Finch Feeder - how about some ideas?

[Scott Shepherd]

There I was, minding my own business and all of the sudden BAMMMMMMM!! Yes, it happened, I actually had an idea. Who would have thought it?

So the idea was a finch feeder. I ordered the tubing and it came in this morning,so I came up with this first draft and I'd like some ideas/comments on it. It's 3" diameter, which while holding a tape measure looked just right, but once it got here, it's a little large. Less filling, I suppose :)

I'd like to find a better way to do the top. Right now, the plan is to have a piece of cord going through the bottom, up through the hole in the top, right through the center (which won't be seen when it's got seed in it). It's a finch feeder, planned on using thistle seed in it, so no worries from the squirrels around here. That means gravity is all that will be holding the top down. I suppose that's enough?

Also, it's a little rough, as the top didn't quite cut all the way through and I bumped it with my hand, so I couldn't cut it again.

The cylinder was done on the rotary axis. It's about 12" tall.

Any ideas/suggestions/comments?

[Scott Challoner]

Looks good Scott

Now I know what to do when I need to replace my finch feeders.

However, IMHO, you have waaaay too many holes. That small thistle seed will go through them like water through a sieve. You'll find a lot on the ground. I think one hole per perch is all that's needed.

How thick is the wall of the tube? The finch needs to be able to reach the seed with it's beak.

I don't know what varieties of finches you get in VA, but here in WI we get mostly gold finches and house finches. The house finches are non-native and undesireable and eat everything in sight often forcing out native species. A trick is to put the hole under the perch. Gold finches don't mind hanging upside down to eat while house finches can't do it.

I think the rope through the top will work as long as the hole in the top is slightly smaller in diamter than the rope. That way it won't keep falling down as you fiddle with the bag of seed trying to refill it.

[Scott Shepherd]

Good points Scott. I didn't have one to go from, so I did this from an idea, not knowing what would or wouldn't work. I just filled it up and it didn't do too bad, but you're correct, it's way too many holes. When you pick seed out of the lowest one, it falls out the top ones and others around it. Less holes and a little bit smaller, I think would be fine. Thanks for that input.

We get Golden and Purple Finchs here. If you'll look close, you'll see the holes under the perch! I've seen them hang upside down many times, plus I needed a way for the seed at the bottom to get eaten :)

I guess it also needs a small drain hole or two in case rain gets into the side holes.

I'll take another whack at it and post the new model.

[Ed Maloney]

Wouldn't this feeder and the others that have been posted lately get pretty hot in the summer/sun?

[Mike Null]

I would add more perches. The gold finches around here are a social group and we never have enough perches for them.

[Scott Shepherd]

Just finished Rev.2. Less slots and smaller by .030". Still seems to drop a lot of seed when you pick the lowest one. I'll try even less, spaced a little further apart on Rev. 3.

I'll also consider some more perches. As for the heat, I'm sure that this won't be as hot at the metal that's painted black that they currently stand on to eat. I would think it'd be a bit cooler actually. Maybe I need to drop the magnifying glass off the top. Maybe a colored acrylic or something.

Not a bad project to make and sell, I don't think. It's 1/8" wall, so it's a lot thicker than the one's you buy in the store. Including squaring the ends up on the laser, it's probably 6-7 minutes burn time for all 3 pieces.

It would have been nice to use cast tubing, but the price was almost triple of what the extruded was.

[Scott Challoner]

I agree with Mike. More perches would be good. It's hard to tell form the picture, but they may need to be a little smaller diameter so the birds can get a good hold when hanging upside down.

Be careful when you say Purple Finch. The House Finch looks very similar and you don't want to feed them if possible. They were transplanted out east from CA about 15-20 years ago and they have been taking over ever since.

I will now get off my soapbox about the House Finch:D

[Steven Smith]

I think wood dowels would be more comfortable on little birdy feet.

[Stephen Beckham]

Scott,

How about taking the tubing and cutting it in small U shapes (length of the tube - maybe 1" by 1" pieces), cap the end with a piece of flat, and glueing (I know you don't glue acrylic - how 'bout - bond) them under the holes to form a small cup. That's what our "store-bought" model had on it. They pile up in the cup and keep the others from falling out. It also makes it easier for the little fellas to pick up the thistle.

Nice imagination....

[Frank Corker]

The design is good but I think I've found a huge flaw in this feeder.

