what's the best workbench style/brand?

[Michael Marcinelli]

Hello all,
I'm about to buy a workbench. Any thoughts on euro style vs. modern/classic? Any brands to recommend?

TIA,
Michael

[Jim Becker]

Workbench format is a function of the type of work you plan on doing on the bench as well as your personal preferences. There is no "best" all around choice. If you describe how you envision using your bench, folks will be better able to help you.

BTW, I've moved this thread to the Neander forum where there is generally more workbench experience and discussion.

[Adriaan Schepel]

The best brand is the one you build yourself.

Seriously.

It should be one of the first projects a woodworker tackles when he is starting to get serious about working wood. It is a great way to learn about basic joinery, and it's so much cheaper than buying one (especially a decent one - most of the cheapies feel ... cheap).

Articles on this abound - here and on other forums. Just remember: your first bench won't be your ultimate bench. It is a place to start. It is a place to make mistakes. It is a place to begin learning.

Cheers,
Adriaan

[Don Bullock]

Adriaan,
That's great advice.

[James Mittlefehldt]

YUp in my humble opinion, workbenches are like lasanga you don't buy them you make them.

(Sorry Alf nothing personal )

[Chuck Nickerson]

he still needs information comparing the various styles. About a year ago, one of the woodworking magazines had two articles side by side comparing Euro vs Modern. I think the proponents were Frank Klaus and Ian Kirby. I'm guessing it was Popular Woodworking.

[Alice Frampton]

YUp in my humble opinion, workbenches are like lasanga you don't buy them you make them.

(Sorry Alf nothing personal )
No worries - you may continue in your delusion. :D This won't answer the OP's question either, but before the "build one" folks pile on the guilt , I'll just offer up a repeat of my thinking so at least there's the alternative POV:


I was going to build - drew up the plans, got hold of a secondhand front vice, then priced up the materials. Eeek. By the time I'd factored in the cost of the timber over here (horrendous) there was starting to be nothing in it in terms of cost. So I went through the arguments that are always put forward for building your own:

1. You can make it to exactly suit yourself.
Well yeah, if I knew what that was. All I knew was I wanted a tail vice and that was going to be a royal PITA to make (only plain tail vice screws available over here at the time). Plus it occurs to me that everyone who has bench experience at a college or with some renowned w'worker inevitably ends up making the same design of bench they learnt on. Is it 'cos it happened to be their ideal bench? Nope, it's 'cos it's what they'd got used to. So I figured I'd get used to any design anyway, so why worry?

2. You learn valuable skills and techniques.
Undoubtedly, if you're a timber framer... Well perhaps not that bad, but I couldn't see myself ever having to make oversize dovetails again, and gluing up thick tops of 2" or 3" beech? No thanks. It seemed to me I'd learn more making the furniture I actually wanted to make rather than one of the tools to help me make it.

3. It's a rite of passage.
Ack - if you're a bench builder, sure. Making nice furniture is my goal - getting that right is my rite of passage. Anyway I suspect I'd still be up that perishing passage without a paddle if I'd decided to build...

4. It's expensive to buy one
This true, although it didn't work out much better buying the materials. It was a tough cost to swallow, but when I rationalised it as a lifetime purchase (and one I'm hopefully young enough to get full value from) up against buying a tablesaw or something that'd last me 10-20 years if I was lucky, well it didn't seem so bad.

The final decision was pretty much taken away from me - my folks put their foot down and said they couldn't cope with my angst over a large project that'd likely last months if not years, and if I wrecked my back I was on my own. So I hit the order button.

Cheers, Alf

[James Mittlefehldt]

he still needs information comparing the various styles. About a year ago, one of the woodworking magazines had two articles side by side comparing Euro vs Modern. I think the proponents were Frank Klaus and Ian Kirby. I'm guessing it was Popular Woodworking.

Fair enough;

there are two books available one from Taunton Press The Workbench Book, by Michael Fortune, which gives a fairly in depth analysis on various styles of benches etc. There is another book published since that one the title of which I forget, but look in the books section of Lee VAlley's online catalogue and you should find it.

I personally did not have a bunch of training in schools, none actually at the time, and so went into it with an open mind, I ended up designing something that sort of falls between a Shaker bench and the Roubo bench.

Essentially a joiners bench as opposed to a cabinet makers bench but I have grown used to it and it works well for me.

Essentials are, 34 inches high, seven foot long, 28 inches wide, no tool tray, but a shelf underneath in the runners. Made from three inch thick white ash I scooped at a farm action for roughly 25 cents a board foot.

I have a fullwidth end vise, (veritas twin screw) and a corner vise down in the front left corner. It is big and it allows me to do two operations at a time so for example I can be set up to cut dovetails, in the end vise and then have a second set up to pare or chisel out the waste.

Hope that is of some assistance and sorry for the flippant answer to a serious question.

[Zahid Naqvi]

As most people have stated above, it depends on what you plane to do. the problem is most people who are just starting (I am assuming you are just starting since you ask about a work bench) don't know enough about WWing to know what they will indulge in. If you are like me you will do a little bit of everything and may be after a couple of years start getting a feel for what you like and what not. Chances are you will make several benches during your WWing life, so start conservatively.

