Festool Rotex Sanders

[Mac Cambra]

Easy Question: Can Festool products be used with non-Festool vacuum/dust extractors in particular the Rotex?

Do you think the local Woodcraft ould allow a demo of one of these. Would like to try before I buy, want to make sure I get a noticable improvemnt in performance over the Dewalt ROS I am currently using.

[Bob Michaels]

Sure Mac, any vac will work as long as the hose fits the Rotex. WoodCraft may be willing to allow a demo, if not, you still have the Fes 30 day return guaranty with no questions asked. You can't lose. Go for it.

[Todd Jensen]

Sure you can, and it works great!
http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z66/grizzified/festoolshopvac.jpg

http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z66/grizzified/festoolshopvaccloseup.jpg

[Tyler Howell]

Proof positive.
I'd buy a Festool hose just to keep it smooth and light weight.

[Dan Clark]

Proof positive.
I'd buy a Festool hose just to keep it smooth and light weight.
Nah... Some folks like big iron! :D

[Jim Becker]

As stated, yes you can. But I agree with Tyler that for best results, a Festool hose is a nice idea. And do note that you'll have best results with a vac that is variable speed or a vacuum bleed when you get to the finer grits...these tools tend to "stick" to the material the smoother it gets, so reducing the vacuum can help keep the sanding easy. One of the reasons for this is that the dust extraction design on the Festool sanders is so good that you don't have the excess dust keeping the abrasive paper up off the wood and at finer and finer grits that gets you a pretty good "seal"...

[Gary Curtis]

I bought the Festool Rotex. But I already had a Fein Turbo II vacuum. I called the dealer when I got home and unpacked everything. He told me this:

Festool vacuums have two grades of hoses. One for autostart that is Green and more expensive. One that is Grey and cheaper. Both vacuum hoses would fit my Fein shopvac. The hoses have a ribbed tip that couples with a collar on Festool ports and fixes the hose so it won't shake loose while in use.

Or, to save $60, Fein makes a set of step-down hose tips for $9 for most hose sizes. They are a rubberized plastic that can be force-fit into the Festool dust port. You have to cut off the diameter section that matches your hose and the Festool first. They hold pretty good, but not as well as the genuine Festool DC hose.

Gary Curtis

[Mac Cambra]

Jim I never even considered vacuum bleed as a possibility, very interesting.

Aside from the dust collection, is there a real discernable difference in the sanding performance?

My real fear is that if I get started with this brand I will end up with $5k worth of Festool and God knows how much in alimony.......

[Jim Becker]

Aside from the dust collection, is there a real discernable difference in the sanding performance?

Great sanding performance and a distinct lack of vibration...I can now sand for hours rather than minutes.


My real fear is that if I get started with this brand I will end up with $5k worth of Festool and God knows how much in alimony.......

You will be assimilated... :p

[Jim DeLaney]

I already had the Porter-Cable hose on hand - it's about an inch ID.

I bought an eight dollar (four years ago) adapter from festool that fit perfectly onto the PC hose - just 'screwed' onto the hose's spiral - and fit the collection port on my sander - the original 5" ROS.

Earlier this year, I also bought the 5" Rotax, and the same hose setup fits it, too.

My vac is a Fein Turbo II, but I have one of those 2" orange 'accessory' hoses for it that I use most of the time. The PC hose OD fits perfectly into the end of that, giving me a near perfect DC setup for the Festools.

So far as slowing the Fein down, or bleeding off vacuum, I've never seen the need for that. I've used up (down?) to 600 grit paper, and haven't experienced any 'suction' problems.

[Steve Roxberg]

I bought the Festool Rotex. But I already had a Fein Turbo II vacuum. I called the dealer when I got home and unpacked everything. He told me this:

Festool vacuums have two grades of hoses. One for autostart that is Green and more expensive. One that is Grey and cheaper. Both vacuum hoses would fit my Fein shopvac. The hoses have a ribbed tip that couples with a collar on Festool ports and fixes the hose so it won't shake loose while in use.
Gary Curtis

The green hose is antistatic and the grey hose is not. The Anti-static will only work with a vacuum that supports an anti-static hose like the Festools (I don't know of others) so with a Fein vacuum the cheaper grey hose is perfect, but expensive.

