - the definition of privacy protects your private information from being released - it does not protect you from people contacting you.




Oh and by the way -
Unsolicted mail...!
With addressed you bought from someone...!
Without the recipient's permission or knowledge...? Same as SPAM Fax and SPAM E-mail - it has just been around longer except it takes longer to reach the customer and it costs money. It's just as easy to throw fliers away that I didn't ask for as it is to hit the delete button.

Sorry gents - goes back to my bottom line - customer's permission... Once you have that - you can give the customer his/her choice of contact methods... Sorry to ruffle feathers...

Geez Steve... Lighten up a little...http://bravellir.com/gallery/d/10326-2/man_with_cane_lg_wht.gif

[Mark Koenig]

Hey it works!!!

I got a call from an advertising firm that has a REAL problem with their vendors and do a "whole lotta" work in these parts... :D

[Craig Hogarth]

My wife and I are about to kick off our advertising campaign. We've decided on direct mail and news print.

We're going with Valpak for the direct mail. We're paying $600 for 20,000 ads. I anticipate approximately a 0.5% rate of return with hopefully a 30% conversion rate, which could potentially result in a small profit. But by the first week in December, we should have seen at least 60,000 mailers. This is hopefully where it should pay off.

As for news print, we're focusing on specials, which could be a viable option for you. We got lucky and got space in our local paper's "Business Profile" section. It's a one page adspace shared by 10 other businesses. Ads are approx 2x4 in full color and we all rotate monthly around the edge. The middle is a full article on our business accompanied by 2 3x6 ads or photos. This comes out twice monthly and the fee is only $130 per edition.

Also, in September we'll get an article written about us in the women in business insert. This includes a 2x2 full color ad an was only $125.

In February, we'll be in the "military transition" insert. Since my wife and I are both vets, we'll be getting two articles and two ads. This will only be $225 combined for both.

Hopefully I'll be able to give some positive follow up in about 6 weeks.

[Mike Null]

After nine years as an engraver and a lifetime in marketing I have formed a strong opinion about print media for service businesses such as ours. Generally speaking I view it as a waste of money.

In today's world the Internet is where it's at. I have had more success with my web site than all other forms of advertising combined. So much so that I no longer spend any money except on my web site.

I believe there are two basic reasons for that: 1. people are shopping on the Internet instead of print media; 2. people shop for our services when they need them.

[Darren Null]

Just as a thought- have you thought of making the flyer useful? Plasticise it and put next years' calendar on it, for example? That way it might hang around in the homes of the recipients for longer.

The problem of advertising is in 2 parts if you're getting down to basics:
1) Letting people know you're there; what's possible and approximately how much it will cost them.
2) Making it easy to buy your products

For part 2, it's the internet all the way...and as Mike says the internet can do part 1 as well if your site is done properly. eBay is an excellent method of feeding targeted custom to your site; and if you're going to be doing flyers make sure you have a website up first so that interested parties can find out more detailed information.

Where I am, not everybody has the interweb, so other methods are required- luckily for me it's a relatively small town fuelled mainly on gossip so I'm getting out there and mingling, plus doing all the glasses in a couple of (carefully chosen) bars for more-or-less free...2 bars gets word to the Brit, Spanish and French communities. It's not costing me anything except effort and it gets my product sample in front of people who have time to contemplate it.

It's an approach that wouldn't work as well in the US maybe, but in a cafe society like this one I hope it'll do the trick. Also, for PR, I have taken to lasing my contact details on small stones picked up from the beach (dark and flat ones, for preference) which is -again- free and it seems to impress people.

[Keith Outten]

My experience in commercial signs has been that advertising has no benefit at all. It is basically about bidding and winning contracts plain and simple. Nobody cares about your web site or print media advertising, once you win a job your email address becomes important but not as important as your cell phone number. This is drastically different from traditional laser engraving services where some kind of marketing strategy is a necessity.

Anyone can break into the business without investing a dime in advertising, just visit the companies who are contracting the work and get on their bidders list. Once you are awarded the first job you automatically have access to people and information concerning upcoming projects. Provided you do excellent work you will be welcomed with open arms. You may have to start with small projects until your company resume and track record proves your abilitiy to get the work done. The larger more profitable jobs will come in time.

.

