A question about boxes

[George Conklin]

Does the wood need to be dry when making small boxes?

Is there a difference when turning into end grain as opposed to side grain as one wood do when turning a bowl with respect to wood movement?

In other words, is green end grain going to move like green side grain will?

Does this make sense to y'all:confused:

[Ron Sardo]

Yes, the wood for boxes need to be dry. End grain boxes would be more stable.

For the most part, I turn boxes end grain although I have turned a couple side grain.

[David Walser]

Like bowls, boxes can be rough turned and then finished turned once the blank has finished drying. This can greatly speed up the drying process and reduces the risk a blank might split while it is drying.

Here's how I do it: 1) Turn the blank round between centers. 2) Turn a tennon on each end of the blank to fit my chuck. 3) Part off the "lid" part of the blank with my thin parting tool (or vice versa). 4) Mount each part of the blank, in turn, in my chuck and hollow the lid and the bottom of the box. I leave the walls fairly thick so I've plenty of material to work with when deciding on the final shape of the box and lid. 5) Tape the two parts of the blank -- tennon to tennon -- with a strip of masking tape running around the tennons. 6) Place the roughed out blank on my "blank drying shelf" above my work bench. This is a wire rack that allows for the air to flow around all sides of the blank.

I should have another step in the process: write the wood type and date on the blank, but I always forget to do that. So far, I've not lost a blank using this process. Here in Arizona, it doesn't take long for a roughed out blank to dry. YMMV.

Green end grain box blanks will move quite a bit as they dry, but not as much as side grain blanks. A lot depends on what part of the log the blank is from. If you finish turn a box from green wood, the fit of the lid will change as the box dries. Even when using a dry blank, the wood will move when you hollow the interior of the box. The process of hollowing relieves stresses on the wood, causing movement. I think, but don't know, that rough turning a blank reduces the amount of movement caused by hollowing. By partially hollowing the box, you give the blank a few weeks to "adjust".

[Bernie Weishapl]

No George the wood does not need to be dry. I turn green boxes all the time. End grain turning is the best and then DNA them for 72 or so hours. Even when I do turn dry boxes I get them pretty close and then let them set for a week or so to settle down. I have had better luck turning green wood for boxes that I do with dry.

[Jeff Moffett]

George, in my limited experience, I have found that box blanks either need to be dry or twice turned as David described. One time I made a box out of wet Mesquite in one session. Since Mesquite is known for being a very stable wood, I figured I'd be ok, but a week later the lid no longer fit properly.

[Glenn Hodges]

If you go to you tube, and type in, woodturning there is a guy turning a box. This might help. BTW, he is using dry wood.

[George Tokarev]

Ultimately. How's that for an answer? Any time you're turning a chunk of wood from anywhere without full climate control, you take precautions or consequences. The standard TDT method is what most choose, though you're normally dealing with differential shrink in one dimension on a long-grain piece. Microwaves can speed the process, but take a bit of caution to keep from ignition, and will sometimes stain when the piece is really wet. I wouldn't bother soaking anything. All methods start afresh when the relative humidity changes, so your "pop" fit at 70% RH becomes a "flop" fit at 35%.

So much for precautions. I prefer to dance around the consequences, since I can't stop them anyway. Ways to deal include making your piece end-grain, with matching grain on the top. A virtual guarantee of a tight fit in one orientation throughout a normal Humidity range, but some wood just doesn't have the character to look good this way.

Make the bottom wedge into the top slightly, leaving a trace of a gap rather than full contact between top and bottom. This makes a top which will stay steady throughout most any humidity range. Sometimes I wedge inside and outside, especially on a cross-grain orientation. Loose lift, but no rattle.

If you need to get a different fit after turning you can add thicknesses of finish around the mating sections, even a little bulk by embedding some pumice and covering with a couple coats of shellac. If it's too tight, a bit of oil and pumice and some counterrotation will abrade the high spots and give you a lap finish.

Of course it's not perfection, it's compensation, but there's a lot less frustration and a lot more useful item at the end.