[Todd Jensen]

Just wanted to add that I believe the larger hose improves suction at the tool(very important:eek: ), and while a little heavier, seems to 'trip' less over the edge of materials. While I don't have specs, I believe it to be a very solid $100 competitor to the Festool alternative. A $20 auto-switch with clean-out delay from Sears and you've got a great economical setup.
Oh, and I should admit, I do like slinging around big iron.:D
And lastly, the savings paid for a Porter Cable Biscuit Joiner, a micropinner, and crown stapler. :)

[James Phillips]

I just bought a rotex 125 and a Festool vac and here is my 2 cents. Do you get a better finish than other sanders? No way. Abrasive are abrasives; work from course to fine and you will get a great finish with any sanding system. Does it do the job easier and more confortably? 1000 times yes. My biggest complaint is that at times it seems to have to much power. There is a reason it is big enough to hold with 2 hands. Is the dust collection really that good? Yes, the guy that sold me mine said "You can sand in your wifes living room with this thing" He was almost right.

I would go ahead and spring for a festool vac. The simplicity if set up and the fact that the vac turns on automatically is great.

[Dan Clark]

I just bought a rotex 125 and a Festool vac and here is my 2 cents. Do you get a better finish than other sanders? No way. Abrasive are abrasives; work from course to fine and you will get a great finish with any sanding system. Does it do the job easier and more confortably? 1000 times yes. My biggest complaint is that at times it seems to have to much power. There is a reason it is big enough to hold with 2 hands. Is the dust collection really that good? Yes, the guy that sold me mine said "You can sand in your wifes living room with this thing" He was almost right.

I would go ahead and spring for a festool vac. The simplicity if set up and the fact that the vac turns on automatically is great.

James,

I have the RO150 FEQ (new one). It's larger and more powerful than the RO125. In Rotex mode, it's got lots of power, is aggressive, and usually takes two hands to controll it. In RO mode however, it's easily controllable with one hand.

I connect my CT22 to multiple devices for a variety of sanding jobs including sanding drywall with a manual drywall sander. At anything over 50% power, it will suck the drywall sander to the material. It's almost impossible to move.

So if your RO125 "has too much power" that might be caused by the vac being set too high. Try reducing the suction setting by about 50% and try it again.

Regards,

Dan.

[Ron Crusee]

In regards to a hose for the Rotex. I have the RO125 and did not opt to buy the vac as I already have a central DC in my shop. Went to HD and bought the 1 1/4" rigid shop vac hose kit for $19.99 (15 feet of hose) and it fits the Rotex perfectly, no adapters. To control the amount of suction, if needed, you can reduce by partially shutting the Rotex blast gate or partially opening another.

[Randy Denby]

In regards to a hose for the Rotex. I have the RO125 and did not opt to buy the vac as I already have a central DC in my shop. Went to HD and bought the 1 1/4" rigid shop vac hose kit for $19.99 (15 feet of hose) and it fits the Rotex perfectly, no adapters. To control the amount of suction, if needed, you can reduce by partially shutting the Rotex blast gate or partially opening another.

Ron, does that work OK? I haven't ever tried hooking a smaller hose to my oneida ..mainly because I figured it wouldn't work. (I do HVAC engineering ) Let me explain...Not doubting you....just me:D Dust collectors operate on high cfm and low static capability, where vacuums operate on high static and low cfm's. In theory....the dust collector shouldnt be capable of sucking much thru such a small hose. But ....theories are just that...not real world:confused: I'm gonna try it!...and prove myself wrong:D

[jason lambert]

James I would disaggree I get a better finish out of my festool than my Portercable and Bosh sanders. Yes they are more comfortable but I think the finish difference is that the sander is not sucking down, when it sucks down it grabbs the wood insteads of floates. I also have less build up on the paper. It is a minor difference but I have noticed less digging in and swiral marks with the festool.

[James Phillips]

James I would disaggree I get a better finish out of my festool than my Portercable and Bosh sanders. Yes they are more comfortable but I think the finish difference is that the sander is not sucking down, when it sucks down it grabbs the wood insteads of floates. I also have less build up on the paper. It is a minor difference but I have noticed less digging in and swiral marks with the festool.

