How well does a pole building work for woodshop?

[Brian Elfert]

How well does a pole building work for a woodshop?

I've been working on a plan to build a new house along with a 2,000 to 2,600 square foot building to house a large motorhome, car garage, and woodshop.

I was planning on stick built, but the lots I can find in the area I want are $20,000 over my budget. I am planning on geothermal heat which costs up front, but saves $200 to $300 a month. Dropping the geothermal heat would save close to enough to do the stick built shop, but my monthly budget gets out of whack then.

Is a pole building going to cause a lot of problems for a wooshop or will it be just fine?

Brian Elfert

[Kyle Kraft]

My shop is a pole building, and it is more energy efficient than my 3 yr old spec house. I have a poured concrete floor, a pole barn steel ceiling and sheetrock walls with a french cleat most of the way around. It has tyvek, vinyl siding and shutters to match the house and I couldn't be happier with it, unless of course it was free:) .

[Bob Stack]

Brian,

I use a 30' x 40' pole building with a 10' ceiling for my shop. It is on a cement slab and I heat it with a 30' radiant tube heater. It is also air-conditioned and just basic necessities, such as, fridge, microwave, phone and satellite TV. The walls are covered with OSB painted white and insulated 6" and the ceiling 11" of blown-in Cellulose insulation. I can't tell you what it would cost to build because the building was there when I moved in.

Pros:

No roof support obstacles inside due to the truss roof.

Slab keeps temperature pretty even both summer and winter. I hardly ever run the air conditioner even though I'm one who has trouble tolerating the heat.

Like the big doors for easy access and unloading although, they hard to button up during the winter months though.

Cons:
Perhaps a slight problem with moisture in the summer when I stay away from the shop for several weeks (hobbyist who likes to boat in the summer), but as long as I'm using the shop there doesn’t seem to be any build up of surface rust on any of the cast iron. Also, the shop could be weather proofed a little better.

10' ceiling is about minimum for the tube heater (I'm in SW Michigan) and it is difficult to route dust collection ducts around it. Also, his heater is probably undersized for this size building but it works for me 'cause I prefer it cool.

Slab is tough on the feet, but I have laid down the interlocking cushioned mats and these make the difference. Yet, it can be difficult rolling machinery over them.

No overhead storage, go with a 14' ceiling or put on a second story if you can afford it. A loft would really help with lumber storage.

I spend a lot of time out there in the winter and my wife sometimes feels like a barn widow.

Again, I'm a hobbyst advice from a pro may be what your looking for either way I hope this helps and good luck with the new place!

Bob

[Lee Schierer]

Pole buildings hold up well. Adding doors, windows and insulation can prove to be more work than a conventioanlly framed building.

Just for curiosity, which brand of geothermal are you leaning toward?

[Brian Elfert]

Pole buildings hold up well. Adding doors, windows and insulation can prove to be more work than a conventioanlly framed building.

Just for curiosity, which brand of geothermal are you leaning toward?

I'll be using whatever brand of equipment the contractor normally uses. The one contractor I really like is doing Econar. This contractor only does geothermal versus a lot of HVAC contractors that do geothermal as a sideline.

Brian Elfert

[Brian Penning]

Brian,

It is also air-conditioned and just basic necessities, such as, fridge, microwave, phone and satellite TV.

Bob

Jeez! Heckava stealth gloat!;)

[Brian Elfert]

The kind of pole building I'm looking at is the conventional type with steel siding and no sheathing underneath.

A pole buildng done with vinyl siding really isn't all that much different from a stick built shop. I did get a price on a pole building with vinyl siding like this and it was almost the same price as stick built.

Some localities don't allow "traditional" type pole buildings so there is no choice but to use vinyl siding or similiar on a pole building.

Brian Elfert

[Eddie Watkins]

I have a steel building 24x30x10 with a a 10x24 lean-to on one side for lawn mower storage. It has concrete floor which, like Bob Stack, I have put down some interlocking pads. The single biggest problem for me was the difficulty of hanging things on the walls. I solved that by framing the walls with wood, insulating and covering them with 1/2 plywood. I also would recommend building 12-14 feet high for loft storage if possible. Be sure and insulate when you are putting the metal on, the 3" stuff you can buy for those buildings works fairly well and it is much easier than trying to retrofit the insulation. In our area the skylights allow a shop to heat up too much in the summer. I would recommend against them for a shop in the southern regions. Beyond the walls I don't think there is any real disadvantage or advantage other than price and possibly appearance but if you're in it, you can't see it anyway.:rolleyes: :)

Eddie

[Scott Vigder]

[quote=Bob Stack;566351] It is also air-conditioned and just basic necessities, such as, fridge, microwave, phone and satellite TV.


