Basement workshops - help me decide?

[Charles Wilson]

I was going to put my workshop out in the garage but am now looking into the basement. If it goes in the basement, I will have the option to work all year long if I choose, a little more climate control, other stuff that has to be in the detached garage (like cars and the obligatory "garage junk") and a basement space that is about 20' by 30'.

Also, if I decide to move into the house, dust collection will be a PRIORITY. I am not into breathing dust as I am sort of a healthy freak so even though I am just starting out on "collecting" tools, I am looking pretty hard at the ClearVue systems and either buying or building 1 or 2 air scrubbers. I am really looking into Festool stuff as well due to the system being designed around DC.

Anyone with basement shops have pics of their workshops to share or words of wisdom to help me along (ex - electricity, tool selection order, ventilation and air exchage, etc.)?

Looking forward to some "pro" advice.

Regards,
Chuck

[James Phillips]

I have a jet dust collector and am just building a system to exhaust my fine dust outside. I recommend this over scrubbers if possible. It does not take a tremendous amount of air movement, just slow and steady. And wear a mask when actually working with the tools. I like the basement idea due to climate control and space, but remember getting a cabinet saw in a basement is no easy task

[Jim Becker]

Charles, your concern with dust collection is spot on, not just for health, but for "peaceful coexistence with the neighbor(s)", as it were...

Any chance your basement is a walk-out? If not, are the stairs straight or "bent"? Ceiling height? HVAC system type and location? All these things will help folks advise you and relate their own experiences.

[Charles Wilson]

Any chance your basement is a walk-out? If not, are the stairs straight or "bent"? Ceiling height? HVAC system type and location? All these things will help folks advise you and relate their own experiences.

Jim,

I live in an old 1920's colonial.

Ceilings on the first and second floors are 9+ feet. The ceilings in the basement are between 8 and 9 feet (lets say 8 1/2').

We have forced hot air an high efficiency furnace. The intake and the outtake are on the outside of the house.

My basement has a walk-out door to the outside and I can also access it via a staircase from the 1st floor to the basement.

There are small tilt out window that I can use to vent fine dust to the outside.

Regards,
Chuck

[glenn bradley]

Upside to the basement is size, year round (or almost) work environment and continued use of your garage. My garag . . . er, shop is about 21 x 31 usable and I have adequate room to keep all but a few tools stationary. DC will be a must in the basement but, it should be anyway. This will just push you more towards doing what you should anyway. Power panel availability comes into play too if your garage is detached.

Downside to basement could be access (read some of the posts about guys getting a jointer down the celler stairs), dust in the house (that's the DC again) and possible sharing of space with your heater, water heater, etc. (not a show stopper but a consideration).

Upside to the garage would be the seperation form the house for dust and noise and ease of access through large doors.

Downside of garage is orphaned cars or the need to be totally mobile to put your tools in thier place at the end of each session.

Unless your basement access is really bad, I'd vote for that.

[Alan Tolchinsky]

I had a basement shop and now a garage. The basement shop was always comfortable winter and summer. I never bothered the neighbors with noise and kept my garage for the cars.

Now in my garage shop I'm having to deal with cooling/heating and room for cars. The only thing better in my garage is electrical panel convenience. That's great as I can easily put in a subpanel and set up all the shop circuits from there. You have a great basement space. I'd use that for my shop if no other factors come into the equation.

[Jim Becker]

Charles, the fact that you have a walk-out is fantastic. Access is generally the biggest sticking point (outside of the significant other's love of you tracking dust upstairs... ;) ) and with that door to the exterior, you're golden for both project, machinery and material ingress/egress.

I will still suggest you wall off around your furnace, etc. to help keep dust away from the systems, but from a safety standpoint, having a closed loop/high efficiency system is a really good thing for putting the shop downstairs.

I do understand your seasonal concerns as I grew up just a little south of you in Wayne County, PA...

[Michael Lutz]

Charles,

Since you are in New York, a basement would probably be the better choice since it appears there is decent access to the space. In the garage you would need to worry about heating it in the winter. I have a basement shop and the only negatives vs using a garage for me is everything I make has to be able to leave the shop through a 30" wide door and moving heavy tools to the basement is a pain.

