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Scott Shepherd
05-25-2007, 10:18 AM
I'm about two shakes away from buying a vinyl cutting machine and I'd like some advice/input on a specific type of thing I'm trying to do.

I have been turning down vinyl work for a little while now. Recently I decided to stop turning it down and sub it out. I had my first experience with it yesterday and to be honest, I felt like I was being taken for a ride on the pricing.

I can easily see how, with the work I turn down, I could pay for a machine in no time. The issue I haven't worked out is the backing material. There seem to be a lot of PVC or various substrates out there that people in that business use.

However, I have no table saw, and I'm in an office building. It's 5 or 6 stories tall with 100's and 100's of people working in it. Needless to say, anything that makes noise is a no-no.

I'm more than happy to cut things to a rough size with a hand held "Skil-Saw", but I'd like to be able to cut final sizes and shapes on the laser.

I have a 45W machine.

Any idea what would be a good material for this type of setup? I'm looking mainly for outdoor rated substrates.

Or do I need to just forget the concept of doing it that way?

Joe Pelonio
05-25-2007, 10:28 AM
There are very few outdoor durable materials that can be laser cut.

I do signs on MDO, Alumalite, Dibond, PVC, acrylic, banner materials, polystyrene, aluminum and probably others I'm forgetting. Only thing I cut on the laser is acrylic and even then not often because most signs are larger than my 12"x24" laser bed.

PVC materials and polystyrene can easily be cut with a sharp utility knife and metal straight edge. For the rest I'll use table saw or circular saw with a guide. Odd shapes I'll use a sabre saw. The most common material for my signs is the PVC (Sintra/Komatex), and because of the dust and static produced it's a lot better to cut it with knife than saw, unless you like a real mess.

Perhaps you can cut materials by saw at home and bring them in for application of the vinyl.

Doug Bergstrom
05-25-2007, 4:30 PM
Out of all of the equipment we have our vinyl cutter has paid for itself so many time over its not funny. As for base materials, Coroplast is the easiest to work with and we use tons of it. Can be cut easily by hand and cuts like buttter in the laser. Sintra / Komatex can be easily cut with a knife or a vertical cutter like and excaliber or fletcher cutter up to 3mm. You can also use these cutter for plexi, glass, foamcore and gator board. We use a vertical panel saw for everything else but PVC makes a big mess. You can also purchase blanks of metal, komatex, and alumalite from companies like Gregory, Fellers, Grimco that are already cut in many of the popular small sizes. Have you picked out a cutter yet? We have a couple of Rolands and they work great.
Doug

Joe Pelonio
05-25-2007, 4:54 PM
As for base materials, Coroplast is the easiest to work with and we use tons of it. Can be cut easily by hand and cuts like buttter in the laser
Doug
That's the one I forgot. Cheap, and looks OK, though not as nice as other materials. One thing about it though, here outdoors it will last 3-4 years, but in real sunny climates it will start to deteriorate after 1-2 years. Since premium vinyl lasts 7-8 years the lettering always outlasts the substrate.

Also, the colors fade, and white is not very good for double sided signs since it's translucent, with the sun behind it you can see the lettering on the back.
Finally, be careful not to bend it or it will leave a crease.

Scott Shepherd
05-27-2007, 9:52 AM
Thanks Joe and Doug. I'll have to rethink part of this. I don't have a workshop at home, so I'd have to deal with it some other way.

Perhaps having it cut to size as mentioned it the best option for me. That or material that I can score and cut myself.

Is coroplast a hard material? I always thought coroplast was that corogated (sp?) plastic/paper like stuff that was made like a piece of cardboard.

My work would mostly be stuff like outdoor signs mounted to a wood or metal post to say something like "Parking for Residents of Blah Blah Blah" only, all others will be towed".

Is that an application for coroplast or something else?

I guess I need to get some sample chips of materials in here so I can at least talk in the right terms.

Joe Pelonio
05-27-2007, 9:57 PM
Coro will work for that but "classy" places will consider it cheap looking or tacky, for them PVC is better. Coro will cut easily, it's hollow inside as you said, like cardboard box but plastic. PVC in the 3mm requires scoring and breaking or cutting 2-3 passes to get through it.

Aaron Koehl
05-29-2007, 12:37 PM
I'm about two shakes away from buying a vinyl cutting machine and I'd like some advice/input on a specific type of thing I'm trying to do.

I have been turning down vinyl work for a little while now. Recently I decided to stop turning it down and sub it out. I had my first experience with it yesterday and to be honest, I felt like I was being taken for a ride on the pricing.

I can easily see how, with the work I turn down, I could pay for a machine in no time. The issue I haven't worked out is the backing material. There seem to be a lot of PVC or various substrates out there that people in that business use.

However, I have no table saw, and I'm in an office building. It's 5 or 6 stories tall with 100's and 100's of people working in it. Needless to say, anything that makes noise is a no-no.

I'm more than happy to cut things to a rough size with a hand held "Skil-Saw", but I'd like to be able to cut final sizes and shapes on the laser.

I have a 45W machine.

Any idea what would be a good material for this type of setup? I'm looking mainly for outdoor rated substrates.

Or do I need to just forget the concept of doing it that way?
> Needless to say, anything that makes noise is a no-no.

Can't answer your question to well as I just cut my teeth on vinyl signage last weekend.

However, I'm curious about the noise- What kind of dust collector do you use with your laser?

Scott Shepherd
05-29-2007, 1:43 PM
Some minor noise is acceptable, but certainly a table saw wouldn't be!

We have a 650cfm blower. I build a box that goes over it, and carpeted the box, so when it's running, it's actually not as loud as the fans on the laser. All you can see is one hose running into the box and one running out. I put the switch on a remote control, so I just click the remote and the fan starts.

So far we haven't had a single complaint from the people beside or above us (knock on wood).

Joe Pelonio
05-29-2007, 4:23 PM
For me it's more of a smell than noise concern with the neighbors, and it looks like I'll be pushing it this week. Already 78 and supposed to hit 90+ tomorrow, so with their windows open there may be some of my acrylic cutting fumes being noticed for the first time. I'm really only worried about one house that has a window 50' from my exhaust, the others are a good 200+ or more away.

Aaron Koehl
05-29-2007, 5:22 PM
For me it's more of a smell than noise concern with the neighbors, and it looks like I'll be pushing it this week. Already 78 and supposed to hit 90+ tomorrow, so with their windows open there may be some of my acrylic cutting fumes being noticed for the first time. I'm really only worried about one house that has a window 50' from my exhaust, the others are a good 200+ or more away.
If they complain, just cut some rubber stamps. ;)