Shaper yes no?

[Kyle Kraft]

I've stumbled across a 5hp single phase shaper, made in Canada, with a boatload of tooling. The guy wants $850 for it all. I have some work lined up to help pay for a small portion of it, maybe $150-$250. Perhaps more work down the road for individuals here and there.

The problem is SWMBO. I can already hear it. "I'd really like to finish the basement, add on to the deck, get some new patio furniture with a pretty umbrella, et al."

I'm going to look at it tonight, and you all know what will happen after that.......I will want it.

How do I sell the idea to her that buying the machine will be a benefit to her???

Remember, I'm a serious hobbiest. I really don't want my fun to become a chore.

Let the suggestions begin!! And thank you to all who contribut ideas!!!:)

[Greg Mann]

How do I sell the idea to her that buying the machine will be a benefit to her???




Don't try to tell her it will be a benefit to her. Unless she wants to make paneled doors of her own she will never see it as a benefit for herself. Tell her you want it for your own happiness. Unless you've been a real jerk in the past she should appreciate you being honest. Then, if she goes along with you, make sure you do something nice to show your appreciation. Dinner and flowers type of thing.


BTW, if she shoots you down, where in Canada is this thing?

[Cliff Rohrabacher]

The Boatload of tooling would be a major selling point.

I'd pay $850 for a trunk of good shaper tooling in a heartbeat~!!

[Jeffrey Makiel]

Tough choice. But I see her point. A nice deck with patio furniture sounds good too. The only thing her argument overlooked was the cold beer. :)

A shaper sounds nice. However, as a hobbyist, my router table is very sufficient and probably more valuable to me than a shaper. Especially considering that I have a small shop and only room for either and not both.

-Jeff :)

[Greg Cole]

IMNSHO, it's better to ask for her forgiveness than ask permission...LOL
Easy for me to say, my lovely wife could care less what I buy or what I pay for it..... pretty much up to me to decide what to do with what I earn. I get the "hun, if you want it just buy it" when I talk "shop" with her.

As Jeff said, if you have a bigger router and a good table... you can do alot with it. Up to you to flip the coin to decide if you want or "need" it.

Coming from someone who has built a deck & privacy "screens" & about 85% done with a stone patio in the last couple weeks..... I could have upgraded my little Ridgid lunch box with the 15" planer of my dreams and fit in a pretty wide drum sander too. That darn "trex" style decking is pricey :cool: . About 2 tons more stone & 100 linear feet of fence to go this month, so I'll be back to having "toyl" money soon!

[Don Bullock]

I'm sorry to say Kyle, but if I had an answer for you I'd have the new router table, jointer and planer that I "NEED.":eek: :rolleyes: But I did manage to get s SS, band saw, bench top drill press and mortiser this year.;) :D

[Jim Becker]

Kyle, it sounds like you have some business use for the machine in addition to your "serious hobbyist" status, both now and into the future. The "deal" is really good considering the tooling. I know I could unlikely walk away from that deal if the machine is in good condition considering that the stuff that comes with it is worth quite a bit. And you could even sell some of the tooling (things you "know" you will never use) to help fund the purchase, too...

[Phil Clark]

Kyle - I have a shaper and five routers. If you can see yourself doing house trim and cabinets more than once, I'd go for it if the shaper is in good shape and the cutters are carbide with more than 1/16" thickness. Otherwise, you can do anything with a router that can be done with a shaper and I'd be saving the money for an addition such as a 25" drum sander.

[Jeff Raymond]

It is easier to beg for forgiveness than to ask for permission.

Works for me.

[Jim Grill]

I've had luck with showing SWMBO what a great deal it is. I look for all new stuff and show her the prices then I go into a really long and boring impromptu description of how the tool is used, what it can do, and, if possible, the history of the tool. After a few hours of that she is usually so bored that she will do nearly anything to get me to stop, including letting me buy it.

Good luck! :D

[Kyle Kraft]

Thanks for all the food for thought. I suppose worst case scenario isI buy the thing, and if I don't use it much or it becomes a place to pile junk on, I sell it.

Hmmmmm. I'll keep thinking on it.

[Joe Jensen]

I've stumbled across a 5hp single phase shaper, made in Canada, with a boatload of tooling. The guy wants $850 for it all. I have some work lined up to help pay for a small portion of it, maybe $150-$250. Perhaps more work down the road for individuals here and there.

The problem is SWMBO. I can already hear it. "I'd really like to finish the basement, add on to the deck, get some new patio furniture with a pretty umbrella, et al."

I'm going to look at it tonight, and you all know what will happen after that.......I will want it.

How do I sell the idea to her that buying the machine will be a benefit to her???

Remember, I'm a serious hobbiest. I really don't want my fun to become a chore.

Let the suggestions begin!! And thank you to all who contribut ideas!!!:)

My wife really has no issue with me buying tools, but I "sold" her on the idea that I needed a power feeder for my shaper so I could build all new cabinet doors for the house. She loved the idea. I built 56 cabiet doors over a one week vacation. (boy I hate sanding that much).

I'd be honest, but also point out the potenial benefits. I've had a 3HP Powermatic shaper in my shop for over 20 years and while I don't use if for many things, IMHO it's WAY better to build cabinet doors. Adding the power feeder was another huge improvement. Now ever edge off the shaper is perfectly smooth and burn free.