[Craig Hogarth]

After nine years as an engraver and a lifetime in marketing I have formed a strong opinion about print media for service businesses such as ours. Generally speaking I view it as a waste of money.

In today's world the Internet is where it's at. I have had more success with my web site than all other forms of advertising combined. So much so that I no longer spend any money except on my web site.

I believe there are two basic reasons for that: 1. people are shopping on the Internet instead of print media; 2. people shop for our services when they need them.

I think our difference in opinion stems from how we view our businesses. You run it as a service, while I operate under the umbrella of retail sales. I cannot run my business as a service since the other engraver in my area does as such and has been in business since 1973. They have more experience in this business than I've been alive and it's been near impossible to get any of their business.

I'd like to comment on your last two statements. While internet is a good resource for consumers to find a product/service they are looking for, it holds two inherent flaws.

1) They must have internet - in http://www.bizreport.com/2007/03/a_third_of_us_households_have_no_net_connection.ht ml it states that only 29% of US homes (31 million) do not have internet. However, if you look at the reasons, it shows that only approximately 20% of the population will benefit from print media.

2) They must be looking for and also need/want your service/product. Over 70% of my revenue has come from marble and with the exception of the occasional referral, not one has come to me looking specifically for engraved marble. The advantage to print is that I can show what I can do without them ever knowing it was even possible.

In short, I need customers to walk through my front door and print is IMO, the best way to do this. For my sake, I hope I'm right. :o

[Mike Null]

Craig

I hope you're right as well. You are certainly right about the differences in our businesses and how we market.

There is a huge difference in the reach of the Internet vs print media as well as a huge difference in the cost with the internet having the advantage on both counts.

[Keith Outten]

There has been a lot of discussion here at The Creek about cooperative efforts working with high school organizations and civic groups to get a new business jump started. Bands and other groups need to raise money every year, this is a great opportunity to make ornaments and other things that band members can sell to raise money. This in turn can connect you with a large group of potential customers.

Look for large groups that may be in need of your services and contact them. Many will allow you to speak at their monthly meetings and allow you to share what you are able to do for them as a group and as individuals.

Contact the construction companies in your area, they need house number plaques for residential housing projects, mailbox signs and there is a whole host of other things you can do for their business.

Contact your local cabinet shops, they can use engraved cabinet doors and glass inserts.

Contact your local car dealers, they purchase lots of awards plaques every year for their employees. You can offer to produce custom key chains for their dealership or other items that they can give away to their customers.

Contact local colleges and University book stores. You can engrave diplomas and glassware for them plus produce a product line geared toward their students.

Name badges are a huge market, almost every business needs employee badges. Colleges purchase a boat load of badges every year for their Staff.
Funny story: Mike Null just finished making name badges for Christopher Newport University and I work there and run their new sign shop :) We have a Xenetech Laser Engraver right in the University Architects Office, they are so accustomed to outsourcing their name badges they didn't even think about using our sign shop.

You can do a lot of marketing via shoe leather express and have a better chance of connecting with a decision maker than print media and the Net. Often you hit the mark, on the spot, just by being in the right place at the right time when they need something and there you are standing right in front of the guy who makes the decision. These can be excellent connections with local companies that represent recurring work...not just the walk-ins who purchase only once.

You must acquire recurring customers if you are to have any chance of remaining in business.
You can starve to death waiting on individuals to walk into your shop or contact you via email.
Never work cheap, you degrade the business by selling your services for pennies and you can't pay your bills doing two dollar jobs. You won't be able to replace your laser tube either when the time comes if your working cheap.

.

[Stephen Beckham]

Craig - being a vet, you know how much people around the military like Challenge Coins and such. I seem to get my best "I didn't know you did this..." from Wooden Nickels. Ituit.com sells them for about .07 each or less depending on number purchased.

I sell them to local churchs, politicians and military guys on Fort Knox at $.25 to $.35 each by the hundreds. I also put my web site on the edge to help advertise. You don't make big profit on them for the laser burn time you invest, but it gives a great WOW effect and they're easy to do. I've gotten more call-backs on those than anything else.


On paper print - I just put $250 in to a one time ad in the Fort Knox paper. They estimate 36,000 readers - had only three calls from the ad. Not sure if I'll see more in the future - but there's no way I could keep that size ad very long with that kind of return...