Miters are a mystery to me

[Ken Shoemaker]

I'm attemoting to cut miters on the table saw. 4 X 3/4 inch board lying flat on the table. I want to cut the board so it is 18" on the long side and cut at 45 degrees.. I just cant figure it out... My goal is to learn it and do it right... TIA for your help...

[Gary Keedwell]

I'm attemoting to cut miters on the table saw. 4 X 3/4 inch board lying flat on the table. I want to cut the board so it is 18" on the long side and cut at 45 degrees.. I just cant figure it out... My goal is to learn it and do it right... TIA for your help...
Ken, I learned that you get better results on a table saw if you use a sled rather then the miter gage. When you use a miter gage, you are sliding the wood against the table which causes friction which causes all kinds of trouble.
I personally use a sled . The wood stays against the fence and the only friction is the cut itself. I cut my stock 1" or so longer then I need and put a 45º on one end of all my parts. I then put a block or some kind of mechanical type stop on my fence and put the already cut 45º against it and cut the other end on all the parts. Using the stop will assure that the sides are all the same length.
I have a Dubby sled but there are a few good ones out there. Alot of woodworkers like to make their own dedicated 45º sled.
Gary K.

[Cliff Rohrabacher]

you get better results on a table saw if you use a sled rather then the miter gage. When you use a miter gage, you are sliding the wood against the table which causes friction which causes all kinds of trouble.

What he said~!!

The rattling of the miter fence rail bar in the track is another problem
The only ways I know to get good miters are to have a tight sled that uses both tracks in the table top or to have a ball bearing slider.

[Ken Shoemaker]

But how do you measure off the angled blade? BTW - I do use a sled for all the same reasons you mentioned...

[John Terefenko]

Ken

Not quite sure what you are asking. I will say this that sleds are the way to go. Also use a miter guage to mark the board on the top and sides so that you can orient the cut the way you want it. You do not mention if you have a right tilt or a left tilt saw. Are you tilting the blade to get a end grain miter or are you tilting the miter sled to get a face grain miter???:confused:

[Luciano Burtini]

You can make a sled out of BB Plywood. The angles are complimentary so if one is a little shy of 45°, the other will be a little more. Keep complimentary pairs together during assembly.


Length is critical if you are trying to make a closed framed. In this case, make a stop guage that you can butt the boards up to to ensure they are all exactly the same length.


Use a sharp blade, make sure that any side force you put on the sled is consistent each time and don't let anything move.

If it is any consolation, mitered frames are very simple looking but they are quite challenging to build accurately.

A well tuned mitre saw (again with a stop block) also works very well for narrow(er) stock.


http://www.djmarks.com/photos/woodworks/mitersled.jpg

EDIT: Just rereading your last post. I'm not sure why you're angling the blade for a mitre? For a bevel you must do so, but not for a mitre. In any case, measuring off of an angled blade is a guess at best. Use stop blocks or mark the work and "sneak up" on the final length.

[Per Swenson]

Maybe I am wrong, I dunno.

My guess is you are running your stock

straight through with your blade heeled

to 45'?

Try this, run a piece through over 16 inches with the

blade at 45'. reset the blade to 90, cut piece to exactly

12" to the long end.

You now have a one foot gauge block for your saw.

Now mark your fence accordingly.

Maybe this is what you were looking for.

Measuring rots. Always think, set up sticks and gauge blocks with stops.

Per

[Alfred Clem]

I had all kinds of similar problems until I bought a Dubby sled. Solved all those problems and added a lot of safety when I switched. The Dubby is accurate and especially good for repeated cuts, time after time.

[Gary Keedwell]

I had all kinds of similar problems until I bought a Dubby sled. Solved all those problems and added a lot of safety when I switched. The Dubby is accurate and especially good for repeated cuts, time after time.
I have had my Dubby for over 15 years and use it every week. Still very accurate and miters are still tight.
Gary K.