I would argue that if you get a better result with the festool you need to look at your technique with the other tools. I have the rotex and always use it, but I can get just as good a finish with other sanders or by hand. It may require different grits and more work, but quality of finish can be achieved with any method or sander if done properly. I do believe the festool gives a better finish for a given amount of effort....

[Gary Keedwell]

I just bought a rotex 125 and a Festool vac and here is my 2 cents. Do you get a better finish than other sanders? No way. Abrasive are abrasives; work from course to fine and you will get a great finish with any sanding system. Does it do the job easier and more confortably? 1000 times yes. My biggest complaint is that at times it seems to have to much power. There is a reason it is big enough to hold with 2 hands. Is the dust collection really that good? Yes, the guy that sold me mine said "You can sand in your wifes living room with this thing" He was almost right.

I would go ahead and spring for a festool vac. The simplicity if set up and the fact that the vac turns on automatically is great.
I tend to agree with James. Festool is cleaner and is comfortable but a sander is a sander as far as the final result.:o
Gary K.

[Ron Crusee]

Ron, does that work OK? I haven't ever tried hooking a smaller hose to my oneida ..mainly because I figured it wouldn't work. (I do HVAC engineering ) Let me explain...Not doubting you....just me:D Dust collectors operate on high cfm and low static capability, where vacuums operate on high static and low cfm's. In theory....the dust collector shouldnt be capable of sucking much thru such a small hose. But ....theories are just that...not real world:confused: I'm gonna try it!...and prove myself wrong:D

Oh yes you are correct it does reduce the suction significantly but in my case it's still enough to give me dust a free sanding with the RO125. My setup goes from a 4" main reduced to 10 feet of 2 1/2" and then reduced again to 15 feet of the 1 1/4".

Ron

[Randy Denby]

Oh yes you are correct it does reduce the suction significantly but in my case it's still enough to give me dust a free sanding with the RO125. My setup goes from a 4" main reduced to 10 feet of 2 1/2" and then reduced again to 15 feet of the 1 1/4".

Ron

Tried it, not bad!And this was with my Bosch 5" ROS. I can imagine, the superior collection of a festool would be great. I like the idea of varying the suction with the blast gate as well. (I have had my Bosch sorta stick when hooked up to my ShopVac) Thanks for the tip!!
Back to school for me........;)

[Per Swenson]

Hold on,

My last thread about they are just tools has a lot of exceptions.

Here is one. " A sander is a sander as far as the final result"

This simply, is not true.

Our bar tops can run as much as new family sedan.

We don't get to charge that much for a inferior finish.

And you won't get that finish with "any old sander"

And yes sir...I have used them all.

Per

[James Phillips]

Hold on,

My last thread about they are just tools has a lot of exceptions.

Here is one. " A sander is a sander as far as the final result"

This simply, is not true.

Our bar tops can run as much as new family sedan.

We don't get to charge that much for a inferior finish.

And you won't get that finish with "any old sander"

And yes sir...I have used them all.

Per

I guess we will just have to disagree. I love my Rotex and I think everyone should own one. However I have applied finish to everything from acoustic guitars to furniture and you can get an equally good finish with other sanders or by hand. I reiterate it will take more work though. The only reason I belabor this point is I do not want someone to spend $$$ on a tool for the wrong reason. If you do not mind breathing dust and having to work much harder for the same results then a Rotex may not be worth it for you. IMHO

[Brian Penning]

Couple of questions:
1. Vacuum bleed?? Not sure what this means.
2. Do these festool sanders work on curved surfaces? For instance smoothing out a sculpted chair seat.

[Mark Singer]

The Rotex is a terrific tool! The 2 modes are great for shaping and finishing and buffing out wax....etc. If you check my treeads, like shaping a chair seat...it is an important performer!

http://www.wkfinetools.com/contrib/mSinger/z_art/barSt/barSt1.asp

[David DeCristoforo]

Ont thing....if you buy a Festool sander, you have to buy Festool abrasives. Festool uses a "propritary" hole pattern so other brands of abrasives will not "work". Festool machines are excellent quality and "worth" the price but I really resent being forced to buy sandpaper from them. I have at least a half dozen places within a few minutes of my shop where I can buy abrasives and if I need something right then, I can just "pop over" and grab what I need. With the Festool sander, I have to order in advance or run the risk of running out at just the wrong time (like on Sunday afternoon and I have to deliver the project on Monday morning).