Mike

[Roy Wall]

Charles,

I think you will find it a Great Convienience to have your shop downstairs - all set up - ready to go when you wish. I fight moving cars and rolling machines in my garage..its okay ...but I'd like a dedicated space a lot better....who wouldn't!!

Sounds like you have an excellent space downstairs. Are there two awning windows to get some cross circulation on nice days?
I am very pleased with a 2hp cyclone - you will like it!

[Charles Wilson]

Roy,

I have 5 windows that I can open and 2 more that go under a deck. I have cnetral air for the dog days of summer.

Now, all I have to get are some stationary tools.

Chuck

[Jim Young]

I've always had a basement shop, on my third one now. I refuse to park my cars outside overnight. There are several downsides and they are as already mentioned tool and project access and the internal noise factor. I have all the major dusmakers permanently hooked to the DC system. I strongly suggest getting the overhead filter also. There are plenty of pics here (http://www.simoli.net/pages%20woodworking/Shop%20pages/shop.htm). If at all possible put the dust collector out of the shop, that way the noise will be much less. My last house I had the DC in the garage and the piping was routed through the header. It was so nice that many times I just left the DC on. You could even have a conversation with someone.

[Art Mulder]

I was going to put my workshop out in the garage but am now looking into the basement. [...] a basement space that is about 20' by 30'.


Jim,
Ceilings on the first and second floors are 9+ feet. The ceilings in the basement are between 8 and 9 feet (lets say 8 1/2').
[...]
My basement has a walk-out door to the outside and I can also access it via a staircase from the 1st floor to the basement.


Chuck, your basement sounds ideal. Large (20x30 is enourmous!), Tall ceilings (very rare) and a walkout!

I have been in a basement for the past 8 years and I like it. And I don't have a walkout, and my ceilings are just a touch under 8' and I only have about 11x22' of space. Sounds to me like your space solves just about all of the issues that I have with my basement shop.

A walkout means that you can get tools and wood into the shop w/out tromping through the house. I could never bring in some of the larger stationary tools into my shop, since I have to cart them down the main stairs.

Personally, I don't find dust to be that much of an issue for me. I have compact air cleaner (Similar to one of these (http://www.leevalley.com/wood/page.aspx?c=1&p=30278&cat=1,42401&ap=1)) and I have a single bagger 2HP import DC with an upgraded bag on it. It does a very good job for my hobbiest shop.

But like Jim Young said, the DC is pretty noisy -- and it is on a lot! If I had the space I would also like to get it out of the shop - build a little insulated closet for it maybe. With a cyclone (which you are considering) could you put the cyclone in the garage and just have the filter coming back into the shop? (or is your garage not attached?)

One thing no one has yet mentioned is finishing. ventilation can be an issue there, depending on what you do. I try to stick with "low-stink" finishes -- always waterbased for any film finishes. Tung Oil, or any oil based stuff is out.

best,
...art

[Charles Wilson]

Garage is not attached. However, building a small insulated room might be an option.

I should post some pictures of the work area.

Chuck

[Chris Barton]

Hi Charles,

I have a basement shop and there are some compromises as mentioned earlier. First, unlike most basements, mine is very dry and in the winter it can get so dry that I'm reluctant to resaw lumber, most specifically when the RH falls below 50%. This is when the most cupping and warping occurs. In fact, I'm just getting back to some projects I began last fall because my shop/basement had an RH in the 30-40s for the past couple of months. Also, as others have mentioned DC is a major consideration. I don't care how great your system will be, you're going to have dust migration inside your house if you're working in your basement. Another concern is light. If you're like the average woodworker (around the age of 40-50) you need plenty of light to see adequately. Few shops are really lighted adequately and even then they tend to rely upon light sources that don't provide natural light.

All this said, I do love my basement shop but, if I had the space I would go with a free standing shop...

[Don Bullock]

Charles, you have already received some great ideas from some knowledgable people. I wouldn't consider my advice to be at the same level of others here who have basement shops, but personally, I wish I had your choice. I miss the basement shop that my dad used to have. Here in Southern California they don't build many homes with basements, so my garage is the only suitable space I have. I hate (yes, it's a strong word) having to move all my tools and cars around everytime I want to work on a project. It's a royal pain. In fact I got out of woodworking many years ago partly because of the problem. Now, as I get close to retirement I'm looking forward to moving to an area where the cars can be parked outside the garage and I can set up a more permenent shop or I'll be able to have my own shop building. Neither are possible where I live now. A garage workspace is also much more susceptible to weather. Even in Southern California my garage gets too cold to work in during much of the winter and in the summer I'm usually limited to early mornings and late afternoons.

