Redmond Machinery Breaks 10,000

[Dan Lautner]

Over 10,000 views on the Redmond Machinery saga. I think its safe to say Redmond will not be getting much business from creekers. What a pathetic way to treat a customer. In the end it looks like they got what they deserve.

Dan

[Kyle Kraft]

Do you suppose the folks at Redmond have been following that thread and read/understand that their boondoggle has reached out to over 10k people? If so, do they care?

[Mike Cutler]

It appears that they have been following the thread. It also appears that they still "Don't get it"!

[Art Mulder]

Do you suppose the folks at Redmond have been following that thread and read/understand that their boondoggle has reached out to over 10k people? If so, do they care?

I agree with everything in your post but the number... Be careful... 10k views does not equal 10k people. I've popped into the thread only about 3-4 times, but I'm sure others pop in each day.

[Tim Morton]

sorry...but one isolated incident does not affect my view of a company. But it does alter my opnion of some of the sharks in here...

unfortunate...but true.

[Andy Livingston]

I agree, Redmond dropped the ball on this one. Big time! I will also say I live in Atlanta and have been to Redmond multiple times. The staff there have been great and they have shown me outstanding customer service. I had one of their reconditioned machines go bad on me and they bent over backwards to make it right.

[Craig Zettle]

I sincerely hope that one isolated incident does indeed affect the opinion we as a community of woodworkers have on a company. A company is only as good as their last sale, because if they treated even one customer poorly, they could do it to you. And to compare internet/phone sales to a face to face transaction is like the difference between a heated email discussion and standing face to face with your neighbor telling him he is an idiot. Most people act quite differently when their problem is standing in front of them.

I would love to get in to a deep discussion as to why any company brings religion to their retail sales venue, and Redmond is not the only one that comes to mind, but I understand how that could get out of hand in the blink of an eye.

[Chris Barton]

sorry...but one isolated incident does not affect my view of a company. But it does alter my opnion of some of the sharks in here...

unfortunate...but true.

I agree! No matter which forum, when some smell blood in the water, they strike...

[Phil Thien]

Oh, I donno. I think they'll learn something from this and I know their customer service will change for the better.

In their defense, running a small business can be hell. I'm speaking from experience (twenty years of it). Owners can spend nearly all their "customer" time fixing employee screw-ups like a poorly packed jointer.

You often get all your initial information from the very employee(s) that hosed the job (selling it or arranging its packaging). The employee(s) tell you the customer is unreasonable or dishonest.

I have found, through experience, that it always pays to take the customer's side. I tell employees something like, "hey, I'm going to advocate for the customer every chance I get. You know, I don't know him that well, but I do know you. You say he is unreasonable and dishonest, but in all my years of running this place, I've only run into two or three of those guys. The vast majority have been absolutely justified in screaming at me. So I'll tell you what, let's swallow our pride and get this guy fixed up, and make sure something like this doesn't happen again."

Some employees will roll their eyes and get quite negative behind your back after this type of incident. Here is my speech for those employee's: "Hey, you know what? You are turning into one of those guys that poisons the workplace with your constant negativity and smart remarks behind my back. Do you really want to be that guy? Its all up to you. But I don't need any Mr. Negatives on the payroll, and I can guarantee you life is a lot more fun if you approach it a little differently than you have been. But like I said, it is all up to you. Now let's get a [beer, coke, coffee, whatever]."

Finally, I make all employees smile while talking on the phone. It is really hard to come-off sounding like a jerk when you're smiling. Try it!

In Redmond's case, I'd have a sign that reads, "It has been XXX days since a customer has [complained, posted negative comments about us, etc.] made up. I'd have another one that says "it has been XXX days since someone has [said somethign nice to us online]." Just a gentle reminder to all the employees, even the top guy, that they are there for the customer.

But I think Redmond will be back and better than ever!

[Brad Townsend]

sorry...but one isolated incident does not affect my view of a company. But it does alter my opnion of some of the sharks in here...

unfortunate...but true.
Normally one isolated incident won't affect my view either, but when it's as egregious and deliberate as this one was, I have to go with the sharks. Redmond had several opportunities to do the right thing and continually got it wrong.

[Tim Morton]

Normally one isolated incident won't affect my view either, but when it's as egregious and deliberate as this one was, I have to go with the sharks. Redmond had several opportunities to do the right thing and continually got it wrong.