Is this a shop or a summer retreat?

[Ken Garlock]

I'll be using whatever brand of equipment the contractor normally uses. The one contractor I really like is doing Econar. This contractor only does geothermal versus a lot of HVAC contractors that do geothermal as a sideline.

Brian Elfert

Bryan, there is only one thing you need to know when it comes to geothermal and that is Water Furnace.

I had a 5 ton geothermal system installed when we built 5 years ago. I did a lot of research and found that Water Furnace was the best. Yes, there are other good units out there, but Water Furnace seem to have the best track record. If your HVAC man wants your business he will install whatever you tell him.

[Roger Bell]

I have had mine for six years now. Done on the post and frame model (with horizontal girts). Insulated (R19 fiber batt), heated, walls a mix of plywood and sheetrock, full stationary dust collection not a problem. Insulation and wiring is exceptionally easy with girts.

And it doesnt have to look quite like a "polebarn" with the addition of the eaves, windows, etc.

Mine does not have "garage doors", nor is it accessible by vehicle. It is not a garage, it is a shop. As a result, my spousal unit cannot get ideas for others uses for this building.

http://image-hosting.hostwire.com/images/maia007/picture0001a.jpg

[Joe Chritz]

Good insulation.

My vote is always for spray urethane. 1- 1.5 inches thick would be plenty in the walls with cellulose in the attic. Depth dependent on your location but the more the better.

Mine is done with stringers on the interior walls in place of studs and it works ok. You just need to be more careful when hanging cabinets as the height can be effected by lack of vertical studs.

Joe

[Craig D Peltier]

theres a 40x50 here for sale for 4500,u must move, not sure where you are

http://seattle.craigslist.org/sno/mat/310917804.html

[Matt Meiser]

I also have a pole building. Around here they are signficantly cheaper since you don't have to pour a 42" footing. Mine is 30x48 with 30x32 insulated, finished and heated. Finishing is slightly more difficult but not bad. It is easy to heavily insulate a pole building.

I was going to put up a Morton building before we found this house. I personally think the steel buildings look pretty nice, especially with the 2-tone look. The added benefit there is that if the lower panels get messed up by things like poor mower driving skills, you can replace just that part of the wall.

[Bruce Volden]

GOOD THREAD!! In 2 weeks they'll be starting on mine. I opted for a 36 X 60 with a "porch" on one corner. I'll be using 1/2 of it for my shop the other 1/2 for other toys. I have already stubbed in the water line (sink/bathroom) and added 1 1/2" PVC conduit for tv, phone, internet....whatever. Once the frame is up and covered I get to do the "rest", cement work, wall framing, electrical, insulation, drywall..........:( I'm thinking I'll have a lot of work ahead of me which may cut into my slaughtering of the walleyes:mad:
This is what happens when one tries to keep momma happy by moving to the country!


Bruce

[Paul Douglass]

GOOD THREAD!! In 2 weeks they'll be starting on mine. I opted for a 36 X 60 with a "porch" on one corner. I'll be using 1/2 of it for my shop the other 1/2 for other toys. I have already stubbed in the water line (sink/bathroom) and added 1 1/2" PVC conduit for tv, phone, internet....whatever. Once the frame is up and covered I get to do the "rest", cement work, wall framing, electrical, insulation, drywall..........:( I'm thinking I'll have a lot of work ahead of me which may cut into my slaughtering of the walleyes:mad:
This is what happens when one tries to keep momma happy by moving to the country!


Bruce

Isn't it easier to have them insulate it as they put it up? That is the way I have seen most of them done around my parts.

[Chip Peterson]

I bought a pole barn last summer that came with a pretty nice house and a couple acres of land.

(on to the good part)... This is also the post and frame style (with horizontal girts). When I got it it was simply a shell with a dirt floor. I poured concrete (with dust collection pipe and some electrical in it), built out a studwall, ran electric, air lines, insulated with R19 fiber batt also, drywalled, added about 16" of cellulose in the attic space and a bunch of lights. It has a 75K btu gas furnace in the attic spacel. It has an insulated double overhead door in it (just try bringing a vehicle in my shop!) as well as 6 windows.

