What kind of snake is this?????

[Jim O'Dell]

I was headed out the back door to get tools from the shop and go to the creek to work on the sprinkler pump set up. I open the back door and in this depression 65133in the step is a snake, head up, I'm about 4 feet away and quickly turn and go back in. I'm glad I wasn't letting the dogs out! I go get a hoe, and come back and its hunkered down into the depression trying to hide.65134 I poke at him to try to get a better look and get a picture and he takes off across the porch and gets behind some loose screens and LOML's obedience equipment that is stashed on the porch. Have to pull it all out piece by piece (from the long end of the hoe!!! Yeah, I'm chicken) and finally get him where I can hit him with the hoe. I'm guessing water moccasin, but I'm not sure. He was sure trying to kill the hoe!! I laid an 8" brick beside him to show the length. 65136I'm guessing between 2 and 2 1/2' long. Mousy brown color, no real markings. It does appear to have a (should I say DID appear to have a??) triangular shaped head, 65135so I'm guessing part of the viper family??
This is only the second or third snake we've seen in 3 years here. The other two were bright green tree snakes, very pretty. Left them alone. Thanks for any insight you can give. I hope it wasn't a rat snake, but regardless would not have wanted it up against the house.
Now, where are the rest of it's family?????? Jim.
ps: I think I'm going to pass on the work down at the creek tonight. It's thick english ivy down there, and the rest of the family could be waiting for me!!

[Joe Pelonio]

Sounds like a cottonmouth, are those native there?

[Aaron Hamilton]

The head doesn't look quite triangular enough to be a water moccasin, although I've seen some that didn't have as pronounced of a head. Did you happen to take a butter knife and pry open his nasty little mouth? that will tell you for sure. Look at the roof of his mouth and if you see too very pronounced ridges that are bright white...you can be sure. The markings definitely resemble a WM, but also could be the common rat snake.

[Jim O'Dell]

The head doesn't look quite triangular enough to be a water moccasin, although I've seen some that didn't have as pronounced of a head. Did you happen to take a butter knife and pry open his nasty little mouth? that will tell you for sure. Look at the roof of his mouth and if you see too very pronounced ridges that are bright white...you can be sure. The markings definitely resemble a WM, but also could be the common rat snake.

YOU WANT ME TO DO WHAT?????!!!!! Man, I've never seen a butter knife with 6' handles on it. I KNOW I don't own one.:D :D :D :D
I need to do a google on the 2 snakes and get some pictures. Thanks guys. Jim.

[Dennis Peacock]

Looks to be non-poisonous to me. We have a few snakes around here most any time of the spring or summer. Most so far have been nothing to worry about.

[Rick Williams]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agkistrodon_piscivorus_leucostoma

[mark page]

Jim,
Can't tell from the pictures. But all poisonous snakes in North America have cats eyes. Pupils are slitted like a cat's. (except for the coral snake which is only found in very southern regions. Coral snakes resemble king snakes...red, yellow, black rings. They stay very small and about the size around of what we used to call kindergarten pencils. The big fat ones. The corals have very small fangs at the very back of their mouth, can only bite you between your fingers, earlobes, between toes, and if the do, KYA goodbye). Round eyes and let it live another day, slitted and give him a chop...Now you say you aren't going to get down and have an "eye to eye chit-chat with him...you can pin his body down with the hoe behind his head and you can actually see their pupils from quite a safe distance.
These days are long over and gone, but the days of land survival in the military, 2-3 weeks living and eating on what you could, I'd of ate him and the rest of his family too!!!
Now non poisonous snakes can still put a bite on you that will hurt, they are very strong mouthed and can get aggressive. LOML got bit by a large black snake that got into the farm house and it drew blood. She wanted him out and he didn't want to go!! If needing to move a snake, pin the head down harmlessly but firmly, grab directly behind his head with thumb and forefinger pressure directly on his body against his head. (like you were going to choke him from behind if they had necks). They cannot hurt you in any way during this hold. They may wriggle a bit and a smaller one may wrap his tail around your hand trying to get leverage to free himself, but don't fear. Take him out to the garden and turn him loose. Helps keep the mice and small varmint population down. Gloves are optional, but I find that gloves are slippery, especially leather ones, and I can't hold one properly with gloves on without doing some possible harm to the snake.
Only phobia I have is with spiders:eek: , someone throws a spider on me and I'll probably need psychological rehabilitation.......

[Ben West]

Finally, a subject I can write about with some degree of expertise.

First, a triangular head is a poor indicator to determine whether a snake is venomous (technicality: snakes are venomous, not poisonous). While it is true that the North American pit vipers have an angular head, so do many, many non-venomous species, such as hognose snakes. It's just not a reliable indicator.

Aside from the coral snakes, as mentioned earlier, all venomous snakes in North America are pit vipers. 3 characteristics are unique about pit vipers as compared to other snakes.

1) They have two small holes or pits (hence the name) between the nostril and eye, which they use to detect heat signatures from their prey.

2) The scales on the bottom of their body, between the anus and the end of the tail, occur in one row of scales. On non-venomous snakes, there are 2 rows of scales there.

