Riving Knife To Become Standard

[Dan Lautner]

This weekend I spoke with a tool supplier in the LA area and was told several companies will be adding a riving knife to there table saws. Delta will have a brand new unisaw design. After a major kick back using a TS I will no longer operate one without a riving knife.

Dan

[Randal Stevenson]

Already federal regulations in place and it's happening. Found out about it via another forum, I believe. But if I remember right (as the original poster thought it was next year), that it takes effect in 2014.

Wondering when the shorter fence regs will take effect in this country?

[Phil Pritchard]

Hi guys!

Welcome to the the 1970s...... I'm always amazed that American woodworking machinery manufacturers (and their copyists) seem mired in the 1960s in engineering design terms. If the date is 2014 that will make the USA just 40 years behind the Brits - it's normally us that are 20 years behind you. Oh well, at least it's a step in the right direction, so a "Well done!" to whoesever got it mandated

BTW we don't mandate the "short" rip fence design in the EU - we do, however, train all our trades woodworkers in it's use and have done so for over 30 years now

Phil

[Martin Shupe]

Hi guys!

Welcome to the the 1970s...... I'm always amazed that American woodworking machinery manufacturers (and their copyists) seem mired in the 1960s in engineering design terms. If the date is 2014 that will make the USA just 40 years behind the Brits - it's normally us that are 20 years behind you. Oh well, at least it's a step in the right direction, so a "Well done!" to whoesever got it mandated

BTW we don't mandate the "short" rip fence design in the EU - we do, however, train all our trades woodworkers in it's use and have done so for over 30 years now

Phil

Hi Phil,

Please tell me what you mean by "short" rip fence. Short in height? or short in length? If you can post a pic, please do. Sorry I am so naive about this topic, but it sounds interesting.

Thanks,

[Mark Carlson]

I was wondering if General had any plans to add a riving knike to the 350/650. Even though General makes one of the best saws (quality wise) most people are looking for a riving knife so that limits the choices to a PM 2000, a SawStop, or a european slider style saw.

~mark

[Ed Falis]

Short in length (you can use a Unifence the same way). Since the fence doesn't reach to the back of the blade, less chance of binding and kickback.

[Bruce Benjamin]

Hi guys!

Welcome to the the 1970s...... I'm always amazed that American woodworking machinery manufacturers (and their copyists) seem mired in the 1960s in engineering design terms. If the date is 2014 that will make the USA just 40 years behind the Brits - it's normally us that are 20 years behind you. Oh well, at least it's a step in the right direction, so a "Well done!" to whoesever got it mandated

BTW we don't mandate the "short" rip fence design in the EU - we do, however, train all our trades woodworkers in it's use and have done so for over 30 years now

Phil

Riving Knife on a Table Saw: Advantage, EU.:rolleyes:

Everything else: Advantage, USA.:cool:

Bruce

[Nissim Avrahami]

That's a drawing from the UK OSHA.

My table saw came with short fence that can be moved forward or back for different blade heights.

Bruce, we have also the advantage of Euro prices...that are double than in USA :)

65065

[Greg Peterson]

The riving knife is one of the reasons I am considering the PM2000 over anything else (sorry, but Sawstop is out of my range).

I'm not sure why the other TS manufacturers are dragging their heels, but it doesn't seem that putting a riving knife onto a TS would be a major overhaul.

[Jeffrey Schronce]

New Jet cabinet saws have riving knife options. Check out the promo flyer at www.jettools.com (http://www.jettools.com)

[George Lesniak]

I spoke to a Steel City rep this past weekend. SC will have a line of table saws with riving knives starting in September. The real news was they are working on a retrofit kit for SC saws already in the field.

[Chris Friesen]

I'm not sure why the other TS manufacturers are dragging their heels, but it doesn't seem that putting a riving knife onto a TS would be a major overhaul.

A real riving knife stays just below the top of the blade regardless of blade height. This generally requires that the arbour moves vertically rather than rotating around a pivot like it does on most north american-style saws. This means they have to redesign all the mechanical guts of the saw.

[Andrew Williams]

Having spent quite a bit of time looking very closely at my new SawStop trunnions I can honestly say that I believe it involves a great many design changes to implement a true riving knife on an old-style saw trunnion. I can see why Delta and Steel City are jumping on the riving knife bandwagon (cannot say the same for WMH since the PM2000 already has one). Personally, the riving knife was pretty high on my list but the real kicker was the emergency brake feature. That also requires a totally redesigned arbor block assembly as well.

[Steve Schoene]

I believe the regulations are a UL requirement for listing. The difference in years is due to a phase in. New models have to have the riving knives earlier, and the later date is when all table saws, newly designed or based on old designs must have the riving knive.

[Larry Conely]

The riving knife was one of the reasons I purchased my Inca 12 inch table saw 14 years ago. Yes, the arbor rises and falls in a straight line. The fence can be used "short" if desired.