[Patrick Grady]

Nice project. Acrylic is heavy and dampens wind motion, and it cleans well with clorox and soap water. Dark thistle seed will absorb sun heat which helps keep it dry. Thistle seed is expensive and, as Stephen suggests, experimenting with hole sizing and 'cup catchers' at outlet of the seed holes is worth it (especially because the laser affords opportunity to fit them - think in terms of triangular shapes with concave surfaces at top). Another consideration is cleaning. Removable dowels will allow you to get a softcleaning brush inside- you might experiment with tapered dowel pieces that can be jam-locked. One fault with top-filled feeders of this type of feeder is the the 'dead space' at the bottom below the lowest seed hole where seed rarely gets cycled and is susceptible to trap mold and moisture; a piece of filler foam solves this problem. Some swinging motion is good because goldfinches are better swingers than house finches. With a laser, you could design and sell a feeder with better detail and function. For instance you could engrave some Harry Potter castle window features around the holes and perches. You could experiment with conical hole openings which funnel the seed outwards while minimizing rain absorption.
The goldfinches are cheering for progress.

[Mike Null]

Racoons will not leave any feeder for long. It might be a good idea to put a clip of some sort on the perches to keep them in place.

[Scott Shepherd]

Thanks for all the ideas. I'll look into the cup type holder area in the future. I looked at it with what I have, and I don't have the material I think I need to make that happen. I think something like a 1" dia. tube, cut, with a bottom on it could work well for that. Next time I buy some plastic, I'll get a piece of that and try it out.

Here's Rev.3. It's got less holes and smaller holes, more perches, and holes under all perches. I'm sticking with the acrylic for the perches, because I'd like to be able to bond them in place and I don't want to get into trying to bond the acrylic to wooden dowels. I do think the perches are too large in diameter, but it's all I have right now. I'll fix that in a later model.

I also did one where I lightly vector cut a finch in the face of it. Still deciding on whether or not that's worth keeping.

Here's rev 3 :

I'm more than happy to add the file if anyone else is interested in giving it a shot.

[Bob Keyes]

Yes Scott, please post the file. I would love to try it.

Thanks a lot. Looks great!

[Scott Shepherd]

Here's the file in V12 format. It contains only the tube. Depending on what wall thickness you get, you'll have to measure and cut the bottom to fit, and the top can be anything you want as well. I really want to use 1/4" for the top, but I don't have any laying around.

Here's a couple of points of interest.

3" extruded tubing, 1/8" wall thickness.
3/8" rod for the perch (which is probably too large)
12" long in total, could easy go to 15" or 18"

I cut the tubing by hand with a hacksaw and added 1/2" to it so I could cut it to size. Put it on the hotdog cooker type rollers that Epilog has, and cut a straight line. Let it float on there, as I didn't want the sawcut edge to go against the stop. Only problem, the beginning and end were off by about 1/8", left to right, and it rotated about .250" more than needed. Humm....got out calculator, figured circumference again. Everything is right by the math, but still rotates too far.

Modified the page size down until the rotation was right. So if you go calculating, it might not add up.

Determined the bands on the rotary axis had flashing on them where they were made in a mold and the flashing ran around it all crooked, so it appeared to spiral the tubing down the rollers as it spun. Took them off, got them all so the flashing didn't show, and it was better. Still a bit of a trick to get the thing to start and finish in the exact same place on the X-Axis. Also had to use the little thing that mounts on the end of the rotary attachment that puts pressure downward, on the inside of the tube. Without that, it was messing up when going from slot to slot.

I also know it's not grouped well and in very good order. I'll refine that as I finish up a design.

I get one end squared up, then put it in and run the file attached and it's done.

I have one hanging out now, so we'll see if any birds can get seed out of it. It was over 100 degrees here today, so all the birds seem to be staying away right now.

[Scott Shepherd]

A couple of ideas and observations later....

I only saw one bird on it and she came and landed on the bottom perch, pecked for a minute, jumped to the middle perch, pecked, jumped to the third perch, pecked a little and then flew away.

Of course in my brilliant animal like brain, I deduced from those 3o seconds that the holes were too small and she was moving because she couldn't get to the seed. Yes, I know, I'm paranoid.

However, a few things we happening that I think made it true. The clear top, sitting flat on the top, was causing condensation and was dripping onto the seed. So the seed was getting wet which made it clump and stick to the sidewall. This meant that you couldn't get seed out if you wanted to. So, I went back for a redesign. Still haven't fixed the top (it has a stick shoved it it for now :) ), but I have opened the holes up larger and made a little area for any seed that falls to fall into.

I also added a finch burned into each side of it.

Here's where we are so far. Haven't seen a single one since I made the changes a couple of days ago.

Any comments on the new version? Heading in the right direction?

[Dave Jones]

I notice on Finch feeder pictures I see on the web that a lot of them use some bright yellow on them to attract the birds from a distance.

I also notice a lot of them using what seems like a thin material with the hole to the seed, and wonder if the thickness of the acrylic in yours might be a hindrance to the birds.