It looks like your basement would be an excellent place for shop. It's a large enough space to set up a good arrangement of tools and benches. If you have "walk-in" access, that's ideal. The biggest factor may be humidity. My dad used to have a dehumidifier that he ran which helped with the problem during the "wet months." I remember that when we moved to California he actually reversed it somehow and made it into a humidifier because of the dryness out here. Perhaps that would be something you could do if you face the problems that Chris brings up.

Which ever one you choose, enjoy.

[Chris Jenkins]

Charles,

I have a basement shop and let me say you are really set up for it as many have already pointed out. Dust has always been the evil side of WWing. I agree with Jim as to walling off the furnace. I have done this with my last two basement shops. I always build a little room around the utils to keep the dust away from pilot lights and my dust pumper (AKA furnace, as I don't have a closed system like you)

Take a look at my website if you are interested in some details on how I did my basement. i wrote a whole section on what I decided to go with.

Lots of lights, can't stress that enough. I have BRIGHT high output 8' lights in my shop and are laid out according to the "light formula" that Taunton has described in many of their articles. This way I have little to minimal shadows in the basement.

You mentioned electricity. I have boxes every 5 ft. Why 5? Cause most cords are 6 ft long, so you can always get to the nearest box. Plus conduit comes in 10' section so you just have to cut it in half, very simple. In my last shop I added boxes as I went along, this was a pain. If you have the money, put in the time and you never have to worry about more boxes. I even ran an extra 220 circuit while I was pulling the wire cause you never know when you're going to get that bigger ClearVue Cyclone that we all dream about...

http://unkis17.googlepages.com/shopmayfield.htm

[Gary Eneberg]

Sanding was always my biggest problem in my basement shop. Dust would travel to the second floor. I added an air cleaner which helped greatly. The biggest improvement for me was a Festool sander and vac. No airborne dust at all any more, but I still run the air filter and all is well with the rest of the house. Fein vacs work great for sanding as well.

I love being able to work in the winter months, so I'd never give up the basement and now with the dramatic decrease in dust, the wife agrees.:)

Gary

[Andrew Williams]

As you already know, I have a basement shop. My house is unusual though. The whole house is made from concrete and stone with the exception of non-bearing walls and floors. This leaves me with a great workspace (35x16) in the basement with a 7.5' finished ceiling and no columns. Since there are huge stone walls separating other sections of the basement, the heating appliances are separated by them. I have not felt the need to put a door in the opening, but that would be easy. I have a boiler and hydronic heating, so there is no ingress of dust into the house, except what comes in on my shoes and clothing (this can be quite a bit, but the shavings are the worst culprit). I try to solve the problem by blowing compressed air into my shoe soles before walking upstairs.

The stairs are solid concrete, mainly bedded into the ground, with just a small section having a hollow underneath. They are incredibly strong. The original boiler in the house was so large that it had to be cut into 3 pieces before 3 men could remove it. It is a straight shot out the door, no turns in the stairs. I have thought about setting up a ramp system and using my tractor with a long tow strap to lower and raise heavy items. This has not gotten past the thinking process yet.

Dust is definitely an issue. I actually do not have a full-size dust collector. I use a very large shopvac and connect it to various machines directly. This system has never jammed, even when running the Dewalt 735. The output chute jammed once due to a knot breaking loose into the planer, but that's it. The major issue is having to empty the 16 gallon container every time i plane a full 8 foot board down to 3/4. Also clean the filter every time. I see no reason to improve upon the system until I can afford and find room for an Oneida gorilla. I do not like to buy a tool and then replace it with a better one (have had to do this enough already).

The best thing I ever did in regards to dust was build my own air cleaner. it is gigantic, noisy, takes up floor space, and cleans the air twice as fast as anything on the home market. I designed it to provide 3200 CFM and has 4 large 1u filters that can be cleaned with the shopvac. To test it I can blow compressed air on a pile of sawdust, turn it on and leave the room. Come back in 10 or 15 minutes and I cannot smell any sawdust. They are very easy to make and the cost of the materials is far less than even a small dust cleaner unit.

http://sawmillcreek.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=62188&d=1176251471

Some issues that I have with the basement are ..

