Wireless Home Security System

[Jeffrey Makiel]

Are wireless home security systems reliable and stable? I'm looking at installing a GE Simon 3 wireless system that does burgulary, fire, flood and carbon monoxide. Installing a hardwired system is too difficult. Any opinions or experiences are welcome.

-Jeff :)

[Mario Lucchesi]

Yes they are. go to X10.com to look at some of the things that they have availible. This is less expensive stuff that uses the x10 standard.

[Jim Becker]

Wireless is becoming more and more common. Frankly, for our home, it's the only option due to 18" thick stone walls and un-crawlable crawl spaces. But you need to use the "good stuff"...the pro stuff. I believe it's 400mhz. You can source from places like SmartHome or sometimes from local security suppliers if they will sell to the public. Many do not, but some will. Do consider monitoring service costs when you are selecting your stuff...your monitoring source may have preferences, etc. (I did notice SmartHome has a very reasonable cost monitoring service available)

[Dave Fifield]

I tried some X10 enabled security lights - I had them set up so if any one of the PIR detectors saw anything, they would all turn on. However they didn't work out too well. Some of them don't trigger the rest properly and some come on and get stuck on forever.

Also, I used an X10 system to control my dust collector remotely. That too is unreliable - I have to press the on/off buttons on the remote several times to get the X10 bit to work (even though it's only 10 or 20 feet away!).

Finally, I bought a couple of X10 wireless security cameras for my system to cover areas that I couldn't get wiring to easily. The video quality sucks big time. The frame sync becomes unlocked about once a second and car ignition noise from passing cars (about 40 feet away) interfere with the video link too. I am still looking for a solution that will work.

I'm going to replace all my X10 stuff with something more reliable.

I have heard good things about the X10 successor "Zigbee", although I don't know of anything on the market yet.

HTH,

[Brad Schmid]

My house is just getting to the age where some of the hardwired zones (windows/doors/motion sensors) are starting to fail. I wasn't about to start ripping walls apart to try and find the problem, or run new wiring, so as they fail I'm replacing them with wireless. When the first zone failed 2 yrs ago, I had a system put in that would handle both wireless and wired. It works good this way because replacement due to failure is covered under the warranty I have with my monitoring service provider, so slowly switching over to wireless is no additional cost. It works good, and I was able to easily add another zone for my detached garage/shop that was previously not possible due to the wiring constraints. I still want the wired option though because I have my AC condensers wired in to the alarm and I'm not sure what options I would have there for reliable wireless (near ground, weather, dog, other critters...)

[Jim Becker]

Brad, there are wireless attachment devices that can take hard-wired sensors or other input and send them along through the air should you need to deal with a failed circuit to a device like your condensers.

[Brad Schmid]

Brad, there are wireless attachment devices that can take hard-wired sensors or other input and send them along through the air should you need to deal with a failed circuit to a device like your condensers.

My current "sensor" is pretty crude.:D My AC condensor zone consists of looping a physical wire from one zone through the structure of my 2 outside condensors. That way if some unscrupulous scoundrel tries to make off with them for the price of copper, they'll break the wire and set off the alarm. I would think there's got to be a more high tech solution:confused: , but admittedly, I haven't taken the initiative to look around.:o

[Jim Becker]

If I'm not mistaken, Brad...thats a "normally closed" situation!

[Brad Schmid]

If I'm not mistaken, Brad...thats a "normally closed" situation!

And it's my hope it will always stay closed :D

BTW Jim - I didn't realize you spent the week in Houston last week or I would've extended you an invite. If you have time next time you're in town, let me know!

[Jim Becker]

Brad, I intended to set up a "Creeker" meet/visit with you/Tom/Tom/whomever, but the schedule was so tight I had zero free time. I didn't put one foot outside of the Hyatt other than a group event at Dave and Busters on Wednesday evening. I might have had time Sunday night, but my original flight was canceled because of the heavy rain/wind in PHL and the one I managed to get a (middle) seat on (rather than the comfortable bulkhead seat I had on the original flight) was several hours later and on a different carrier. Such is life...

[David G Baker]

I tried some X10 enabled security lights - I had them set up so if any one of the PIR detectors saw anything, they would all turn on. However they didn't work out too well. Some of them don't trigger the rest properly and some come on and get stuck on forever.

Also, I used an X10 system to control my dust collector remotely. That too is unreliable - I have to press the on/off buttons on the remote several times to get the X10 bit to work (even though it's only 10 or 20 feet away!).

Finally, I bought a couple of X10 wireless security cameras for my system to cover areas that I couldn't get wiring to easily. The video quality sucks big time. The frame sync becomes unlocked about once a second and car ignition noise from passing cars (about 40 feet away) interfere with the video link too. I am still looking for a solution that will work.

I'm going to replace all my X10 stuff with something more reliable.