I added ceiling speakers so that I can have music, a little wall mounted counter top for the microwave, coffe pot and whatever other creature comforts my Bride tells me that I need!

I'm not entirelly settled into it yet, but I have to say, it stays nice and warm even in this cold Michigan weather, and as someone else pointed out, with 10' 7" ceilings and no interior walls or posts, it is wonderful to work in! The overhead dood is nice for brining in plywood/drywall etc.

Two things I'd do differently (1) I talked myself out of using radiant floor heat ( I deserve to be slapped around a bit) and (2) even though I added a bunch of outlets, I should have added two bunches!

Is it worth it? OH yeah!!! :) :D

[Bruce Volden]

Isn't it easier to have them insulate it as they put it up? That is the way I have seen most of them done around my parts.

Paul, I am doing the insulating as the entire structure won't be heated/cooled, only the "shop" part. Also I believe I'll be able to do it much cheaper than the build team. I'll have some friends and family over to help stad walls, wire etc. Then we'll throw some patties on the grill, who knows, might be fun doing this??


Bruce

[Jeff Kerr]

Mine is also a pole barn. 24x32x10. Slab floor. Fully insulated.

The poles are laminated 2x6. Add horizontal 2x4's on both the outside and inside of the post and you have a nice 6" or so cavity for insulation. Also have blown insulation in attic. This has worked out well. It keeps it rather warm in the winter and also cooler than the outside temp in the summer.

I ran all the electric in conduits on the outside of the walls for convenience. I can re-wire anytime by just snaking from the panel to the outlet.

The only thing I would change would be the interior wall material. I went with the "ribbed" steel panels like on the outside. It was cheaper than plywood. It makes it more difficult to hang items on the walls. I have added vertical supports and horizontal french cleats on the surface of the walls to give me something to mount to. You can see them here. http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showpost.php?p=429584&postcount=2. While this is nice I think in the long run smoothe walls would be easier.

This was way cheaper than stick built in my area.

Here is some pics of the structure. http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showpost.php?p=477793&postcount=42

[Brian Elfert]

It seems everyone is happy with pole barns.

I need the side walls to be 16' tall to fit a 14' door for my motorhome so stick-built gets expensive quickly. Pole or SIPS is about the only way to get the height without special engineering.

The first pole barn guy I talked with said the cost would increase 50% ($14,000) if they insulated a 56Lx44Wx16H pole barn. The salespseron said that most people like pole barns because they can do the project in stages to save money. Building itself first, insulation or concrete second, and then concrete or insulation last.

The total cost of a pole building completely done by a contractor all at once is nearly what a SIPS building would cost and the SIPS building would be a better product.

To save money, I would probably have to end up doing things in stages.

Brian Elfert

Brian Elfert

[Brian Elfert]

It seems everyone is happy with pole barns.

I need the side walls to be 16' tall to fit a 14' door for my motorhome so stick-built gets expensive quickly. Pole or SIPS is about the only way to get the height without special engineering.

The first pole barn guy I talked with said the cost would increase 50% ($14,000) if they insulated a 56Lx44Wx16H pole barn. The salesperson said that most people like pole barns because they can do the project in stages to save money. Building itself first, insulation or concrete second, and then concrete or insulation last.

The total cost of a pole building completely done by a contractor all at once is nearly what a SIPS building would cost and the SIPS building would be a better product.

To save money up front, I would probably have to end up doing things in stages. I can do stages with a pole building, but not with a SIPS building.

(SIPS are structural insulated panels. They are OSB on the two sides with styrofoam insulation in between.)

Brian Elfert

[David G Baker]

Brian,
I love my pole building. It is 30x40x10. It has metal siding with 1 inch double foil backed foam insulation under the metal. Asphalt shingle over OSB roof. OSB ceiling with 14 inches of blow in insulation. Slab floor with 2 inch foam board under it. 10x10 insulated roll-up door, two double pane windows and one walk-in door. I heat it with a natural gas fired 75k BTU Hot Dawg heater. During the coldest months in Mid Michigan it costs me under $35 a month to keep it at 50 degrees. When I work in it, I turn the heat up to 65 degrees, when it reaches temperature I turn it back to 50 degrees. The heater may come on once an hour if that. On a 30 degree day it never comes back on after the initial heat up.
I store my John Deer in it and pretty much use it as a metal shop.
Approximate cost to me was around $16,000.
I had to add a bunch of sand under the building to raise it up because the location was in a low spot where water collected, that cost $800.
I did my own electric, other than that it was all contracted out.
The prices have fluctuated since mine was built 4 years ago so it could be more or less now.
If you contract the work out, get plenty of bids as well as get plenty of word of mouth references because there are some real questionable folks out there waiting to take your dough.

