Varathane vs Deft

[Bill Wyko]

Varathane vs Deft. The Varathane oilbase makes a beautiful gloss coat but I've found it to take a long time to dry and in cooler weather I can't get it to dry. On the other hand Deft makes a beautiful finsh but I have to do about 9 coats to get the finsh I get with 3 coats of varathane. One way I use alot of finsh the other takes for ever to dry. Which do you all prefer and why? Thanks for the input.:rolleyes:

[Keith Burns]

Deft has my vote. Have a can of the other but can't remember why I don't use it. I guess because the Deft works so good , why change. Also with the Deft's quick drying time it stands a lot less chanch of getting screwd up. I don't have any ties to either company and by no means am I recommending one over the other. Just stating my experience.

[Bill Wyko]

I've always found the answer from experience is better than the answer from book smarts.:eek: (Especially in my field, car audio)

[Paul Engle]

the Deft lacquer is sooooo much thinner particle wise than the oils, with the dryer in the lacquer it sets off really quick., but takes forever to build , where the poly is waaayyy thicker particle count wise and no dryer's it takes forever to " evaporate" and builds fast, turn up the heat or burnish the oil on the lathe the heat helping " cure" where you cant do that with lacquer but o what a nice finish. I suppose if you could put " fish eye " and " dryer " in the oils one might get it to go off quicker and with more " luster".Some of my stuff beg for lacquer and the rest get a variety of oils.Plus ( hic) the liquer is quacker .....:eek:

[Bob Hallowell]

I like to use about 4 or 5 coats of deft spay lacquer, From what it sounds like Mr. hart likes the deft to but for different reasons 'hic':D

Bob

[Bernie Weishapl]

Deft Lacquer is my choice to. I generally put 3 to 8 coats on depending on what kind of shine I want. Of course like John the more coats "hic" the "hic" better.:p :rolleyes:

[Frank Kobilsek]

Are we talk'in Deft Brushing Laq or Spray Laq? I am just starting to play with laquer. I don't like the smell, prefering to my 'hic' from my buddy Jim (Beam), but I have been excited by the first couple tries. I used thinned Deft Brushing followed by some cheap hardware store brand spray laq on the first ones, have a can of Deft Spray for the next batch.

For Poly I tried the Minwax Wipe on Poly back before Christmas and I thought that took way too many coats and the results seemed 'waxy' to me.

Frank

[Kaptan J.W. Meek]

I have sprayed the "brushing lacquer".. Just made a mistake on which can I picked up!!.. BUT, it worked ok.. I've used the poly and I like it, but some of the best oils I've done have failed to dry at first, but after a quick rub down with mineral spirits, they set up fine.. then another coat of oil, mixed with the spirits, then wax and buff.. You gotta try different things to find out what you like.. I like the deft. It flows out good. It's really glossy, and it's fast.

[Ken Fitzgerald]

Last year when I started turning....I put off using the Deft brushing lacquer. I liked the finish I got with friction polishes but I finally got into some projects that required lacquer or oil based projects ...something alcohol resistant.....I've tried spray finishes and have had too much success so I elected to used Deft brushing lacquer. Well I love the stuff and have had great success frictioning it.

I also like Zinsser's (sp?) Sealcoat dewaxed shellac. Great stuff...easy to apply and friction.

I also like danish oil....and when I find antique oil locally I'm going to try it.

I haven't used varathane or thinned poly as I don't like to wait....

[Curt Fuller]

I think one of the big differences between Varathane and any lacquer, Deft included is that the varathane builds one coat on top of the other while lacquer more or less dissolves or melts into the previous coat. I like deft for the "instant gratification" factor. You can take it in the house 15 minutes after you've applied it and show your wife. But the best looking finishes I've seen are the wipe on polyurethane and antique oil finishes that the southern fried boys (Ketron, Cothren, Stinson, et.al.) achieve.

[Keith Burns]

Ok I need to qualify my earlier post. I use Deft spray from a can lacquer but I only use it on my Dyed pieces. On all "natural" wood pieces I use either wipe on poly or antique oil and then beall buff.