I would still love to hear Redmunds side of the story. And I for one have a HUGE problem with the OP posting emails that were not meant for public viewing. All in all he is getting a replacement jointer. He will be out some money for moving the thing, but I think if he looks around he can get it in his basement for less than $150. I have been visiting this forum since the beginning and before that it was badger pond and for 10 years i have heard nothing but positive things about redmunds and myself I have bought a few things from them including a large bandsaw. For those who want to run them into the ground over this, that is your right. But remember....you may screw up one day and I hope others treat you better.:cool:

That is my last comment on the matter.

[Carroll Courtney]

I for one will not roll the dice to see if I'm lucky enought to get good service or not.:confused:

[Scott Rollins]

I just received my Sawstop TS from Redmond Machinery. They did everything a good company could do to service my needs. For example, they held my saw for a week while I was on vacation (without running my CC yet). Then they shipped it via my carrier to save me some money (about $200 savings). They called me repeatedly to keep me updated as to the status of my order and shipment. Overall I give them a 10 out of 10 for my order...by the way I love my sawstop with a Incra TS fence!! Gloat pics to come after I finish the router table and outfeed support .

[Dan Lautner]

"sorry...but one isolated incident does not affect my view of a company. But it does alter my opnion of some of the sharks in here...

unfortunate...but true."


I strongly disagree. We saw first hand how Redmond dealt with a problem. I could not quite believe the list of demands they gave the customer when he did nothing wrong. Do you think a company like Lee Valley would ever treat a customer like this? In this case the customer did nothing wrong and had to deal with Redmonds horrendus customer service.

Dan

[Anthony Anderson]

That is my last comment on the matter.


Ahhhh! Tim, you fibbed. I saw the other two posts in the original thread after you said you would not comment on this topic any further. :D. Couldn't resist could you? Have a nice day Tim. Sit back and drink something cold and that will relax you. Enjoy life. Regards, Bill

[Tim Morton]

Ahhhh! Tim, you fibbed. I saw the other two posts in the original thread after you said you would not comment on this topic any further. :D. Couldn't resist could you? Have a nice day Tim. Sit back and drink something cold and that will relax you. Enjoy life. Regards, Bill

ok...starting NOW:cool:

maybe a grey goose martini....

yes...and the red sox game.

ok...NOW:cool:

[Lloyd McKinlay]

sorry...but one isolated incident does not affect my view of a company.

Tim, I agree with your basic premise. However I can't view this as one incident. It appears Redmond has had multiple opportunities to rectify a mistake. It appears these opportunities extend to the highest level of management at Redmond. It appears they have failed miserably with each opportunity. Their last e-mail appears to have been written by a petulant child who didn't get their way.

The attitude displayed by Redmond will, and does, negatively affect my opinion of the firm.

[Wayne Watling]

If a reputable company makes a mistake (even 1 mistake) then they should fix the problem immediately. This company didn't and that speaks volumes about their make up, and they will inturn pay for their arrogance.
Never could I see Lee Valley (with their platunium plated reputation) doing something like this and for that I wont hesitate the spend lots of $$ with them and even pay a little more for the piece of mind.

[Tim Morton]

If a reputable company makes a mistake (even 1 mistake) then they should fix the problem immediately. This company didn't and that speaks volumes about their make up, and they will inturn pay for their arrogance.
Never could I see Lee Valley (with their platunium plated reputation) doing something like this and for that I wont hesitate the spend lots of $$ with them and even pay a little more for the piece of mind.

Comparing Lee Valley to Redmonds is apple and oranges. LV sells things at about 300% mark-up and can afford to pay the 10-20 shipping charge to return an item and ask questions later. Companies like Redmond I wuld expect would need to take a slightly more conservative policy when returning 800lb machines.

FWIW i am NOT saying that redmond did not make a mistake here...I am only stating that its unfair to bury them for this one isolated incident. The OP is getting a replacement jointer and is happy with the way it is working out. Things happen...and when they do it is decent to give people a fair shake. Most of you aren't....

[Wayne Watling]

Comparing Lee Valley to Redmonds is apple and oranges...

