Work Process Question

[Jeff Wright]

I'm building a tool cabinet for my new shop and have a question.

It's all well and good to spend the time to draw plans for a project, including precise dimensions and cut lists. But I find that if I were to cut all the pieces and then assemble the project, even slight errors in cutting to design plans can mess up a project. I consider myself a careful layout and cut worker, but cutting all pieces to a project will most likely lead to a less than satisfactory outcome. I instead tend to start a project with a rough idea in mind and then make the pieces to fit the actual project that is in front of me at that point. That way, I know that I will really need a piece that is 12 3/32 inches instead of 12 1/32 that was originally called for in an optimistic plan drawing.

I'm not sure I made myself clear above, but how do you folks approach your projects? Do you draw precise dimensions and then successfully cut out and assemble the pieces that truly fit together, or determine your cut sizes as the piece evolves?

[glenn bradley]

I very rarely make two of anything except bedside tables. I have the dimensions I'm after laid out, some sketches of any unusual joinery (so I don't forget I was gonna do it that way) and tend to make my parts as I go. This means more repeat trips or sometimes repeat setups but I find that easier than remaking a piece 'cause things didn't work out just so. The exception would be web frames, runners or carcase panels, etc. where being the same is important. Now if only the carcase wasn't slanted . . .

[Doug Shepard]

I do something similar but I do tend to draw everything and try to factor in stuff like ply or hardwood thickness to come up with dimensions. In a lot of cases I'm only using the dimensions to make sure I buy enough material and as a cross check before cutting. I usually do the same as you and do a lot of the final cuts after marking it against the project. But I like to compare that size against my planned size before cutting. I've caught a few errors in the past where I had pieces dry clamped, put other parts against them to transfer marks, compared those to my planned size and things were too far off too make sense. I was usually able to trace this back to not having something seated all the way in a rabbet or dado, somehow managed to cut opposing sides of something not to the same length, bowed out carcase sides, etc. So I'd fix that then remark & measure until things made sense. Using the drawing dimensions as a sanity check has saved me scrapping out a few pieces cut 1/8" or 1/4" too short at times.

[Michael Lutz]

I am currently making a tool cabinet for under my workbench. I cut the pieces a little large since the cabinet had to fit between the trestles. I found out they weren't square, so to fit a square cabinet case in there I had to make it smaller. I had to resize the drawer to fit the smaller openning. So in short I cut the stock an 1/8" to a 1/4" oversize when I am cutting down the panels. I cut it to fit when the piece is needed so it fits right.

Mike

[Jason Beam]

I do kind of a hybrid of the two approaches that you mention.

On important projects, I do very detailed sketchup drawings. I print out some views with dimensions marked out of major components. After milling, I choose a specific subassembly to make first. Usually the part I choose will have the most impact on all the other pieces.

For example, when building my end tables, I began building the base from the legs first. This was because if I screwed up the tapered legs, the aprons would need to be adjusted. Sometimes my choice is influenced by comfort level. If I'm not sure how accurately something might come out, I build it first and then adjust all the measurements to suit what finally comes out.

All that said, I rarely use my tape once that sub assembly is built. After that, most things come out relative to that sub assembly. So I'll lay pieces againts it and say "okay, this ... plus 4 1/4 inches will give me part X" or "This needs to wrap around, so this width plus the two scrap pieces of this same stuff".

Once the project has begun I don't always know the exact sizes of anything, just that they are sized correctly to fit where they belong. That throws some folks. They have to know the numbers to have confidence in the fit. I struggled with it a little at first, but quickly threw out the measure-by-numbers game when the numbers failed me. This relative size method is really helpful. I rarely miscut anything unless I forget to factor in some other pieces. But I don't transpose numbers since there aren't many numbers flying around!

That's what works for me :)

[Jeff Wright]

I do kind of a hybrid of the two approaches that you mention . . . . Once the project has begun I don't always know the exact sizes of anything, just that they are sized correctly to fit where they belong . . . . That's what works for me :)

Jason, I think you and I have similar processes. I would be interesting to talk to an experienced and accomplished woodworker who is able to actually build from a detailed set of plans and not do the cut-and-fit method you and I find ourselves doing.

[Rod Sheridan]

I also use different approaches based upon what I am making.

