Retail store service

[Kirk (KC) Constable]

I've read all the posts in the thread about the 'unnamed' store that we all know is Woodcraft...

As to the 'help' issue... I'm not sure we can lump specialty stores like Woodcraft in with retail stores in general. As a rule, people are going in the Woodcraft with a purpose. Whether it's to browse or buy, they're generally not walking in off the street just to 'see what's in there'. Yeah, the store personnel oughta greet you and determine whether you need help, but if they fawn over you and follow you around <i>making sure</i> you know what you want, somebody would gripe about <i>that</i> showing a condescending attitude and the feeling of being smothered by snobby salespeople.

The Woodcraft guys here know me by name, and they know if I need help I'll ask for it...and when I ask for help I get it. I've waited patiently at the counter to checkout for several minutes while one of the guys (or all the guys) helped somebody else, and 'ignored' me...but I've been on the other side of that situation, too...so I try to understand.

I had an 'incident' several years back and sent an Email to Corporate to vent my frustration. My situation wasn't with terrible service (or lack of it), it was with dumb stocking and bulk-sales rules. Manager called me at home that evening, 'took care of' a recent order (quite a bit of $$) I'd made even though I insisted it wasn't necessary, and made me feel good about doing business with them. I spent much money there before, and I've spent much money there since.

Right or wrong, being 'recognized' by store personnel helps the service level. It's just a fact of life. Introduce yourself to the manager. Introduce yourself to the new employee next time you're in the store...or better yet, have one of the other guys that's knows you introduce you. In most cases, they're woodworkers, too. Chances are this is their first retail job...but my experience has been that they're <i>knowledgable</i> about their product and willing to help if you let them. Help them to help you by having a bit more patience than you would at McDonald's...or better yet, go to work there and fix it!

KC

[Steve Roxberg]

I agree with your statements. I have a great local Woodcraft, some of the Woodcraft stores are corporate owned, you might want to check.

It's nice having them know your name, until SWMBO is with you and they yell "Hi Steve" when you walk in.

:D

[Scott Whiting]

Unless you are in to turning pens the local Woodcraft sucks. We do have a well stocked (supplies and people) Rockler. I've only been out there a few times but both the manager and asistant manager greet me by name. Even before they knew me I was always greeted when I walked in. Helps take some of the edge off of the 2 hour round trip :)

Scott

[Dave Hammelef]

Originally posted by Scott Whiting
..... Helps take some of the edge off ...... :)

Scott

Scott I thought you were in the business of putting the edge back on :D

[John Miliunas]

Although I feel bad for the folks who have not had a good experience(s) with Woodcraft, I'm one of those who has. Would I like to have a Rockler or similar nearby, as well? You bet, but I don't, so I usually do Woodcraft. We do have another WW store in town, but they don't stock nearly as much stuff. Now, speaking of "stocking", that IS one area where I've had some issues with my local WC store. Some stuff I can understand, but when you walk in there on the first day of a sale and they tell you it's out of stock, not in yet or backordered, that tends to P.O. me a bit. On the other hand, when this does happen, any one of the guys will immediately offer to set one aside as soon as the item(s) comes in and give me a call. Actually, I pretty much insist on that part now, because I've had experiences when they say, "Sorry, not here yet, but it will be on the truck Wednesday." Needless to say, I swing in there Wed. and it's NOT there! In their defense, much of this can be attributed to the way Corporate spreads the merchandise out. Even if it's a local owner, they are still subject to the whims of the corporate office.

The one specific time, which made me so utterly happy with them, is when they were redoing some of their classroom shop. They had an Excalibur overarm guard, which the mgr. said, "Nobody ever uses the thing." So, they took it off, but instead of "closing it out" on the floor, the mgr. hung on to it until the next time I came in. He knew that I'd been interested in one, but just didn't have the $$. As it happens, it was my birthday and he KNEW it, because LOML had stopped in to pick up a present for me. Well, to make a long story short, that Excalibur now resides on my TS for a grand total of $175.00! (I already posted that "gloat" on the Pond months ago, so don't get on my case!:D ) The unit literally did not have a single scratch on it and I think they gave me enough hardware to mount three of them!

Since then, I've had similar, less expensive, "favors" done for me by any number of the staff there, one of which might even have gotten the sales guy into trouble with the manager! No, the WC near me is not perfect and much could be done real easily to improve it, but it's not a store I stay away from, either. Fact is, when it's been a while and I do show up, I've got just about every one of the guys saying they were worried that something "bad" had happened to me! Yup, I feel welcome there.:cool:

[George@Colonel's Workshop]

Good Afternoon KC,

I hope all is well with you, and that your shop floor has no new evidence of divits. :<). A couple years before I retired I went back to school full time just for the fun of it, and earned a Masters in Food Marketing. The best lesson learned was "Get and Stay Close to the Customer". I think of it every time I walk into a shop, or get on the net or telephone to make a purchase. And every time a customer calls me on the phone or visits me in the shop, or asks for a house call it is first and foremost in my mind.

I know how good it is for all parties to have repeat business.

George

[John Piwaron]

Yeah, being out of stock on something is a definite annoyance. They're always willing to order, but I'm not always willing to drive back. Particularly if it's a small item. Rant mode off.

The good part is that when I want help, they're there for me. The local store (in Milwaukee) has two people that are particularly good. One is a member of the church I attend and the other is a woman. I think she's the only female staff member. I wish I could remember their names. They deserve kudos for helpfulness and attitude.

Here's the best part - it's not always a wasted trip if WC is out of stock, Rockler is only a mile away! There's store that needs a bit more friendlyness.