[ROY DICK]

Kyle,

Tell her it's on sale and good luck.

Roy

[Anthony Anderson]

Kyle, Can you honestly say that you will really use this heavy duty piece of machinery in the future, and it is not a knee jerk reaction to a great deal? I have talked myself into things that I "need", and things that I will "definately use" sometime in the future, because they were great deals. Truthfully though, I don't "need" many of the things that I have, I have bought them because I wanted them (when it comes down to being honest with myself). If many hobbiests were asked (and they were truthful to others and to themselves) many don't use what is packed into their shop. I have a well packed (for me) home shop, and really don't NEED much of what I have. It makes the shop look nice, and some tools make a job easier, but I don't necessarily NEED everything I have. But I have never, nor would I, put my family in a financially comprimised position to stock my shop. So on that note, if you are able to pay for the shaper without any financial burden to your family, and you have the money in hand, and it won't be missed, then go buy the shaper. It is a good deal. I don't have a shaper, but for that price I would. Are you more confused than ever:)? Good Luck. Let us know how it goes. Regards, Bill

[Joe Chritz]

If that is a Canadian built general with a bunch of tooling it is a good deal.

Like already mentioned depending on the amount of tooling it could be a really good deal. Plus you could most likely clean stuff up and sell it for as much or more than you would have invested if it was ever needed.

I hate good deals. A trip for 4x4 posts ended up with a 6 gallon pancake and crown stapler. Two days after an order for a 7HP 60 gallon upright.

Like dad always says it only hurts once, then your set.

Joe

[Mike Seals]

Let the suggestions begin!! And thank you to all who contribut ideas!!!:)

Well I know many won't agree, but the best thing me and my wife of 20 somethng years did was to split checking accounts. She has hers and I have mine. Each payday we pool the money for the bills and what's left over is ours. We also have a joint savings for times when we need to replace major appliances or go on vacation, etc, etc.

It's turned out to be the best thing we ever did, did it about 12 years ago. When she wants to spend money on plants and things that us tool guys see as a waste, who cares, it's hers and her money. When I drag home a new/used tool or an old car carcass she could careless, it's my money.

[Brian Boru]

Kyle,
Buy it. You will use it IF the tooling is there and in good order.

[Mark J Bachler]

Just Do It.

Get the shaper & then put a nice Steff power feed on it.

[Kyle Kraft]

Well, I'm certainly considering all y'alls wisdom on this. I was thinking if I bought it and didn't really use it that I probably could sell the package for what I paid for it.

Can you purchase custom profile cutters for shapers? I would assume so, but I haven't researched it. The custom molding route may be a way to help with the payback.

[Brian Boru]

http://www.amanatool.com/shaper-cutters.html

http://www.freeborntool.com/

[Ryan Myers]

Kyle,

You need a moonlighting business venture. Sounds like you might already have a lead on starting something.

There is several advantages to this. One is you get to use your business venture as an excuse to buy new tools and equipment. Second is you can deduct tool purchases from your taxes when you have a business.

My wife is keeps asking my how my Griz 1023SL table saw fits into my electrical contracting business :eek: . As well as my Kreg pocket hole tool, my planer, all my nail guns and so many other tools that I have which have nothing to do with my business. :D

[J.R. Rutter]

Check to see if part of the tooling is a head to hold profiled knife steel.

Older ones are called bevel edge. They are generally safe for smaller profiles. It is possible to freehand grind your own profiles for these once you understand the geometry and if you keep them balanced.

Newer ones use corrugated back steel, like moulder heads. They are available to run taller profiles, like crown, and support the knives better. You can run shorter knives in long pockets, so very versatile. A Veil grinder can do custom profiles (if you are patient, and can find one used).

Euro style multi profile heads have chip limiters, so they are safer for freehand (non-feeder) shaping. I don't have direct experience with them, but I know several people here do.

You can get custom profiles ground by many different vendors. Avoid cheap heads - they are not worth it...

[Don Kondra]

I betcha 80% of the work my shaper does is copy shaping curved leg parts with a jig (pic attached) and that alone makes it worth it :)

The other picture shows the difference in size between router bits and shaper cutters. The straight bit and bearing I use mostly is 3" high... wouldn't want to do that on a router table.

FYI the straight bit and bearing was ~$150. Single profile bits such as a lock mitre joint can be had for under $100 @.

Sounds like a good deal to me.

Don.

[Kyle Kraft]

Once again, thanks for the responses. I checked out the links from Brian, and was amazed at the variety of tooling available for shapers. Never paid much attention to the stuff until now.

I went and had a look at the machine Friday, and it is not a Canadian machine, but a 3hp. Taiwanese import similar to Grizz and many others. Not a brand I was familiar with, but I don't think that is too much of a concern, as I know firsthand that many of the parts are interchangeable with current brands. A buddy used some Jet gears to add the second feed speed to his 15" no-name planer, and they dropped right in. As the old saying goes, they're all made in the same factory, but they go down different paint lines.

The gentleman showed me all the tooling, 1/2", 3/4", and 1" spindles, 1/4" & 1/2" router bit collets, wrenches, etc..

Are there any particulars to look for, like a certain fence design, lift mechanism, controls or whatever?