If it's good furniture for the house (solid wood), I tend to make complete computer drawings of every component, and then machine them to the sizes shown on the drawing. Most of my furniture is Arts and Crafts, with some Shaker pieces as well.

At present I'm making base storage cabinets for the workshop out of Baltic Birch plywood. I made carcass drawings on a notepad, along with parts drawings on a notepad for all the drawer pieces, dimensions included. The drawers have finger joints, with a plywood bottom set in grooves, running in 100 pound capacity full extension slides.

All exposed plywood edges are capped with 1/4 inch thick solid birch, finish is polyurethane with paste wax over.

If I'm making something simpler, I will make a drawing on a notepad, complete with overal dimensions and perhaps dimensions of features that are critical, then work off of the drawing as I go to cut pieces to size.

I know that a lot of people don't make full drawings of components, I guess as a hobbyist who happens to be a Technologist, I am used to the "produce the parts to the correct dimension and assemble" method of working.

My father in law, who is a transplanted English cabinet maker seems to use the simplest method possible for work, based upon how complex the piece is, or whether he will have to make another matching item at a later date. It seems to be the pragmatism required to make aliving at the task, as opposed to a hobby.

regards, Rod.

[Jason Beam]

Jason, I think you and I have similar processes. I would be interesting to talk to an experienced and accomplished woodworker who is able to actually build from a detailed set of plans and not do the cut-and-fit method you and I find ourselves doing.

Indeed! I'd like to find one who makes one-offs like we do, but actually STICKS to the plan from start to finish. Most of the time, I get partway into a project and discover that, for whatever reason, something has to change. I may not have enough wood for a specific number of drawers, or I decide to put something different in a given space that doesn't quite fit as designed. Things get changed partway through, almost reliably so.

Now, if I were making the exact same thing several times, I would absolutely batch-process things. I'm a big fan of single setups if I can get away with it. When I build a cabinet with multiple drawers, great pains are made to find a dimension for the drawers that will allow me to batch pieces as much as possible. That usually means cutting a piece of scrap or two to a given dimension and "walk" it up the inside of the cavity to be filled. Then i'll batch eveything to that dimension and cut the joinery. Not quite a pre-defined plan, but also not quite as fluid as going at it freehand, so to speak.

This is a very thought provoking question ... it's quite interesting :)

[Greg Robbins]

Jason, I think you and I have similar processes. I would be interesting to talk to an experienced and accomplished woodworker who is able to actually build from a detailed set of plans and not do the cut-and-fit method you and I find ourselves doing.

Accomplished woodworkers and furniture builders do the cut-and-fit method even if working from detailed blueprints. There are too many variables in woodworking not to take some sort of measurement before going on to the next step.

[Ed Falis]

I tend to use the pre-measurements and drawings as the "ideal" to which I'm aspiring, but like anyone, I make adjustments as needed on the fly. I'm doing my first big project now - a full kitchen worth of cabinets, and I've found myself stopping after each phase of what I'm doing to see how well things are conforming to the ideal. I've already done a few thorough corrections to move back towards it. I've also made changes on my parts lists etc to keep them in synch with reality.

I'm obviously a hobbyist.

[Jeff Wright]

Accomplished woodworkers and furniture builders do the cut-and-fit method even if working from detailed blueprints. There are too many variables in woodworking not to take some sort of measurement before going on to the next step.

That's reassuring to this aspiring craftsperson.

I suppose there are certain projects that lend themselves to pre-cutting mass numbers of pieces without concern. Kitchen cabinets come to mind. Set the fence up for a bunch of ripping for all your carcase sides and bottoms, all your styles (if doing face frames), styles on all your five-piece door sets, etc.

But making a period slant-top desk would be a different story.

[Ed Falis]

Nice work in those pics, by the way.

[Jeff Wright]

Nice work in those pics, by the way.

Thanks Ed. I modified two plans, one in a FWW article some time ago and the other a set of plans from Lee Valley. For a small wall space, it affords a good bit of surface area for mounting my hand tools; the cubby holes are a great way to store hand planes.

[Joe Jensen]

I never draw or use plans. I decide on the overall dimensions, and proportions (I spend a lot of time here and even do scale drawings to get the proportions right). Then I start building. If the book matched pieces I want to use for the top don't yield my initial size, I just make the top a little smaller. If I make a mistake, I just compensate on the fly. I find this approach much lower stress, and more satisfying as I really enjoy the design side of this hobby..joe