[JayStPeter]

I have a variety of hobbies that require specialty outlets to purchase the necessary equipment. In general, I've found that the woodworking outlets I've dealt with have better customer service than any of the others. I've had Grizzly, Delta, Woodpeck, Jointech, Woodcraft, Rockler, Woodline Az and others bend over backwards to make me happy.
My local Woodcraft is actually a woodworkers club with some retail space. But, they are extra helpful and appreciative of my business. The owner is usually the one helping. They also leave me alone to wander the store and ask for help if I need it.
That said, I also find there tends to be more customer service necessary in woodworking. There is something about these products and the way they are produced. It seems you can't really count on getting it right the first time. Seems like the more you spend, the more likely you are to need customer service. I can't really think of one item I've bought for over $400 that hasn't needed something that was significant (I'm not talking about touch up paint for scratches here, I mean something critical to the proper/safe operation of the device). I believe that a woodworking outfit without good customer service will soon be out of business. It seems critical to success in this industry.
As for stores with lazy/unhelpful sales people. My observation being in the seat of a manager that hired people for a project is this. Even with good interviewing skills, your chances are only about 3 of 4 that you'll get a decent employee, and only 1 of those will be outstanding. With lesser interviewing skills, far far less. It is probably difficult to find employees willing to work for $6/hr with any knowledge of woodworking. Plus, the owners of a Woodcraft are unlikely to have finely honed interviewing skills. So, I can cut a store a little slack on customer service for the first person you talk to. If you contact someone in charge at the store and their CS skills are also poor, then it's time to stop doing business there. This includes my list of great service places above. In all cases, the first person I contacted was not the one who went above and beyond for me.

Jay St. Peter

[markus shaffer]

i think Jay just pointed out one of the critical factors in all of this discussion. In general, the people you are going to get to work for under $10 dollars an hour are not really inclined to all that enthusiastic about their jobs. while that may not be any excuse for poor behavior, i think with the addition to having to deal with the general populace, it can be argued that customer service might be the last thing on the mind of a retail employee.

my retail experience from the other side goes like this:

LOML and her sister run a small antique and estate jewelry store here in new york city. it's on a block with similar stores (sort of hoity-toity boutiques, salons and the such). last year they were away for a few days and I had to run the store. mind you, this place is set up like a gallery. jewelry displayed in cases sunk in the walls and on tabletop easels. it's a nice place. nothing like any of these chain stores at the mall. getting to the point, after 4 days of dealing with some of the people who came in, i was ready to start pulling my hair out (a painful prospect considering the mop i have). one guy came in and asked if we sold hubcaps!!! and a question that gets asked almost daily goes something like this, "what's the carat weight of this 18 carat gold ring?" on top of that, they also sell things on ebay. some of the email they get is downright painful to read. i'll not go into detail, but i assure you, these two have all the respect i could ever muster for anyone considering how well they deal with some of their customers. while this might sound a little extreme, i just don't think the general public in this country is all that intelligent. that's another topic that probably should be explored on another website though.

point being is, i can see that if you're not being paid all that much and on a daily basis you deal with a good amount of idiocy, one might begin to care less for their attitude towards the customers. not to mention that if you work in a specialty store such as a woodworking store, even if your behavior is less than stellar, it really won't matter because there aren't woodworking stores on every block. thus while some irate customers will permanantly take their business elsewhere(which usually means mail order) the majority will grudgingly come back because in many cases it is the only local retail outlet.

now i'm not trying to excuse poor behavior by any means. i will say that customer service is one of the most important factors to me personally when i make any sort of serious punchase. at the end of the day though, you have to figure out what in life is really worth getting upset about. the people at the woodcraft store might just be the knuckleheads you think they are and it's always worthwhile to write a letter to the manager or the company and let them know, but i think the bottom line is that most people who work retail jobs are not going to care all that much about their customers.

just my 2 centavos...

-markus

[William Parks]

For about 3 years Woodcraft was basically the only game in town. Hated that store but it was a couple of miles from my home. At the time it was pirvately owned and the owner(s) treated customers poorly. Eventually W/C corporate took over the store and I think they still own/operate it. Still not a very friendly store.

Then late last year Rockler opened up 20 miles away. What a difference. Friendly people, usually well stocked, and I actually look forward to go there and spend my money when the need arises. I've never been in Rockler when it wasn't busy, but a couple of weeks ago I stopped in W/C on a Saturday afternoon and not one customer in the store.

Besides our local wood working group supporting Rockler, it's just darn nice people to do business with.

[Bruce Page]

Woodcraft opened here about 4 months ago. Before that, the only show in town was Woodworkers Supply and man, have they taken a lot of my money over the years!

I love having a second choice, and so far the people at Woodcraft have been knowledgeable & great to deal with.

[Jason Roehl]

As for the sub-$10/hr. thing. The area I live in actually considers that to be decent pay. Employers and employees alike. If you actually get 40 hrs/wk at that rate, that's $20k/yr before taxes. I suppose if you're single, eat Ramen, drive an '83 Corolla and don't plan on retiring, you just might be able to make it on that. But reality is that I saw a figure of around $34k/yr is what one needs to sustain a family of 4. That's $17/hr.

So, if someone is stuck in a near-minimum wage job, I wouldn't expect much of them. But, if I want customer service, I give them every opportunity to succeed. I learn THEIR names (they might want to know yours, then), >I< greet THEM when I go in a store, and after awhile, the tables turn and they start greeting me and such.

I guess what I'm really saying is to not treat retail workers like servants. Treat them like equals, and they'll be more likely to be of service then.

Never hurts to ask for stuff, too. We've rarely paid for the first gallon of any new paint that we've tried in our painting biz.

Spread the positive. Doesn't always work, but it helps.

Jason

Or, if you're feeling feisty, there's always my favorite (though I've never actually used it), "May I please see your supervisor--what was your name again?"