Venerring Questions?

[richard poitras]

Had a few questions in regards to veneering, what kind of cutters are most of you using in regards to cutting geometric shapes (strait cuts)? In looking at some of the veneering info out there some are using veneering saw’s, utility craft knives, Japanese marking knives and round wheel cutters .Is one better than another and if so what are preferred? And what brands are the best and place to get them?
Also do you guys use the self-healing mats to cut on, not sure if they are helpful or not.
Plus I was wondering how most of you remove the veneering tape? With water, scraping or sanding? Or what …..
Also what glues do you use and prefer? Thanks for any and all help I am just getting started in doing some basic veneering patterns for box tops and am trying to get set up with the right way to go (still learning)

[Roger Barga]

For most of my cutting I use a well sharpened veneer saw (two cherries brand) with a straight edge to guide the cut, with hardboard or MDF underneath. For detail cutting, I use a scalpel with a self-healing mat underneath; yes, I find these helpful and have four in different sizes. Try to find Frank Pollaro's (sp?) video on veneering - he presents a good tutorial on sharpening the veneer saw; as with many things in woodworking, this can make all the difference in how the tool performs.

For removing veneer tape, use lots of water to loosen the tape. Sharpen the edge of a putty knife and use this to lift the moistened tape. Clean up any residue with a scraper.

For glue up, I've had good luck with simple veneering glue, which I believe is a yellow glue with a thickner added, and execellent results with Unibond (though I'm often too lazy to mix up a batch unless it's a big project).

roger

[Jim Tobias]

Richard,
First, I would direct you to a site (http://www.schurchwoodwork.com/tools/index.html) that I have found very useful. I also bought Schurch's DVD and it was extremely helpful.
As for glues -Urea resin (Unibond 800) is the best for veneering from all I have read. I have used it exclusively with vacuum press and have not had any failures to date.
I use a veneer saw to trim (straight cuts) on veneer and on veneer stacks. I have cut a few sunburst patters with veneer and they get easier with each one you do. I am currently trying to learn how to do some basic marquetry/inlay work. Scrool saw, etc. and it is a learning curve to be sure. Patience, patience!!
I have been trying to learn to use the chisel (as Schurch does) and have found that it really works quite well after a few attempts. Also you can use a scalpel to trim really fine inlay pieces.
The self healing mats are a major improvement not only to the cut of the veneer, but they also save the edge of your cutter (chisel or scalpel). You can find them cheaper at a frame/photo web site. Get it a little larger than you think you need, because you will need it sooner than you think for length.
Lastly on the veneer tape removal, if you wet it with a sponge and then scrape it, you will remove 95% of it. The rest is removed bt sanding. As long as your veneer is not too thin (thinner than 1/42nd), you can sand with 120 or 150 initiallly and be safe. Just saty away from edges as you can sand through there in a hurry.

Hope this helps, I am not an expert, but have spent the last several months trying to get up to speed on the same info that you are looking at now and have been reading, watching and experimenting a lot.

Jim

[Rob Millard]

Richard,
I very rarely use a veneer saw, in fact I’m not sure where mine is right now; instead I use a sharp, straight blade knife like those used for chip carving.

One of my favorite Christmas gifts was one of those self healing mats. I use mine all the time, and it is still like new, which I find amazing since it has sustained innumerable cuts.

I don’t use much veneer tape, but wetting has worked well for me.
In my experience there is no better glue for veneer work than hot hide glue, it is the only glue I use.

Rob Millard
www.americanfederalperiod.com

[Steve Rowe]

For adhesives I like:

Unibond 800
Urea - Plastic Powder Resin (PPR) from Veneer SystemsFor trimming veneer I use an Xacto knife. I also use a flush trimming bit with veneer clamped between two pieces of MDF for edges that butt together. I tried the veneer saw and didn't care for it so no longer use it.
I use MDF as a backer for trimming veneer.

I use the veneer tape. To remove, I have one of those envelop licker bottles from an office supply house and use it to moisten the tape. After sitting a few minutes most of it peels right off. Anything that doesn't come up, I rewet, let is sit a minute and then go after the tape with a hand scraper.

Steve

[jim gossage]

i am a total novice at veneer and found the veneer tape tedious to remove. i have since used blue painters tape and it peels right off after glue up. there may be some downsides to it that more experieced veneerers (is that a word?) know about but i haven't noticed any problems yet.

[Guy Germaine]

I'm with you Jim. I find the veneer tape to be a PITA. I just veneered the top of a Demilune table I'm making. I used veneer tape when I veneered the bottom, and just for grins, I just used blue painter's tape when I veneered the top. The blue tape held the joints just as good as the veneer tape, and it came off with no problems.

[Jim Tobias]

I think where the blue tape would cause problems is if you put it in a vacuum press. With that much pressure, the blue tape can be difficult ot remove. It probably comes off easily if you are clamping the veneer with cauls, etc. I use the blue tape on the "glue" side of the veneer and then flip it to apply the paper veneer tape on the "face" side. I then pull the blue tape off before applying glue and putting it in the vacuum press.
Also, i cannot prove this, but the the supposed justification for the veneer paper tape is that as it dries, it shrinks and poulls the loint together. Again, i cannot prove this, but that is the explanation that is given.

Jim

[Dave Avery]

I, too, use blue painter's tape with fine results in a vacuum press. No problem with removal and no problem with oft-mentioned telegraphing of the tape lines onto the veneer surface. Best. Dave.

[Guy Germaine]

I used it in the vacuum press over the weekend with no problems. The blue tape peeled right off after being in the press for roughly 4 hours. I must have some crappy veneer tape because the stuff I have doesn't pull the joints together after it dries. There seems to be just enough "stretch" to the blue tape that it lets me pull the joints nice and tight, and stays there.

[richard poitras]

Thanks guys for the info, its very helpful when one can learn from others that already have gone through the trial and error period before get started....