Help on Buying a User plane

[Dan Racette]

Specifically, I have become very interested in buying a combination plane. I am looking for a Stanley 45. I have been reading light research in textbooks, and online resources, and believe that is the plane that will suit my needs. Looking to have a plane that will Groove/Dado, Rebate, bead/tongue. I might even have my eyes on the wrong hardware. Advice is welcomed.

Generally speaking, I am looking for a plane that I can use, and use weekly. I don't want something that would "lose it's value", or perhaps, I am not understanding that either. If I buy a collectible plane and tune it and use it, does it lose value when I repair broken items, rejapan, replace parts, etc. Could I search for another maker's plane and tune that up as a user such as a Sargent or a Record and avoid the higher prices of collectibility of Stanley's. More advice is welcomed.

I have looked at various garage sales, antique stores, and ebay and generally can only find rusty tools or tools that exceed $200. I have found some on ebay that look like they might only take a small amount of work that are sub $100, but I am just wondering what sort of luck people have had with purchasing these.

dan

[David Tiell]

Not sureif it is still available, as someone else was inquiring about it yesterday, but there was one offered for sale in the woodworkers classified section yesterday for what I consider a very resaonable price. Not sure if I'm allowed to do this, but here is the link. I picked up the 608 myself.

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?t=59090

Dave

[David Weaver]

That was a good deal on the 608 - I would've snagged it in a second if I would've seen it.

[David Tiell]

That was a good deal on the 608 - I would've snagged it in a second if I would've seen it.
Yeah, I was really pleasantly surprised I got it. I'm usually not that lucky. Greg was really great about giving me first chance since I asked about it first. And it's cheaper than I've seen a lot of 605s!

[Justin James]

For the uses you describe, a 45 sounds like a good choice. I'd suggest finding a nickel-plated plane without the floral casting; this puts you into the post-1910 period of greatest production (and lower collector's value). Unless you start with a NIB plane, one of these common 45s will suffer little loss of collector's value. I'd also suggest avoiding the products of makers such as Sargent and Record simply because it is harder to find parts.

That said, the next decision is probably whether to buy a complete plane or to part one together. There are pros and cons to each approach. The complete plane is, well, complete; no hunting for parts, but you pay for that convenience. Parting one together is less convenient (OK, sometimes its a real pain!) but you usually save money and learn a lot about the plane. The approach I've used in the past is to find a plane being sold with one iron mounted in the plane; these are often complete except for the missing irons and a few small accessories.

In either case, check the castings carefully for cracks or repairs. The curved arms of the fence seem particularly vulnerable to breakage and repair. Generally speaking, I'd reject any planes with broken or repaired castings unless it was being purchased for parts. Look at the overall condition of the plane: is it something you can live with, or work with? Are any pits or corrosion going to interfere with function? Are all the threads loose, so adjustments can be made easily?

Don't be fooled by some binding in fence movement on the arms, or in the sliding section that supports wider blades; these things always bind a bit.

I can't really say much about the extra bottoms that attach to the main body. I've never used these, having found that I can usually find a wooden plane at a much lower price that will accomplish the same task.

Most missing parts (or if you are parting a plane together) can be found on the 'Bay. Watch out for missing depth stops on the tongue cutters; these can be hard to find for some reason. I'm probably forgetting something here . . . good luck in your search!

[Mark Stutz]

Dan,
The 45 will do just about all you want, though it does not do dadoes well, since it's cross grain. In metal planes, a 46 will work much better.
IMO parting one together will be an exercise in frustration, and would go with a "complete" version. I've seen them go an that auction site for low 100's up to >250...got mine for 150...a user, not a collector.
Don't discount the Ward's or Craftsman versions. These usually can be cheaper, even when complete. They were usually made by Sargent or Stanley and relabelled. I have a Craftsman labelled Sargent that I got at auction for $35. No cutters, but the ones from my modern Record fit. I really like the depth adjusting mechanism much better than the Stanley version. I believe Jim Reed makes new cutters to fit, so you can get only the ones you need. He's a member here but is more often found on Woodnet.
With proper stock selection, sharp cutters and some patience, these planes work very well.

Mark

[Robert Rozaieski]

I got a Sargent 1080 for less than $100 :D. I like it a lot and for the price, you can't beat it.

http://bp1.blogger.com/_f7tWFBwwL80/RieySEcMRDI/AAAAAAAAAB8/jhNZm8Tthdw/s320/Sargent1.jpg

It was basically complete except for the beading stop (of which any make will work and which can easily be gotten on ebay for a couple bucks and which I rarely need anyway) and a few trashed specialty cutters (tongue & sash which I will rarely use anyway). Like you, I got it mostly for use as a plow/dado & beading plane figuring I will occasionally use it for tongue & groove as well (probably will never use it for sash).

http://bp1.blogger.com/_f7tWFBwwL80/RieyuEcMREI/AAAAAAAAACE/el3vgHN46d8/s320/Sargent2.jpg

The pictures are before the cleanup. After two or three hours of cleaning and honing of the irons, it was basically like new.

I decided to look for the Sargent after seeing the prices on a complete Stanley :eek:. Craftsman would be a good user too as they were made by Sargent. Both come up on ebay often enough to be readily available but they don't command near the prices of the Stanley or Record versions as they are not desired by the collectors. Mine works great for all the tasks you mention. For dadoes, forget the spurs/nickers, they're useless. Just score with a knife a few times. It works much better than the spurs/nickers.

You could also look for something like a Stanley #50/Record 050. Their prices are lower and the planes are lighter, but they have less capability. I looked at these as well but ultimately went for the Sargent for the slitting cutter (which can be very handy when you need it), additional plow and beading iron sizes and the wooden tote (which is available on English made Stanley #50s). The price on the Sargent was less than the typical price of a complete Stanley #50/Record 050 anyway, so for me it was a no brainer, but I'm not interested in the collectibility only the useability (is useability a word :confused: ).

[Walt Quadrato]

best advice I can give...buy a complete plane with ALL the parts. There's nothing worse than trying to complete a 45 combination by trying to find parts and pieces..and it'll probably cost you considerably more when doing it piece-meal..

Craftsman were made by Sargent generally..good solid plane..blades are just different enough from the Stanleys to be a problem..but still a good solid plane..and generally less expensive

The 50's..nice light duty planes with a short learning curve, course you can't do as much as a 45 or 55, but they're easier to learn.

In short...spend the extra to get a complete plane. it'll be less expensive and aggravating in the long run.


walt Q