1. dealing with the stairs... this is a drag with heavy stuff, even if you can get help, or have a winch or anything. It's just a drag.

2. VOC's and oils... I cannot do spray finishes except on very small areas. I generally have to open a window, and also the outside door, sometimes putting a fan in the door to exhaust the air when I work with VOCs like alcohol, naptha, or acetone. BLO does sometimes smell up the place a bit, but it doesn't enter the house. With a furnace it would definitely stink up the whole house.

3. ceiling height. This is not so much of a problem, as long as you remember things like: don't smash an overhead light bulb while flipping over an 8-foot board to plane the other side.

4. natural light. I have more natural light in my basement than most basements, but more is better, so I need to have quite a few lamps on.

5. mine will likely not flood, since i have many dry wells and I live on top of a very high hill, but it is always a possibilty, especially since there are pipes in everybody's basement.

some good things about it....

1. Wood storage. Underground areas are natural buffer zones for both heat and humidity. While you have enormous swings in both of these for an above-ground space, an underground one will not. This means that generally, once I bring lumber in and sticker it, wait 2 weeks for the stuff to acclimate, It will not change too much when I plane it. winter is a bit tough since the heat drys everything out, but the basement is not nearly as dry as the house.

2. I dont have to go outside to do something in my shop. If I need to check on something, I can just put my slippers on and check it in less than a minute.

3. You are not paying extra to heat the space.

4. Air conditioning? What is that? I go down there after riding my bike on a hot day.

5. Sound insulation. If you live alone, like me, you can do woodworking in the middle of the night.

--

here are a few pics of the basement shop during a headboard construction.

[Eric Shields]

Charles,

Though I cannot offer you the "pro" advise you are seeking, I'm a meger amature and part timer here. I can say that I was at your decision point a few years ago when LOML and I purchased a new house. Garage or Basement?? For me it came down to the question of "our" space, or my space. Do you want to share your shop with a car or two, lawn/garden equipment, storage etc (don't forget to put everything back so you can park the car tonight) or have a shop where you can leave things where they lay to be picked up tomorrow to being again??

I chose the basement, though it's still in the transitional phase, just a little more framing to go :rolleyes:

Eric

[Cary Swoveland]

...I have been in a basement for the past 8 years and I like it...
Art,

I don't question your love of woodworking, but I think you ought to consider getting out from time-to-time. I don't think it's healthy to be couped up for that long.

Cary

[Lance Norris]

Charles... I also have a basement shop and like it. The only concern for me was moving the larger machines into the space. I have one comment that no one has addressed... security. Nobody knows I have $10k + in equipment in my basement because no noise escapes. No prying eyes from people I dont want to know I have machines. I live in a pretty good neighborhood, but I am in a city, and nothing says "rip me off" like the sound of woodworking equipment. I sometimes work all night because I work midnights at my regular job and staying on the same schedule on the weekends makes sense to me(although NOT to my wife). Try to do that in your garage or ground level shop and very soon you will have a visit from the police. Good luck with your shop.

[Joe Chritz]

Not sure what your status is on the "family" situation but one of the big reasons to build my dedicated shop building was work hours.

I normally work nights, until about 4 am at my regular job so late nights working are not unusual in the shop. With two kids and a wife who works mornings I couldn't work in the house.

Beyond that issue your basement sounds like the ideal candidate for a work space.

It happens that is the size of my shop more or less.

Joe

[Dave Lewis]

Charles:

Not pro advise- just hobbyist comments. I have a 16' x 38' basement shop (expands on end to share space with Bosch washer & dryer) with a 2HP 220V Penn State cyclone and ductwork.

Most of the portable tools (mostly Bosch) can be connected via a 3M Bosch hose to the overhead ducts. Works pretty good - except for sawing MDF over the Unisaw; I'm considering a Saw Shark hood and splitter w/ hose to the overhead ducts.

I would recommend that you ask ask Festool about their discharge (port) hose end dia. to ensure connections can be made to std. DC fittings.
Good Luck