[Wally Wenzel]

Has any one tried the watco, i think it has the others beat in a lot of ways,one being it is crystal clear, so adds none of the amber color like deft,
which i used for years. Just my opinon.
Wally

[Bill Wyko]

Wellllll I did a big boo booo. I did a piece with Varathane then I rubbed it out with some 800 grit. then I tried to buff it and it wouldn't buff to a shine like deft so I thought i could put a thin coat of deft. WRONG! the whole thing wrinkled up like a prune on pavement in the summer.:cool: :mad: :( Now My question is how do I remove all the finishes to fix this dilemma?

[Don Orr]

I have been using some of the finishing oils for quite some time now with good reults. There is a locally produced product called Bush Oil. Excellent product! Pops grain like crazy and wipes on and off like Watco, but I like it better. The Watco I have used is the Natural Danish Oil and is definitley not clear. Both of these oils are distinctly amber and darken the wood accordingly. Very nice finishes, but not meant to build a film thickness like a poly, varnish, lacquer, etc. They do have a small amount of varnish in them but build VERY slowly. They are realy meant as an undercoat to a film finish. Used alone, they can be buffed out to a nice soft sheen when fully cured though. I have not had very good luck with the usual polyurethanes. They take too long to cure and I get runs and dust in them. The wiping poly (really just thinned regular poly) seems to work pretty well. Shellac and lacquer are finishes I am really just starting to explore. I have depended on the Bush Oil for almost everything til now. I tried spray Deft with limited sucess-enough to want to keep trying. Brushing Deft is nice for a shiny surface, but both of these need extra attention between coats like other film finishes. I really don't mind the sanding, I just want it to be effective. I have yet to try wet sanding on lacquer, but plan to this weekend.

And as Bill unfortunately found out, not all finishes are compatible with each other:( . Probably going to have to strip everything off and start over-sorry.

Good luck,

[Wally Wenzel]

In my post above i was refering to Watco spray cans of lacquer.
Wally

[Jim Becker]

Wellllll I did a big boo booo. I did a piece with Varathane then I rubbed it out with some 800 grit. then I tried to buff it and it wouldn't buff to a shine like deft so I thought i could put a thin coat of deft. WRONG! the whole thing wrinkled up like a prune on pavement in the summer.:cool: :mad: :( Now My question is how do I remove all the finishes to fix this dilemma?

Well...lacquer over varnish will do that unless you put a barrier coat of shellac between them, and even then you should be spraying the lacquer.

Try lacquer thinner to remove the messed up finish first. (In a very well venitilated area just as you should be in when you work with lacquer...and wearing a respirator) If that doesn't get it, move to a stripper...again, taking proper precautions.

Or, if you can remount it, use very light shearing cuts to cut off the finish...

[Bill Wyko]

Thanks Jim. This really is a bummer. This happened to the last segmented piece with the Turquoise in it. 800 plus pieces and it looks like....well you know....I sure appreciate the help, I'd hate to see this one ruined.:cool: Actually it's the one in my avatar.

[Bill Wyko]

Well...lacquer over varnish will do that unless you put a barrier coat of shellac between them, and even then you should be spraying the lacquer.

Try lacquer thinner to remove the messed up finish first. (In a very well venitilated area just as you should be in when you work with lacquer...and wearing a respirator) If that doesn't get it, move to a stripper...again, taking proper precautions.

Or, if you can remount it, use very light shearing cuts to cut off the finish... Do you think any of that will effect casting resin? That's what my Turquoise is cast in to make the segments.

[Bill Wyko]

Strange that I could spray the varathane over the deft but not vice-versa. Heres a pic of the disaster.:mad: Of all the pieces to do this to it had to be this one.

[Jim Becker]

Varnish and lacquer are two very different products with different properties. Varnish cures by a chemical reaction which is why you end up with a layer of finish for each coat. A new coat doesn't do anything with the previous one. Lacquer cures by an evaporative process and the solvent melts the previous material before it gasses off resulting in a "single layer" of finish. (often referred to as "burning in") The problem you experienced is that the solvents in the lacquer "attacked" the varnish instead of just evaporating without effect. These are incompatiable finishes in the order you used them. Putting varnish over lacquer has no effect since there are no solvents in the varnish that will affect the lacquer. The other way around...bad news.

[Bill Wyko]

Thanks for the info. I'll never do that again. Now I have to try the before mentioned method to fix my disaster.:confused: