St James Bay Tool Co - experiences?

[Adriaan Schepel]

Hi everyone.

From time-to-time I've seen fleeting references to the St James Bay Tool Co, but nothing much.

I had a look through their website this morning, and could not get over the bargain prices on their planes (at least when the site was last updated). Where else can you buy a complete and handled cocobolo infill bronze-bodied plane for $400?

Has anyone had the experience of dealing with SJBTC? And does anyone own one of their infills?

Curious, all the way from Sydney,
Adriaan

[Clint Jones]

I havent bought an infill from them but I have ordered many replacement parts and blades for planes that they make. Their stuff is quality made and they have good customer service. I would suggest calling them but since youre not in the US you may want to email them.

[Joel Goodman]

Fine Woodworking Tools and Shops had a piece on building one of their kits in the Winter 2005/2006 issue.

[Walt Quadrato]

Good people, good tools, highly recommended

walt Q

[Craig J Brain]

I've been trying to email St James Bay Tool Co., but I keep getting error messages. I don't have that issue with any other addresses I use. Anyone know if there is a problem with their site?

Thanks,

Craig

[David Weaver]

I'd call them if you want to get something and email isn't working. set aside a little time, though because you might be on the phone longer than you expect. i haven't bought an entire plane but i did buy a dovetail plane kit and for the price, it's really fantastic.

[Jessica Pierce-LaRose]

FWIW, I've noticed they're selling stuff on eBay (user name " st.jamesbaytoolco " ) - I hadn't noticed that before, but it seems like they've been doing it for a while.

[David Weaver]

Yeah, same stuff (how many people would be named that, anyway?). That was the origin of my plane kit, ebay, and I called the owner after ordering to see if I could switch the width of the plane since he had several other kits. I think I was on the phone for 45 minutes. He knows his stuff about tools, and is genuinely very interested in them.

[Brian Kerley]

I've been trying to email St James Bay Tool Co., but I keep getting error messages. I don't have that issue with any other addresses I use. Anyone know if there is a problem with their site?

Thanks,

Craig

Put some time aside and call him, you will be on the phone for close to an hour. He is a one man shop. Even when you visit the place, he usually is in the back running machinery, not up front. Granted, he probably doesn't get much foot traffic. Interesting fellow no doubt.

[Mike Allen1010]

I bought a cast infil plane kit from them. The written instructions were not very helpful but on the phone they were great. I spoke w/ them last about 4 months ago and I think they were selling only kits - no finished planes (but I don't want to speak for them).

Mike

[Terry Beadle]

I bought a coffin in-fill smoother along with an extra blade. Bob is not email friendly but he's great on the phone. I have gotten email responses but it's sporadic. When I bought my kit about 4 years ago, he was discontinuing making completed planes...again it's up to Bob. The kit took a bit of time to do as I only worked on it when I felt like it and other projects permitted.

The completed plane will take sub-thou shavings no sweat. The blade is a bit tickle-ish to adjust. I did put a screw adjustor on mine but if I did it again, I'd just use a small hammer.

Here's a pic of the parts sent in the box just opened and the completed plane.

232164232165

Cocobolo infill, blade is 01 which sharpens easy and keeps an edge, I think, 50 + degree bed, rock maple diamond. Worth every penny and a bit more IMHO.

Brese used to offer plane kits but he's temporarily ( over a year now I think ) suspended the offer. Brese's kits are an easier task to build I think. I tested one of his at a wood show and they were a dream plane for sure.

Enjoy the process !

[Mike Allen1010]

[QUOTE=Terry Beadle;1927751]

232164232165

"blade is 01 which sharpens easy and keeps an edge, .."

Hello Terry,

I built the SJB version of the Norris #53. I had some trouble getting a sharp edge to the blade - I think it's the same 01 steel as yours ( I got whatever blade came with the kit). I'm not familiar with 01 steel blades and I didn't really give the blade the proper lapping and initial sharpening time it deserves as I had an A2 Hock blade I was more familiar with that was already set up and ready to go and I ended up using that.

I'm wondering if I should try building a woodie to use the SJB blade. Did you notice any difference in sharpening and edge characteristics with the 01 SJB Blade versus a typical A2 to blade?



"i did buy a dovetail plane kit and for the price, it's really fantastic"

David, I've never built a dovetailed infill plane before but would like to give it a try and think kit is the best way to go. I looked at the SJB website and I didn't see anything about dovetailed infill plane kits - do you remember the name/model number of the kit you got from them? I would like to give them a call and ask about it.

Thanks for the help!

All the best, Mike

[David Weaver]

Mike - give them a call and ask if they have any (ebay is where I saw them, they definitely weren't on the website at the time, either). I know he makes them in batches and sometimes he has them and sometimes he doesn't. Sometimes they're with adjuster, sometimes they're not, etc. Sometimes they're brass sided, sometimes they're steel.

But I think the dovetailed kits are probably the easiest way for a guy without access to a machine shop to bang a plane together. scratch built is also an option, but there is a LOT of work in doing all of the metalwork from flat stock if you're doing it entirely by hand, and having pre-cut sides and bottoms to basically clean up is a real time saver.

Compared to other kits out there, his prices are absurdly low (that's not a bad thing) and the iron and cap iron combination that I got with mine is excellent. I believe the kit with everything you need (I might have needed to get 1/4" round stock for pins, I don't remember) was only about $140.

At any rate, if you do get a kit and run into issues with construction (filing, marking whatever), let any of us know. It's not too hard to make a plane, but it's easy to make a paperweight, too. (my first one was totally scratch built except the lever cap screw, and it was ugly with a capital U. I still have it, it does work well...but it's ugly!!).

[Craig J Brain]

Put some time aside and call him, you will be on the phone for close to an hour. He is a one man shop. Even when you visit the place, he usually is in the back running machinery, not up front. Granted, he probably doesn't get much foot traffic. Interesting fellow no doubt.

I'd love to do that, but phoning from Australia is expensive and I have the 'flu at the moment and really can't talk a lot. Looks like I may have no choice but to try calling and wheeze through an order. I hope he doesn't think I'm some sort of crank caller. :)

Craig

[Craig J Brain]

Great news! I got in touch with him and am in the process of putting together an order :)

Thanks for the terrific advice everyone.

Craig

[Steven Lee, NC]

if its a custom build the due date is a very generous guestimate. I ordered a scrub plane from them awhile back and ended up forgetting about it till a year later and a package arrived. I recently ordered some stuff that he would have to me by the end next week, took a few extra weeks to receive it.

[Tony Zaffuto]

I've order several times over the years and always positive. Needed direct communication one time and I telephoned and very positive again.

[Terry Beadle]

Hello Mike,

I found the O1 blade easy to sharpen using Japanese water stones. 800 to shape edge with curve, followed by 1000 king, 2500 Aoto, 6000 King, 8000 King and 10,000 Ice Bear. Touch ups with green rouge on dead flat rock maple scrap.

I only use it as a true smoother and not for any quasi-jack situations. It's a heavy rascal and the mouth is not all that tight. It doesn't need one as it's taking 1 thou or less shavings. Works great.

If you order a smoother, I would recommend the straight sided model instead of the coffin. The coffin really doesn't get you anything more in performance IMO and the straight sided casting is a whole lot easier to fit the infill material to.

Enjoy the process, it's the best part !

[Jim Belair]

Terry, it's a bit hard to see for sure but it looks like yours was a "machined" kit as opposed to a "rough" kit. Is that correct?

The rough chariot kit on ebay looks very rough (gating stubs still in place). Bronze is no doubt easier to work than steel but I think the kits based on rough castings would be a lot of work.

[David Weaver]

The rough kits are why I mentioned that it might be easier for someone to do a dovetailed kit.

The reverse is probably true if you get a machined casting with good clean machining (it should be faster and easier to do than a dovetailed kit).

[Jim Belair]

Thanks David. I've cut and peened brass for a small plane and like the look of the SJB kits but thought peening steel might be tough. Is it, or maybe it work hardens less than brass?

[David Weaver]

I have a dovetail kit that's been waiting a while to be peined, the steel that comes in that kit isn't difficult to work, it's fairly soft and kind of grainy but without being brittle or gritty in filing, at least. It should be easier to pein than any brass that work hardens easily.

The shepherd kit looked to be similar material and it peined very very easily and didn't work harden/split.

If I can get the kit on a peining block this weekend and peined together, I'll post something about how easily it peins or how well, because most of the peining I've done was with O1, which is relatively hard to pein if you have to move any of it more than just a little.

[george wilson]

Maybe it's a pein in the neck,David. Aooo-Ha-Ha,it is to laugh.:) Who said that line?? I know.

[David Weaver]

Maybe it's a pein in the neck,David. Aooo-Ha-Ha,it is to laugh.:) Who said that line?? I know.

It definitely wasn't me, because I would never use the word "neck" there :)

[Terry Beadle]

I had him machine the mouth bevel and the sole was fairly flat with a very rough surface. I did do a little lite machining on my drill press with a very small 4 flute end mill to make the bottom of the infill area easier to fit to. The polishing up of the sides and fettling the sole did not take very long.

I found the bronze to be easy to work except in the mouth area. If I had to do it over again the lessons learned on this one would greatly shorten the process. Having very small diamond files, the right very small end mill etc, all were good lessons to learn. Mr. Belair, you are right about bronze being much easier to work than steel. A rough casting would not be that much more work but it would be difficult to do the interior mouth bevel to the correct angle. Bob's great amount of experience brought to bear on the critical surfaces is worth every penny and not much cost.

I spent way more time getting the cocobolo to fit and shaped than I did on the metal work. Like 5 to 1, ie. 5 times more effort on the cocobolo.

Over all it was a fun project and it's a very good smoother to boot.

[Charlie Stanford]

Hi everyone.

From time-to-time I've seen fleeting references to the St James Bay Tool Co, but nothing much.

I had a look through their website this morning, and could not get over the bargain prices on their planes (at least when the site was last updated). Where else can you buy a complete and handled cocobolo infill bronze-bodied plane for $400?

Has anyone had the experience of dealing with SJBTC? And does anyone own one of their infills?

Curious, all the way from Sydney,
Adriaan

I recently (about a week ago) emailed them about the lead time one of their scrub plane's and never received a response.

[David Weaver]

If you really actually want to know, you need to call them.

[Charlie Stanford]

If you really actually want to know, you need to call them.

Why, when the question could be answered in a three or four word sentence? If email is not a good way to reach them they need to remove it as an option in the "contact us" section of their website.

An your comment 'if you actually really want to know' is provoking. I took the time to email them. I want to know. I'm not just kicking tires, especially over a $100 plane. I'd just prefer to handle the communication about the matter by email.

[Jim Koepke]

Why, when the question could be answered in a three or four word sentence? If email is not a good way to reach them they need to remove it as an option in the "contact us" section of their website.

An your comment 'if you actually really want to know' is provoking. I took the time to email them. I want to know. I'm not just kicking tires, especially over a $100 plane. I'd just prefer to handle the communication about the matter by email.

Some folks just do not work well with modern electronic communications.

My father was a wizz at electronics in his time, the 1930s through the 1950s. He did not get into transistor or integrated circuits like I did.

When ever my brothers and I suggested he get email so it would be easy to communicate over the long distance, he would say he already had email and give us his FAX number.

It is likely they get hundreds of emails on a daily basis. When one comes up that needs to be checked with someone else about a lead time, it likely falls through the cracks during the rest of the day just trying to get to the end of the day.

Chances are, they are not going to change their habits good or bad. Since most people know this bad habit, they have suggested a way to get around it.

jtk

[David Weaver]

Why, when the question could be answered in a three or four word sentence? If email is not a good way to reach them they need to remove it as an option in the "contact us" section of their website.

An your comment 'if you actually really want to know' is provoking. I took the time to email them. I want to know. I'm not just kicking tires, especially over a $100 plane. I'd just prefer to handle the communication about the matter by email.

Well, I guess because every post about them that's ever been made has folks stating that it's a one man operation and the best way to get a hold of them is by phone. I guess if you don't have a lot of time to talk, then you tell them that up front. Seems pretty reasonable that if you know they communicate best by phone, that's what you'd do if you actually want an answer.

[Tony Shea]

Why, when the question could be answered in a three or four word sentence? If email is not a good way to reach them they need to remove it as an option in the "contact us" section of their website.

An your comment 'if you actually really want to know' is provoking. I took the time to email them. I want to know. I'm not just kicking tires, especially over a $100 plane. I'd just prefer to handle the communication about the matter by email.

You're speaking to the choir. No need to get heated at us for email not being the best way to talk with this guy. We all know from many previous posts that email is not the way to get a timely response, if a response at all. No need to tell us that he needs to remove this option, doesn't do any good. It is a very simple matter to dial some #'s if you know this is the best and maybe only way to get a hold of him. One little "what's your lead time" question is probably on the bottom of his things to do list if it is in fact a one man operation. Just give him a jingle as everyone else seems to be doing.

[Charlie Stanford]

You're speaking to the choir. No need to get heated at us for email not being the best way to talk with this guy. We all know from many previous posts that email is not the way to get a timely response, if a response at all. No need to tell us that he needs to remove this option, doesn't do any good. It is a very simple matter to dial some #'s if you know this is the best and maybe only way to get a hold of him. One little "what's your lead time" question is probably on the bottom of his things to do list if it is in fact a one man operation. Just give him a jingle as everyone else seems to be doing.

For some folks, people with hearing and or speech impairments, email is a Godsend. I'll leave it at that as to why this is my preferred method of communicating.

Everybody is not so fortunate to be able to simply pick up the phone when email won't work. I can get a call made, but it's usually an unpleasant experience for both me and the recipient of the call.

Otherwise, it's basically moot at this point as I'll pull the trigger with Lee Valley or Lie-Nielsen this week and I'm sure it'll go off like clockwork since both of these firms are able to process an order placed over the internet and even handle technical and customer service matters by email for people who don't use the telephone as nimbly as others can.

I honestly wanted to give the guys at St. James Bay a shot.