I have heard good things about the X10 successor "Zigbee", although I don't know of anything on the market yet.

HTH,
Dave,
I have some of the older X10 timers that work through the house electrical system and found them to be marginal at best. They would work great for a while then fail, I could never depend on them so back on the shelf they went. If they had worked I would have invested a bunch of money in the complete X10 system.

[Matt Meiser]

I would look into a "real" security system. The big-box store systems appeared to be marginal when I looked into them. I ended up using components purchased from http://www.lufkinsecurity.com to build my system and they do the monitoring. We monitor my shop for burglar and fire (heat detectors due to the dust factor) on one partition and the house for burglar, fire, and sump pump failure on the other partition. They system was pretty easy to install and good quality. Lufkin was very helpful. I also got design assistance by having a couple of local security companies come out and quote me on their systems, but the prices were outrageous and required long term contracts.

[Jim Becker]

Matt, thanks for that source!!

[Dave Fifield]

Thanks from me too Matt - seems like the go to place!

Cheers,

[Jeffrey Makiel]

I've been doing some limited research. It seems the Ademco and GE systems are highly regarded. I believe the GE Concord is also used by professional alarm companies.

I like the GE Simon 3. It seems to get high marks and comes with a variety of sensors. I agree about alarms (or anything of moderate importance) being purchased at big box stores these day. I've been looking into mailorder suppliers. I figure the components will cost about $1,000, so I'd like something reliable and with decent tech support.

Any other opinions or insight is welcome. Thanks for the replies so far.

-Jeff :)

[Jim Becker]

Ademco has been a staple with pro services for "a long time"...that's what I've seen in houses more often than any other system.

[Matt Meiser]

Jeff, Lufkin was great for support. They send out a bunch of info when you buy from them, plus offer some different options for programming services if you don't want to do that part yourself. I found it easy to program though. Mine is an Ademco system. we didn't use any wireless components since we have a ranch and had easy access to everything from either below or above. My shop was even simple to hardwire since there was an existing multiconductor cable buried underground.

BTW, I also used one other mail order supply who I would not recommend--Home Security Store or something like that based in California. I had to file a dispute with my CC company to get them to take care of a return properly.

[Matt Meiser]

Ademco has been a staple with pro services for "a long time"...that's what I've seen in houses more often than any other system.

Yes, one of the local companies quoted the exact same main panel and the motion detectors for my shop (you have to watch the operating temperatures on those) as what I ended up buying.

[Randall Davis]

I tried some X10 enabled security lights - I had them set up so if any one of the PIR detectors saw anything, they would all turn on. However they didn't work out too well. Some of them don't trigger the rest properly and some come on and get stuck on forever.

Also, I used an X10 system to control my dust collector remotely. That too is unreliable - I have to press the on/off buttons on the remote several times to get the X10 bit to work (even though it's only 10 or 20 feet away!).

Finally, I bought a couple of X10 wireless security cameras for my system to cover areas that I couldn't get wiring to easily. The video quality sucks big time. The frame sync becomes unlocked about once a second and car ignition noise from passing cars (about 40 feet away) interfere with the video link too. I am still looking for a solution that will work.

I'm going to replace all my X10 stuff with something more reliable.

I have heard good things about the X10 successor "Zigbee", although I don't know of anything on the market yet.

HTH,


sounds like you need a signal bridge! how large is your house?

[Dave Fifield]

sounds like you need a signal bridge! how large is your house?

3750 sq.ft. (2 storey)

I didn't know such a thing as a signal bridge existed. I don't see how it will help the X10 DC control in my workshop - it's only a few feet away but it doesn't work properly.

Cheers,

[Randall Davis]

unless they have change the technology (i have not used it in a few years) x-10 signels travel through your homes wiring system not through the air. therefor each time you command the DC to come on the signel travels throughout the system serching for the DC address. Bridging the two legs of your service will make this path much more efficient. This may or may not be your problem. I would call tech support and discuss your situation before I would trash the system.

[Jim Becker]

I've been using X-10 to control some lighting. (I originally used it for my cyclone but after burning up a couple units, I switched to hard-wired with a contactor) The X-10 stuff works but I'm not entirely happy with it. For example, when I'm in the shop working, the outside lights tend to turn on by themselves from who-knows-what. They are controlled by and X-10 switch as it was the only way I could do a "three-way" from the house without getting a hard wire between the buildings. Whatever is causing this is actually in my shop...the problem doesn't happen when the shop is dark.

I'd never trust it for security system use...and will use the "real McCoy" wireless security devices as I upgrade things for the new addition.

[Bill Webber]

Are wireless home security systems reliable and stable? I'm looking at installing a GE Simon 3 wireless system that does burgulary, fire, flood and carbon monoxide. Installing a hardwired system is too difficult. Any opinions or experiences are welcome.