[Ron Crusee]

Ont thing....if you buy a Festool sander, you have to buy Festool abrasives. Festool uses a "propritary" hole pattern so other brands of abrasives will not "work". Festool machines are excellent quality and "worth" the price but I really resent being forced to buy sandpaper from them. I have at least a half dozen places within a few minutes of my shop where I can buy abrasives and if I need something right then, I can just "pop over" and grab what I need. With the Festool sander, I have to order in advance or run the risk of running out at just the wrong time (like on Sunday afternoon and I have to deliver the project on Monday morning).

In a pinch couldn't you just poke your own center hole? Or better yet just center drill a whole stack of paper on the drill press...

[David DeCristoforo]

Sure...you could...but that's not really the point is it?

[Gary Keedwell]

I've only had my Festool sander and vacuum for a few months, but really, it is a nice machine but still, sanding is sanding. It is just like a router....mostly you will get the same finish from most routers, it's just that some "feel" better or have some options that others may not.
As a matter of fact, Festool's finish doesn't even finish on top in alot of ratings.:rolleyes:
Gary K.

[Ron Crusee]

Sure...you could...but that's not really the point is it?

Was just thinking out loud.

Your point was you have to buy propritary festool paper. My point was you can overcome by cutting/drilling your own center hole, that's all.

[David DeCristoforo]

Well actually my point is that there is no good reason for Festool to use a propritary hole pattern in the first place. They claim that their hole pattern results in more efficent dust extraction but in my experience this is a clear case of hair splitting. And it's not a center hole, it's the entire hole pattern. So you would have to punch or drill eight holes, not just one and since the (non-Festool) disk already has five or eight holes in it to begin with, that's a lot of sandpaper missing, not to mention the complete PITA of having to do all that hole punching. I asked Festool if they would consider offering a punch / template that could be used to repunch other brands of disks or generic hook and loop abrasive but they were not too keen on the idea....

[Jason White]

Yes, and I have. However, I ended up getting the Festool CT22 vacuum to go with the ROTEX 150 and it's the best. You can stack your sander's "systainer" on top of the vacuum and wheel it around. These sanders are like crack cocaine, so you'll really appreciate this when you get 3 or 4 sanders and are able to wheel them right to the work. The dust extractor is top notch, too. Trigger activated and zero dust with the HEPA filters and bags and you can dial the suction up or down so your sander won't "stick" to the work (not so much of an issue with the ROS sanders but it does happen with the standard orbital palm-type sanders).

JW


Easy Question: Can Festool products be used with non-Festool vacuum/dust extractors in particular the Rotex?

Do you think the local Woodcraft ould allow a demo of one of these. Would like to try before I buy, want to make sure I get a noticable improvemnt in performance over the Dewalt ROS I am currently using.

[Chris Padilla]

Ont thing....if you buy a Festool sander, you have to buy Festool abrasives. Festool uses a "propritary" hole pattern so other brands of abrasives will not "work". Festool machines are excellent quality and "worth" the price but I really resent being forced to buy sandpaper from them. I have at least a half dozen places within a few minutes of my shop where I can buy abrasives and if I need something right then, I can just "pop over" and grab what I need. With the Festool sander, I have to order in advance or run the risk of running out at just the wrong time (like on Sunday afternoon and I have to deliver the project on Monday morning).

No one forces you to do anything you don't want to. You speak with where you spend and how you spend your money. You went into the Festool idea knowing this ahead of time so why belly-ache about it now? Buy a bunch ahead of time and you are ready to go. :)

Technically, you can slap whatever paper you want on there...it may not suck ALL the dust up that the Festool paper will but it will get your job done in time for that Monday delivery. Why don't you experiment for us...show us that Festool's pattern isn't all it is cracked up to be. For me, I'll just keep an eye on my stock of paper and replenish it as the need arises. :D

[Jason White]

The grey hose is cheaper because it lacks the anti-static feature, which is not needed with non-Festool vacs.