I also had a 259 Inca table saw that had only a short fence.

Larry

[Brad Naylor]

Here in Europe table saws have been fitted with riving knives for as long as I've been woodworking, so I've never used a saw without one. The knife is bolted to an assembly on the arbour behind the blade and set to a height above the height of the blade. On most saws a crown guard is bolted to the top of the riving knife. As previously stated the knife rises and falls (and tilts) with the blade maintaining the same relative height. In Europe it is against the law in a trade environment to run a saw without a riving knife or the guard. I am sure a similar law will apply in the US.

So...

Get ready to ditch a whole load of table saw techniques which would currently appear to be standard practice your side of the pond;

Dado blades...
Tenoning jigs...
Making coving...
Panel raising...

All these and more will be totally impossible within regulations and within your shop insurance policy.

As Phil says, welcome to the 1970's!

Cheers
Brad

[Bill Lewis]

The "Short Fence" is one of the reasons I decided to go with the Unifence vs the Bies when I bought my saw. I then added the Bies splitter which, though not a true riving knife, is still arguably a good close second. As Brad points out, the splitter still allows me to do all the things you can not do with a fixed riving knife.

[Russ Filtz]

How is a short fence anchored? only from the front edge? It'd have to be pretty stiff so you didn't get any flex laterally. Seems like the Bies style fence is better with clamps on both ends. Maybe a "Z" shaped fence would work to get both benefits (patent pending!) :p

[Ken Belisle]

This weekend I spoke with a tool supplier in the LA area and was told several companies will be adding a riving knife to there table saws. Delta will have a brand new unisaw design. After a major kick back using a TS I will no longer operate one without a riving knife.



When you had your major kick-back, did you have a splitter on your saw? I'm still trying to figure out what the big advantage of the riving knife is, other than a little convenience. My splitter stays mounted on my saw and if I need to cut some dados, I just pop it out. Compared to the effort involved going from a standard blade to a dado, removing the splitter is a non-issue; the same with going back to the standard blade. It's a 5 second operation.

Would someone please explain to me what this big advantage of the riving knife is?

[Fred Craven]

The riving knife was one of the reasons I purchased my Inca 12 inch table saw 14 years ago. Yes, the arbor rises and falls in a straight line. The fence can be used "short" if desired. ...

Ditto, but for me it was 9 years ago. I also liked the ability to move the rails to either side of the blade thus alowing the blade to tilt away from the fence (like a left tilt) simply by moving the fence and rails to the left. At the time it was the safest non-slider saw available.

I don't think that a table saw would HAVE to have a verticle arbor to run a shark fin style riving knife (which never has to be removed) but it certainly makes it a lot easier. If a single pivot point on the arbor is placed higher than the arbor, it might-could be done

From a safety perspective do you need a riving knife for non-thru cuts? I don't think so, but it's nice to not even think about it, it's just always there (until I put on a dado head).

[Clay Crocker]

How is a short fence anchored? only from the front edge? It'd have to be pretty stiff so you didn't get any flex laterally. Seems like the Bies style fence is better with clamps on both ends. Maybe a "Z" shaped fence would work to get both benefits (patent pending!) :p


As far as I know, the biesemeyer and its clones (I have General's version) all "clamp" to the front rail only. I used to have a Sears Crapsman that clamped to the front and rear rails and it SUCKED:mad:

[Steve Schoene]

The biggest advantage is that it is typically much closer to the blade than the splitter.

While diligence can ensure the splitter is put back on after every cut where it must be removed, not having to remove it so often makes it easier to be sure it's always on when needed.

[Chris Friesen]

Would someone please explain to me what this big advantage of the riving knife is?

It curves around the blade and stays close to the blade as the blade is raised/lowered.

Some of them are shark-fin style and don't stick up above the blade, so they can be left on for non-through cuts (dados, grooves, etc.)

[Jason Crees]

Get ready to ditch a whole load of table saw techniques which would currently appear to be standard practice your side of the pond;

Dado blades...
Tenoning jigs...
Making coving...
Panel raising...

All these and more will be totally impossible within regulations and within your shop insurance policy.

As Phil says, welcome to the 1970's!

Cheers
Brad

From what I have seen, all of the US tablesaws have removeable riving knives for these types of cuts. Not sure on the new code, but I would guess that they will allow them to be removeable for these applications.

[lou sansone]

Hi guys!

Welcome to the the 1970s...... I'm always amazed that American woodworking machinery manufacturers (and their copyists) seem mired in the 1960s in engineering design terms. If the date is 2014 that will make the USA just 40 years behind the Brits - it's normally us that are 20 years behind you. Oh well, at least it's a step in the right direction, so a "Well done!" to whoesever got it mandated

BTW we don't mandate the "short" rip fence design in the EU - we do, however, train all our trades woodworkers in it's use and have done so for over 30 years now

Phil


american machines have had riving knives for decades before the 70's. take look at the oliver 260d from the 40's .

lou