Comparing LV with other companies is precisely what we should be doing, as far as I'm concerned they are the benchmark. Why put up with substandard service when there are hundreds of other companies just waiting for a bite. Perhaps they have learned a valuable lesson and will do things differently next time. They should be thanking the forum members for helping their business get on track.

[Phil Thien]

Comparing Lee Valley to Redmonds is apple and oranges.

Fine, make it Redmonds vs. Amazon.

[Allen Bookout]

Fine, make it Redmonds vs. Amazon.

I have seen customer complaints regarding Amazon. Does that make them a bad company on the whole? Certainly not. Put me in with the Tim Motons of this world.

[robert micley]

i agree with the poster who states there is nothing wrong comparing lv to redmund. i do not believe the customer is always right.they did not do the right thing. i am not saying i will never buy from them but i will certainly remember this and i am not planning on doing buisness with them.

[Phil Thien]

I have seen customer complaints regarding Amazon. Does that make them a bad company on the whole? Certainly not. Put me in with the Tim Motons of this world.

I agree that one strike does not make an out, but...

I've never read an account of any Amazon problem gone this bad. Perhaps there have been a few.

But, Amazon is hundreds of times larger than Redmonds overall. And I'd guess at least twenty times larger (guessing conservativly) in terms of tool sales. So, we'd expect proportionally more serious negative posts in these forums about Amazon.

I can't find them.

[Matt Meiser]

It isn't about having a problem--they occur everywhere. Its about how the problem is handled.

As an example, I received some damaged tube steps for my truck a few weeks ago that I didn't discover until I had them completely installed and removed the protective wrapping. The company that sold them to me had them backordered and offered me either a $50 credit or to have them picked up by Fedex the next day. No one blamed me for not inspecting them, no one told me I had to deal with the insurance adjuster and no one implied that I caused the damage. THAT is good customer service and despite the fact it was inconvinent to remove the steps, I'd gladly do business with them again.

Another example: A couple years ago my wife and daughter bought me an expresso machine from Amazon. After about 1 weeks use (probably 50 times use MAX :rolleyes: ) the steam valve froze up. Amazon gave us a complete refund including shipping with not even a hint of a problem.

[Phil Thien]

Another example: A couple years ago my wife and daughter bought me an expresso machine from Amazon. After about 1 weeks use (probably 50 times use MAX :rolleyes: ) the steam valve froze up. Amazon gave us a complete refund including shipping with not even a hint of a problem.

Man, 50 espressos in a week... I'll bet you were wired!

[Bruce Benjamin]

Comparing Lee Valley to Redmonds is apple and oranges. LV sells things at about 300% mark-up and can afford to pay the 10-20 shipping charge to return an item and ask questions later. Companies like Redmond I wuld expect would need to take a slightly more conservative policy when returning 800lb machines.

Where do you get your facts and figures from? 300% mark up???

Extra shipping costs is part of the cost of doing business. It doesn't mean that if they screw up they are more justified in screwing the customer. Sunhill went way out of their way to fix their screw up with my jointer. They aren't a giant company at all and they didn't offer even the slightest hesitation at doing whatever it took to make it right. After all of the extra shipping costs and the $150 plus in free stuff they sent me I find it hard to believe they made any money on the deal at all. THIS is how a small company should do business.

FWIW i am NOT saying that redmond did not make a mistake here...I am only stating that its unfair to bury them for this one isolated incident.

This isn't ONE isolated incident. It's a series of mistakes made by Redmond because of their first screw up. The screw up apparently is because of the way they packed the jointer. Then they continued to screw up right up to, and including, when they sent that ridiculous letter of demands. Hardly one isolated incident.

The OP is getting a replacement jointer and is happy with the way it is working out.

I actually haven't heard that the OP is happy with the way it's turned out. Is he? I sure wouldn't be at all and I don't think many other people would be either, judging by the responses to this thread.

Things happen...and when they do it is decent to give people a fair shake. Most of you aren't....

How many chances and fair shakes do you give someone when they don't treat you right over and over again? You must have a very long fuse. I don't think that many of us would have jumped on Redmond if they had offered to replace the jointer the first or second time Gary contacted them. That, in my opinion, would be giving them a fair shake. But Redmond went right up to the very end saying they weren't shipping a new jointer. Even now they're putting some unreasonable demands on Gary.

Hey, I thought you said you weren't going to post anymore on this subject. ;)

Bruce