[James Suzda]

I’ve got a 40 x 50 “attached” pole-shed /garage on my house. I went with the pole construction because I didn’t want to dig 6 foot deep footings in this heavy clay where I live. I had the company sink the poles 6’ deep and we backfilled with pea gravel against plastic wrapped poles. (When the frost pushes the ground up the pea gravel will just roll against the poles and not lift them.)
Some of the drawbacks that I’ve found are that they are noisy during hard rains. Also if you live in “snow country” never put a door on the eave sides of the building. The snows have a tendency to slide off the roof and will make a big pile in front of the door(s). (My three garage doors face to the north!!) Also I’ve found that some of the nails holding the roof have “popped” and no longer seal. I have to go on the roof and pound some of them down each summer to seal the rubber seals. I had the contractor put foam insulation under the roof tin when it was built. However, if moisture gets between the metal and the insulation when it warms up outside I have a problem with some water dripping off the roof; usually on my tools!
Would I build another? In a heart beat, but I would make some changes.
Jim

[Todd Crow]

Brian,

My brother built this 44'x56'x16' shop for $37,000, and we didn't hire out any of the construction.

http://www.crowsnest.us/images/DCP00513.JPG

It has a 6" thick concrete floor with radiant floor heat in it. There is 2" styrofoam insulation under the concrete. We have 6" of insulation in the walls and 13" in the ceiling.

Here in Minnesota it costs him about $1600 to keep it heated to 50 degrees all winter long.

He uses it for a mechanic shop for his semi and a workshop for our various other projects.

Todd

[Brian Elfert]

Brian,

My brother built this 44'x56'x16' shop for $37,000, and we didn't hire out any of the construction.

It has a 6" thick concrete floor with radiant floor heat in it. There is 2" styrofoam insulation under the concrete. We have 6" of insulation in the walls and 13" in the ceiling.

Here in Minnesota it costs him about $1600 to keep it heated to 50 degrees all winter long.

He uses it for a mechanic shop for his semi and a workshop for our various other projects.


Interesting, the exact same size building was quoted at $27,000 fully erected. The insulation was only a rough estimate of about $14,000 installed and concrete is about $6,000 installed.

I'm suprised it cost $1,600 to heat this building as it costs me maybe $1000 to heat my home in Minnesota. I guess this building has a LOT more cubic feet than my home.

Brian Elfert

[Todd Crow]

Brian,

The shell of the building was a small part of the expense.

We have about $9000 just in the floor - and that's with no labor! There are 52 yards of concrete in it and $1500 worth of styrofoam under that, plus the 2500' of PEX tubing and the heater.

Just to run the electrical feed wire cost us $1250.

Each front garage door was $1500 and $2000 with openers.

We estimated about $20,000 when we started, but as I am sure you are aware it will QUICKLY add up.

You can check out the construction by going to my homepage and clicking on the construction of the farm/truck shop link.

Brian, where are you in MN?

Todd

[Brian Elfert]

Brian,

The shell of the building was a small part of the expense.

We have about $9000 just in the floor - and that's with no labor! There are 52 yards of concrete in it and $1500 worth of styrofoam under that, plus the 2500' of PEX tubing and the heater.

Just to run the electrical feed wire cost us $1250.

Each front garage door was $1500 and $2000 with openers.

We estimated about $20,000 when we started, but as I am sure you are aware it will QUICKLY add up.

Brian, where are you in MN?


I'm in Shoreview, MN (St. Paul suburb) right now. I will be moving to the far northern edge of the metro area or into Wisconsin where I can build a large shop/garage and house. I sure wish I had done this 6 years ago instead of building on a regular city lot in Shoreview.

Some of the extras add up quickly! I'm probably going to have to start bare bones and finish as finances permit unless another builder bidding the garage/shop project comes in significantly lower.

Brian Elfert