JW


I bought the Festool Rotex. But I already had a Fein Turbo II vacuum. I called the dealer when I got home and unpacked everything. He told me this:

Festool vacuums have two grades of hoses. One for autostart that is Green and more expensive. One that is Grey and cheaper. Both vacuum hoses would fit my Fein shopvac. The hoses have a ribbed tip that couples with a collar on Festool ports and fixes the hose so it won't shake loose while in use.

Or, to save $60, Fein makes a set of step-down hose tips for $9 for most hose sizes. They are a rubberized plastic that can be force-fit into the Festool dust port. You have to cut off the diameter section that matches your hose and the Festool first. They hold pretty good, but not as well as the genuine Festool DC hose.

Gary Curtis

[Chris Padilla]

Yes, and I have. However, I ended up getting the Festool CT22 vacuum to go with the ROTEX 150 and it's the best. You can stack your sander's "systainer" on top of the vacuum and wheel it around. These sanders are like crack cocaine, so you'll really appreciate this when you get 3 or 4 sanders and are able to wheel them right to the work. The dust extractor is top notch, too. Trigger activated and zero dust with the HEPA filters and bags and you can dial the suction up or down so your sander won't "stick" to the work (not so much of an issue with the ROS sanders but it does happen with the standard orbital palm-type sanders).

JW

This whole system works very well together--that is the point of the design. My wife actually like sanding now!! It is very clean and most importantly, it is very quiet. The whole system is very comfortable to work with!

[David DeCristoforo]

"You went into the Festool idea knowing this ahead of time so why belly-ache about it now?"

Thank you for the scolding Chris...I really needed that! I can't thank you enough for making my day.....

[Gary Keedwell]

[quote=Chris Padilla;602729]No one forces you to do anything you don't want to. You speak with where you spend and how you spend your money. You went into the Festool idea knowing this ahead of time so why belly-ache about it now? Buy a bunch ahead of time and you are ready to go. :)

:rolleyes: Wow, chill out man. For a minute there, I thought I was on the wrong forum!!!:(

[Todd Jensen]

Another useful tip: if you run out of paper in the woods, poke a hole in a leaf with your finger.
:eek: You're going to need more than a Festool to clean that one off.:D

To have to or not to have to, that was the question. I suppose it applies to sandpaper and vacs and all sorts of things.
So far, the shopvac works great for my Hitachi slider, Bosch 3" planer, Dewalt 5" orbital, and my Festool t55. Don't tell anyone, but I've also used 5 hole sandpaper on an 8 hole pad. And had a local shop sharpen my Forrest blades.

Oh, the blasphemy and danger!!

I thought we were woodworkers, not country clubbers, and the only thing that matters is the end result. I guess arguing helps pass the time between projects, though some of you may need to find work. Is the Festool system very nice? Absolutely, and buy it all if you've got the bills. Will many alternatives work equally if not better at the same task? Absolutely, and be creative until you've decided its finished. Did I skimp on the Festool vac and compromise the quality of my finished projects? No way.

Oh, and to answer your 2d question Mac - I doubt Woodcraft would let you 'demo' it in the field, though they'd probably let you try one in the store or at their wood university classes.

[Charles Grosjean]

Ont thing....if you buy a Festool sander, you have to buy Festool abrasives. Festool uses a "propritary" hole pattern so other brands of abrasives will not "work"

Klingspor sells both 5" and 6" 9-hole abrasives. While they may not be local, there is an alternative.

[Randy Denby]

Another useful tip: if you run out of paper in the woods, poke a hole in a leaf with your finger.
:eek: You're going to need more than a Festool to clean that one off.:D
.

Ok...now I gotta question. What is the deal with poking a hole in the leaf? I dont do it with regular TP...my god man, it would take acetone or something to get rid of the stain !! and smell. I proudly let the paper do the work and usually get a good scald on it, unless its one of those never ending greasy wipers. Which can be tied to having a smooth taper or not.Who started this tradition? Did they have any fingernails? . :) This is one "hand" tool I aint trying....I'll stick with the right tool for the yob :D

[Todd Jensen]

:D LOL randy...good stuff. More great advice I can credit a Marine Corps sergeant for(the hole in the leaf).:D