[Andrew Williams]

Are you sure you are not asking about bevel cuts?

[Ken Shoemaker]

I stand corrected.. Forgive me ... I'm trying to make a bevel cut...

[Andrew Williams]

Use a sliding bevel gauge to mark the end grain where you want the cut. Tilt the blade away from the fence. Align the fence so that a tooth with an inside set crosses the plane of the tabletop at exactly the point of the marked bevel on the workpiece. Push it through in a normal rip-cut.

[Jake Helmboldt]

OK, now I'm really confused. I believe Ken is making a miter and not a bevel. From his description he is not making a beveled rip. If I understand him he is making a miter across a 4" board, which is why he is cutting the miter w/ the blade heeled, not by using the mitre guage at a 45.

Again, if I am understanding him, his question is how to line up the cut on the stock so that he has an 18" (or any other desired length for that matter) piece measured from the long ends of the miter.

While I understand what he is asking, I don't have an answer for him since I always sneak up on the cut after a rough measurement and then set my stop block for additional pieces. Does anyone have a good method for measuring a the distance to the blade when heeled when cutting a miter?

JH

[Bert Johansen]

I agree with Jake. Mark the heel and sneak up on the final length.

[glenn bradley]

Ken, I learned that you get better results on a table saw if you use a sled rather then the miter gage. When you use a miter gage, you are sliding the wood against the table which causes friction which causes all kinds of trouble.
I personally use a sled . The wood stays against the fence and the only friction is the cut itself. I cut my stock 1" or so longer then I need and put a 45º on one end of all my parts. I then put a block or some kind of mechanical type stop on my fence and put the already cut 45º against it and cut the other end on all the parts. Using the stop will assure that the sides are all the same length.
I have a Dubby sled but there are a few good ones out there. Alot of woodworkers like to make their own dedicated 45º sled.
Gary K.

Just built one of these a couple days ago. This is more of a bevel sled than a miter sled. Similar bed, different fences. Now that I've built a few, these go together pretty quick.

[Andrew Williams]

If the stock is lying flat on the table and cut with a tilted blade then it must be a bevel. If it is a "bevel crosscut" (not a bevel rip) then do the same thing I said before, only use the sled or miter gauge to push the stock but it lines up with the marks the same. No fence, and still cut with the blade tilted away from you.

If the stock is being "mitered" (cutting diagonally across the face) across a 4" wide piece of wood then I think you would need an enormous tablesaw to miter it using a tilted blade, like a 20" blade or something. If I tilt my 10" TS blade down to 45 degrees then the best I could hope for would be about a 2" miter. Why not save yourself a ton of energy (and probably get better results) and just use a regular 90 degree blade and the miter sled.

By the way, mitering with the work "on edge" is dangerous unless you put the miter gauge/sled on the opposite side of a left-tilt TS. This way the blade points away from your hand. Right-tilt, no problem.

[joe greiner]

After reading all the corrections, and corrections to corrections, and ..., it sounds like you want to end up with corners similar to those shown in Luciano's picture. At that point, you can refine the miters by cutting along the imperfect joint line with a (is this allowed?) HAND saw, preferably a back saw. Clamp the pieces in proper relationship using an accurate carpenter's square. If you're making a complete frame, clamp all four pieces and cut all four miters. The sides of the blade kerf are parallel, and the final pieces will fit together perfectly. The initial cuts should be slightly oversize to allow for the final removal, and you can repeat the miter cuts as needed.

[Works in flat work too, and even more effective there.]

Joe

[Ken Shoemaker]

Thanks to all of you that I have confused with my less than steller description of the help I needed. I now know I am trying to "bevel a crosscut" on an 18" board.... Whew!!! I need a nap.:rolleyes:

Anyway, I used to sneak up on the cut but thought there was a better way. I think the "sneak up on the cut then set the stop block" might be the way to go...

Anyway, Thank you to all.... Ken