saw sharpening?

[Jeffrey Larsen]

I have some very basic questions on sharpening old hadsaws:

1: I have an old, but very nice sandvik saw set. Will this work on various types of hand saws or is it made specific to tooth size--that is, do you need a different set for different PPI?

As I said, these questions are not designed to show how much I know about this field... Quite to the contrary....:


What type of file is the best to use for sharpening old hand saws? I have saws rangiing from sandvik and disston 5.5 PPI up to 12. Do I need different files?

Is it necessary to sharpen, say a 2 cherries back saw NIB, or would one assume that that would be factory sharpened. I know so little that I don't even know for sure what a dull saw feels like compared with a sharp one--really!!! I know if you have a direct comparison, you can tell a difference, but with a given saw when there isn't a comparison, I am not clear on this issue.


Finally, I read somewhere that teeth can be replaced on old hand saws? Is that true? my very good feeling old disston 5.5 PPI was sold to me as in perfect condition, but is missing parts of 2 teeth... Bummer.

Interested in feedback--thanks! JEff

[Mike K Wenzloff]

Hi Jeff,

The saw set--it depends on the model as to its appropriateness fr a given tooth range. In all likelihood, it will work on the saws you have, though. The upper ppi range is where most that people find are not design for.

You can use any saw file. Nicholsons are often found the easiest. LV has them, as does The Best Things and Tools for Working Wood. But if you have hardware stores in your area, check them.

The Lie-Nielson and Lee Valley web sites (just as Vintage Saw site) have charts to match file sizes to PPI.

The Two Cherries may work as is. Always cut first. If anything needs done, most likely it would be stoning either or both sides of the teeth.

New teeth can be filed or punched in--but...missing two teeth may not be detrimental, depending on proximity to each other.

For filing info, try Pete Taran's site:

http://www.vintagesaws.com/library/primer/sharp.html

He covers stoning referred to above, as well as what to do for sharpening in general.

Take care, Mike

[Bob Smalser]

I have some very basic questions on sharpening old handsaws:

1: I have an old, but very nice sandvik saw set. Will this work on various types of hand saws or is it made specific to tooth size--that is, do you need a different set for different PPI?

2. What type of file is the best to use for sharpening old hand saws? I have saws ranging from sandvik and disston 5.5 PPI up to 12. Do I need different files?

3. Is it necessary to sharpen, say a 2 cherries back saw NIB,

4. Finally, I read somewhere that teeth can be replaced on old hand saws? Is that true? my very good feeling old disston 5.5 PPI was sold to me as in perfect condition, but is missing parts of 2 teeth... Bummer.



1. Probably. It should be marked on its adjustment wheel or cam as to the number of teeth from around 4 to around 12. Just pay no attention to them. On a good saw, remove all the set, file it, and test it. Then add set incrementally until it cuts better. Anywhere from 0-30% of the blade thickness is required, depending on the taper of the saw.


2. Pete Taran's recommendations are as good as any. You can go up a size, and sometimes down in a pinch....but you need to be consistent or you'll find yourself changing tooth shape on the same saw if you use a different size file the next time around. Later if you learn to slope gullets to make taller teeth, the next size or even two sizes up in files is required.

6" Regular Taper 3 - 5.5 PPI
7" Slim Taper 6 - 7
6" Slim Taper 8
6" XSlim Taper 9, 10
6" 2XSlim Taper 11
5" 2XSlim Taper 12-16

3. No

4. New teeth can be sheared in by machine if the existing teeth are hopeless. Either straight or breasted, handsaw, backsaw or dovetail saw. Good machines can accomodate them all. Depending on tooth size and the operator, you can easily lose around a quarter inch of sawblade doing it. This is the main reason to avoid sharpening services, as many stamp in new teeth automatically so the teeth are a perfect match with their filing machine. You lose a quarter inch of blades that often only needed a couple thou taken off to make sharp.

Those sending fine saws out should specify hand filing and hand setting if they only need a touchup. Besides new teeth you didn't need, many outfits use one, all-purpose setting and put the same set in a Disston 12 they put in a plate saw. Like thrice as much as required. And setting machines put a sharper bend in the tooth than I feel is best for optimum life.

[Jeffrey Larsen]

Thanks gentlemen!! I really appreciate your input to this situation. I have an old dunlop wood vice--I think I will try to do something with that with regards to holding the saw steady while working on it as the saw vices I see look pricier than I would care to go at this point in my hobby.

Will head to Lowes for files tomorrow instead of harbor freight.... Most of the stuff I have gotten from HF has just fallen appart as the metal is so bad...



thanks again! Jeff

[Eric Hartunian]

I got a small back saw off ebay before I went to Iraq last year, and just got around to sharpening it today. Took about an hour to get it all done, start to finish. Spent the rest of the afternoon making a new handle out of paduak. I'll post a pick this week. Also, Norsewoodsmith.com has some good info on sharpening.
Eric

[Bob Smalser]

Also, Norsewoodsmith.com has some good info on sharpening.
Eric


So do you on your site.

Courtesy of Bob Smalser

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[Greg Crawford]

I don't know if this covers anything more than all the articles you've already been guided to, but it's out there;

http://www.woodcentral.com/cgi-bin/readarticle.pl?dir=smalser&file=articles_405.shtml

[Allan Brown]

Holy smokes! I'm fairly new to this forum, and I realized it was "deep" in terms of subject matter, professional attitude, good-spirited, etc. -- but I didn't realize all that stuff was out there! Thanks for opening the eyes of probably a lot of us newbies.
Allan

[Mike Cutler]

Holy smokes! I'm fairly new to this forum, and I realized it was "deep" in terms of subject matter, professional attitude, good-spirited, etc. -- but I didn't realize all that stuff was out there! Thanks for opening the eyes of probably a lot of us newbies.
Allan

Yep. Sometimes I don't understand everything that Bob is talking (writing) about, or if I'll ever need to know it, but I know enough to pay attention and listen anyway.;)

Bob.
Thanks for putting all your stuff in one post. I can now remove some internet favorites. Between you and Derek Cohen, you were filling up my woodworking folder.:eek: ,;)

[Dan Racette]

Not only, Thanks goes out to you Bob! But you index and database your stuff for us!

Dan

[Bill White]

Eric, you will be very pleased w/ the padauk handle. I made one several years ago. I have just continued to paste wax it, and the color is now a real rich, dark red. I just take it ( the saw) out to look at it every so often. (OK, so I need more to do.)
Bill