Lithophanes Way to Go

[Alex Kolton]

I have done these Lithophanes on the CNC Router using ArtCam.
Material is .25 Bone Color Corian which I have plenty at work.

[Larry Bratton]

Alex:
Very impressive. What actual size are they and how long did it take to run them?

[Alex Kolton]

Lithophanes are 6 x 8 and 8 x 10. It took aproximately about 1 hour more or less to make it. But it is pretty cool when it is done.

Have fun
Alex AKA (AK-47)

[Keith Outten]

Those who haven't seen a lithophane can't appreciate how cool they really are, you have to hold them in your hands.

Nice work Alex, how about more details...what bit and speeds you used?

.

[Mike Null]

Very impressive work.

[Alex Kolton]

I used 1/8" ballnose bit. Speed is 2in per sec. Stepover about 10 percent.
Software is ArtCam. What I have learned that better quality of the picture ( resolution ) the better results. Took me about 1 hour per picture to make it. But believe me I screwed up many pieces before I found the right way to do it.
Thanks god I have tons of Corian at work.

[Alex Kolton]

Here is Another Litho for you. I think you know HER.

[Mike Null]

Well, I'll say it again--that's gorgeous.

Can it be done with a laser? Am I understanding correctly that it is backlit?

[Keith Outten]

Mike,

The software used translates black and white pictures shades of gray to depth for machining. Areas of the picture that are black require less machining depth and those that are lighter to white require the most depth. When they are backlit the picture pops out like magic even though the surface often doesn't resemble the picture when viewed without light. Pictures of people are more recognizable than other objects or scenes.

Most use 1/4" thick Corian for machining lithophanes, as you would expect there can be areas that require a lot of material to be removed so laser engraving isn't a technique that is used. Making lithophanes with a CNC router can be a time consuming project, Alex mentioned that the small lithophanes he made took over an hour of machining time each. Small diameter cutters are used to machine the fine detail so speeds and feeds are slow with stepover settings kept very small.

It would be great if someone could create software that would combine CNC routing with laser engraving to produce lithophanes. The idea being that the router could be used to hog out most of the material and then a laser engraver could be used for detail that isn't possible with a router bit. I could see where calibration between the two machines would be a huge issue to overcome.

.

[Larry Bratton]

Artcam is $7500 last time I checked. I understand that the guys that started Vectrics used to work for that company. Vectrics says their PhotoVCarve will do 3d Lithophanes. I have no idea how good or bad the software is, but for $149.00 it would be worth a shot.

I know some of our other forum members use their other software for 3d carving. I downloaded the 3d software as the demo and as soon as I get some router bits in, I intend to try it on my CNC. I know some Shopbot owners use this software for 3d. It is very reasonable price wise. Here is the link

http://www.vectric.com/WebSite/Vectric/pvc/pvc_index.htm

[Dave Jones]

It should theoretically be possible to use a laser in 3D mode to make lithophanes. Engrave using a negative of a photograph and the laser's 3D mode setting.

Making the photo negative would make the light parts of the image be dark, so they would engrave the deepest, resulting in the thinnest areas of the material, letting the most light through. You might need to pre-process the photo using the "curves" adjustment in Photoshop or PhotoPaint in order to get the resulting 3D depth linear and looking right.

Of course it would depend a lot on the material you use, and how well a laser can cut into it with predictable depth.

[Keith Outten]

The ShopBot CNC routers all ship with software that is capable of producing lithophanes.

[Mike Null]

To Dave's point I am playing with that idea right now. I am using 1/4" white acrylic and it doesn't seem to be the right material but here is the result after multiple passes and an hour and a half of engraving.

I used a bw photo and inverted it and used my relief setting on the driver. All things considered I'd have a hard time justifying more money for software. I used Corel PP and really didn't do anything to a 35 year old photo. (the lady is the LOML who is more beautiful after the 35 years)

This isn't a match for those previously shown but it does show that the laser can do the job. The pic titled acrylic is without any light.

[Keith Outten]

Mike,

It looks like I was wrong about laser engravers and lithophanes. Maybe the possibility of using both engraver and CNC router has serious merit :)

You may be the first to have ever created a laser engraved lithophane.

Thanks,
Keith
.

[Mike Null]

Keith:

I haven't done the marble and granite things and I have been curious as to the effectiveness of the relief mode setting in my laser but I am quite impressed with it. As you can see, the detail is quite good. I ran a number of settings to try to minimize striations but didn't succeed at that. I believe Corian would engrave better but I didn't have the 1/4" stuff.

Now I'll have to try marble and granite using this setting.

[Larry Bratton]

If you have a high resolution photo say the size you could print on a wide format printer, it would be fun to run one on say a 4x4 piece of Corian or whatever. My Nikon D70 6megapixel camera will make one with high enough resolution that it will print like 36" x 48" right off the disc. It would probably take a good while to do it, but it would be interesting.

[Keith Outten]

I have to say I am impressed with Mike's lithophane. His success could possibly sell a lot more engravers as it is certainly marketable as far as I can tell from the picture.

I'm hooked, its downstairs to the shop to machine some thin Corian to try to engrave my own lithophane :) Anyone care to take a guess what the minimum size power supply might be to engrave lithophanes? Mike has a 45 watt tube and has 90 minutes of engraving time, I wonder what that will translate to for those with both larger and smaller power supplies.

If I have some success I will try to route then engrave the same photo to see if I can improve the detail.
.

[Mike Null]

Keith:

It took about 1 1/2 hours and 11 passes. I was trying not to overheat the acrylic to the melting point. I also ran it at 4 different dpi settings trying to avoid striations. (that didn't work)

With respect to detail, you can see eyelashes and hair strands.

But you are right about holding this in your hand and then backlighting it. The change is remarkable. Given the time it takes to engrave I'm not sure how marketable it is--then again, a better material (Corian) might produce better faster results.

The other option would be a thinner material like 3/16".

A big thank you to Alex for pointing the way on this.

["Al Dixon"]

Hi Alex,
Great looking work. I also have ArtCam. The lithos are really fun to make. It looks like you have learned to do them well.
Just to see how detailed I could get I tried a very high res digital picture of a local land mark. I used a 30 deg engraving point at about .005 step over. You could read the lettering on the bronze plaque.

You mentioned that you have lots of corian...if you have some available for purchase let me know. You can reach me at auntmillies@zoominternet.net

I can use various sizes and colors appropriate for lithopanes.

-Al

[Mike Null]

Hey Keith

What happened with yours?

[Keith Outten]

Mike,

I resawed a piece of Glasier White Corian, its ready to engrave I just can't seem to put out all the fires so I can hit the start button.

Jackie and I went to Richmond Virginia to a dye-sub workshop today that was real interesting...now I'm on my way outside to mow 6 acres of grass. I will most likley run out of daylight before I get the grass cut so there will be some mower riding in store for me tomorrow after work as well.

If I have any energy later tonight I will give mine a try.
.

[Martin Boekers]

Add a new twist, if it takes long to produce what about sand carving? Is this possible and effective?

[Dan Hintz]

Add a new twist, if it takes long to produce what about sand carving? Is this possible and effective?

How do you produce the various levels? Masking for every depth level would be painful, at best... impossible / impractical, most likely.

[Mike Null]

It is actually doable but only with an artistic sandcarver.

http://www.glassetchingsecrets.com/blog/professional-sandcarvings/