-Jeff :)

There's a lot of discussion about X-10 stuff so I thought I'd stick this here. I bought one of these SSD systems about 10 years ago and a second one recently for my new place:
http://www.easyhomesecurity.com/ssd16-security-system.htm

Works very well, very reliable, no false alarms. I even have closure switches and motion detectors in out buildings and they work fine, too. I connected the alarm output to an X-10 controller that blinks all the house lites. Proven system, works well for me. Full assortment of door/window switches, remote panels, key fobs, motion and smoke detectors, external sirens, etc. No affiliation, YMMV, and etc.

A bit of an aside. SWMBO insisted I put the alarm system in. After it was installed I got to thinking what the heck was I gonna do if it ever went off! The handgun I bought was a lot more expensive than the alarm system. But now if someone laughs at me sneakin' around in my skivvies, I can shoot 'em. :D:D:D

[Dave Fifield]

unless they have change the technology (i have not used it in a few years) x-10 signels travel through your homes wiring system not through the air. therefor each time you command the DC to come on the signel travels throughout the system serching for the DC address. Bridging the two legs of your service will make this path much more efficient. This may or may not be your problem. I would call tech support and discuss your situation before I would trash the system.

I know a lot more about X10 than you'd care to imagine. It's just not a very good system design, right from the signalling protocol down to the physical layer. It's only redeeming feature is that it's cheap.

In my house, there is no need to bridge the two halves (phases) of my AC service, since all my X10 stuff is on the same 110V phase (merely by coincidence).

My DC uses a WIRELESS remote controlled X10 unit, that receives the wireless ON/OFF commands from the remote (hanging near my TS), then sends the appropriate X10 commands over the AC wiring from where the wireless receiver is plugged in to the DC power control unit, which is LESS THAN 10 FEET AWAY and on the same AC wiring feed from the main panel! The wireless remote control is LESS THAN 20 FEET AWAY from the X10 wireless control receiver unit.

It simply does not work properly. I'm lucky if 25% of my ON/OFF presses of the remote ever work. I don't know if it's the wireless link or the X10 link to the DC that's broken. I don't care. All the units came from X10.com. The system is not reliable. Therefore I don't recommend X10 to anyone.

I will be looking out for systems that use ZigBee, the reliable successor to X10 (ZigBee Alliance (http://www.zigbee.org/en/index.asp)). It won't be long now....

[Jim Becker]

Dave, your experience mirrors my own relative to consistency with X10.

[Rich Engelhardt]

The handgun I bought was a lot more expensive than the alarm system. But now if someone laughs at me sneakin' around in my skivvies, I can shoot 'em.
Hello Bill,
This just begs the relating of my experience with that type of situation.

On a dark and stormy night ,,,hehehe,,not really but...

Late one night my wife woke me up and said she heard heavy footsteps coming from downstairs. I got out of bed, retrieved the only gun not locked in the safe at the moment - a Ruger single action Blackhawk in .45 Colt - from the dresser and rounded up the two dogs to investigate.
One of the dogs was a good sized female white German Shepherd (~ 120 lbs)
The other dog was a fair sized male Great Dane brown & black (~ 165 lbs).

I herded the hounds out in front of me to the landing at the top of the stairs. I pointed down the stairs and command the dogs to "Go get 'em!!".
Both just stood there and looked at me like a couple of goof-balls.:confused:
I stuck the muzzle of the revolver in the back waistband of my fruit of the looms with the barrel nested securely between my cheeks,,,grabbed the Great Dane by the collar and gave him a push towards the stairs...

Well,,,it musta been that "time of life" for the little fella, because he took it as an opportunity to play "let's see who's Alpha male in the house".
He spins around, sticks his tail straight up in the air - and starts to snarl - (I'm like,,,yeah right,,everybody knows you're a cup cake!! A big -un,,but still a cup cake.)

The GS isn't having any of this nonsense - her "daddy (me)" being threatened by anybody - so she jumps the Dane.:rolleyes:

Meanwhile - back in the bedroom - my wife is screaming bloody murder - and "Don't let them hurt each other!!!". Sooooo,, I wade into the middle of ~ 300 lbs of canine carnage and try to separate them.
Now, it's a well know fact that after 4 or 5 washings,,the elastic band in Fruit of the Loom's gets pretty stretched out - - so the revolver (remember that?) - kinda "flips" and "rolls" - snared by the muzzle in the waist band,,and winds itself all the way down to my feet!!:o
Hobbled like that it doesn't take long before I fall down on top of the two goof-balls.

So here we are,, a big white dog, a big brown dog,,,and me in all my glory,,rolling around on the landing.:rolleyes:
Downstairs, I hear the sound of very heavy, very fast running feet and the slam of the front door.

I can only imagine what went through the intruder's mind
{ Man, that place is nuts! Some joker with huge lips rassles polar bears and a grizzle bears!!!}:D

Word of advice - pull on some pants before you go sneakin around :D