3) As Mark mentioned, pit vipers have elliptical pupils; other species (including coral snakes) have round pupils. This seems a difficult thing to use, although in good light and with good eyesight you can easily see this at about 6-7 feet, which is a safe distance. Contrary to urban legend, snakes can only strike at a distance about 2/3 their total body length. So a really big snake, say a 6-footer, could only strike about 4 feet.

Snakes are such unique and ecologically valuable animals; it's too bad they've gotten such a bad reputation. The danger of being killed by snake bite is exceedingly rare, only about 15 people in the U.S. die of snake bite each year. And the vast majority of those were bitten while playing with, harassing, or trying to kill the snake. If you leave every snake alone that you see, your chances of being bitten and dying are probably signfiicantly less than winning the Powerball!

Food for thought.

[Brad Schmid]

It doesn't appear to be a Cottonmouth based on these observations of your pictures:

1) It appears to have a light colored underside, whereas a cottonmouth will have a black or brown belly
2) A Cottonmouth of that length would typically have a much heavier body
3) The species of Cottonmouth here in Texas (Western) are typically very dark in color. This snake does not look dark in the pictures.
4) It does not appear to have an eliptical pupil in the picture

Flip it over and look at the scales on the underside of the tail. A Cottonmouth will have a single row of scales (as opposed to a double row). Also, open the mouth and look for the white lining.

My guess is that it's a Yellowbelly or Plain-bellied water snake. They can be quite aggressive, probably more so than a cottonmouth.

No matter, they all taste like chicken:D
Cheers

[Bill Lewis]

What kind of snake is this?????

In the immortal words of Dr. "Bones" McCoy "He's Dead Jim"

Thanks to all of the snake experts for their informative answers, I learned something today.

[Rob Bourgeois]

water snake... they have quite the temper.

[James Carmichael]

I'd say a TX rat snake, very common here in Western Tarrant county and somewhat resembles a western diamondback.

I'm right on the edge near Parker Co. and see my share of snakes, including the young crotalus atrox that bit my dog out on the back porch. I had seen the little bugger a week before and thought it was a rat snake, so I left him alone.

[Tim Brooks]

yep, you killed a good one....

He's a rat snake... Those are our friends... :eek:

I will say this, however, when in doubt, kill it. I grew up in Georgia where snakes are abundant. Rattlesnakes and copperheads are the feared snakes. Both have very identifiable markings and always found their death when our paths intersected. My biggest to date was a 6 ft rattlesnake. Scared us beyond measure as I ran over him in some deep grass on my motorcycle. Fortunately, we were in a lime rock quarry so there were plenty of weapons around to take care of the problem. Needless to say, he was very, very upset that we woke him from his slumber.

[Dan Gill]

What kind of snake is this?

Punch line . . .

Wait for it . . .

A dead one.

Looks like a rat snake to me. The funny thing was, as I was looking at this post, a co-worker came in and told me that there was an upside-down trash can in the foyer with the sign "Warning - Snake Inside" on it.

[Cliff Rohrabacher]

Don't like snakes I see.

[Jim O'Dell]

Thanks for all the replies. It made for a wild few minutes chasing it across the porch. Good information presented! Jim.

[Bonnie Campbell]

As an aside, not to high jack the thread.... but if anyone just happens to kill a copperhead or rattler I could use the hide :D All you'd have to do is skin it and salt the hide, I'd tan it. I use the hides on some of my turkey calls.... Can't offer to buy the hide, since that's illegal....

[Brent Dowell]

We just moved to 68 acres of desert in Nevada, and I'm not a big snake fan either. That being said, It's been kind of a 'snakey' week around here. I work out of the house and last week on garbage day, I noticed the garbagemen were hanging around down at the end of the drive WAyyyy longer than usual. I grabbed a shovel and headed down to check out what was going on.

It looked like they were picking up rocks over and over trying to kill a sage brush at the end of the drive. I get down there and there was in fact about a 2 1/2 foot rattler in the middle of the road (completely unhurt at this point). I didn't skin him, but I did harvest the rattle off his tail. Not sure what to do with it, but I stuck it on the shop will. I just hope I never get too large of a collection.

I grabbed a decent size rock (Amazing how plentiful they are in the desert) and gave it a little toss and it landed right on the head and killed the durn thing. Apparently, the snake had curled up under the big rolling garbage can and gave the garbage guy a nasty little surprise when he tried to wheel it to the back of the truck. I don't think they were going to leave till they killed it any way.

My deal with the rattlesnakes around here is if I don't see you, you get to live. I see you, and it's on.

Yesterday, I was walking around the house and almost stepped on a 4 foot gopher snake in the gravel. Fortunately, the wife was inside and the neighbors were too far away to hear my unintelligible outburst. I've seen this guy around before and keep my eye out for him. I call him Goofy the gopher snake. I've always had a pretty severe phobia about snakes, but I figure having one or two safe rodent eating creatures around the house sure beats having the rattlers....

[Steve Hayes]

I heard that some rattlesnakes are being born with the rattle but it doesn't rattle anymore. Whatever is inside the rattle is not there anymore. So much for the early warning device.

[Jim Becker]

I think that's actually a dead snake....