The Bob and Dave’s Good, Fast, and Cheap Bench (http://www.woodworkersworkshop.com/cached_files/3365_files/) is always a good first bench, and very economical. Plus building it will give you some good experience. You can pull this one off in one weekend.

[Dennis O'Leary]

Good advice Zahid. I trawled the web, and I reckon Bob's bench is an excellent first choice. I started out making one, then came accross some 90x35 quartersawn Tassie Oak (Eucalyptus Regnens), and then some really dense 150x100 recycled 'old growth' timbers from an old bridge, and then found a most excellent website in Australia (google 'ubueat') - one thing led to another, and this is my first bench. The overhangs are great for clamping, and I really like the tool tray. Things I'd change are

Front legs flush with front of bench
Dogholes closer to front
tail vise (I will add one later)
Slightly higher, about 910mm/36" - I made it 820mm/32", and being a short-arse at 5'9" i still stoop a bit.Lee Valley have a really good bench.

[Eric Sink]

Dogholes closer to front
How close to the front are they?

How close do you wish they were?

[Charles McKinley]

Hi Michael,

Your first bench doesn't have to be a work of art and/or cost you an arm and a leg.

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?t=49008

At the end of this thread ar some pics of my humble yet functional bench.

If you have a couple of grand just burning a hole in your pocket the Lie-Nielsen benches were listed tops in the FWW tools and shop edition.

[Charles McKinley]

Chris Schwarz has a blog on the Woodworking Mag site. He has built a couple benches in he last year or so, one English style one Roubo (sp).

Here are links to my bench if you don't want to go to the other thread.

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=54763&d=1168392377

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=54762&d=1168392363

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=54761&d=1168392351

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=54760&d=1168392343




Here are links to the pics

[Jim Voos]

I have to agree with Alice on this one. I pondered the same question a couple of years ago while learning at the College of the Redwoods. The instructors there brought up some good points. What do you want to work on? If you have a limited amount of time to devote to woodworking, you have choices as to how to spend your time. They had no problem with buying a bench, and most people would agree that their students build some pretty nice projects, so a home built workbench isn't essential.

I have all the workbench books, love looking at the custom benches, but am more excited at building furniture, so I bought my bench and put it to work right away. Couldn't cover the cost of the raw materials in my area for what I paid.

I did compromise, though in my approach, and have built some tool drawers to go under my bench. I have also built some tool cabinets for the walls, which by definition are customized to my tools. The workbench didn't need to be customized, other than being a left hand version in terms of vise locations- I am in my right mind :)

[George Clark]

Michael,

Although you did not ask for buy vs build information I see the workbench police are out in full force with their my way is the only way responses. I built my own work tables which served as workbenches for a time but I personally did not think a cabinetmakers style workbench was a good first project for me. After considerable research I chose a Diefenbach workbench. http://www.workbenches.com I am quite satisfied with the quality of the bench and the service from the company. Mine had some shipping damage issues that were quickly resolved. I understand that the factory in Germany has closed but the US distributor still has a good bit of inventory. I hope this is of some help.

George

[Michael Gibbons]

Michael , You'll probably get a dozen different answer from a dozen different people. A few years ago I was eyeing a Ulmia when they were being sold at Woodcraft but didn't have the MOOLAH$. I beleive they have cheapened the benches during the changeover to new owners. Now the Lie-Nielsen benches got top picks in the latest FWW Tools and Shops issue. I wouldn't expect anything less from LN. Also the Deifenbach look very substantial. Now as far as what design you should get is the hard one. I am personally going to build mine based on the Frank Klause bench or the so-called Scandanavian style bench. I have already purchased the hardware from Lie-Nielsen which ran about $260 if I recall. I really think that the shoulder vise on a Scandi bench has advantages do to the lack of a vise post getting in the way. I see no advantage in a twin screw vise because I am not going to bend way over to plane anything on the other side of the bench. I will simply turn the piece around to work on the other half. I'm not in such a hurry that I can't do that. I would get a few more books and what a couple videos and see and think about what you might like.

.......Mike

[Michael Hammers]

IMHO the Mike Dunbar style lends itself best for me in chair/furniture making via neanderthal methods. I am 3/4 done and made it all hardwood. It has been a great learning project, especially coming from a "Norm" style shop. It was featured in FWW.

Check out this website http://www.workbenchdesign.net/
Lots of really good info on various designs from cheap and fast, pre-made to works of art.

Also if you decide to build go straight away and order Scott Landis's The workbewnch book, it is invaluable.

Good luck on whatever you decide!
Cheers, Michael

[Dennis O'Leary]

How close to the front are they?

How close do you wish they were?

I put them about 75mm in. I would like them to be about 45mm, or a little over 1 1/2".

[Jerry Palmer]

The best bench is the one that is simple enough to be modified as you begin discovering how you really work. Without that knowledge you are swinging at fastballs in the dark. Determining how you need to hold the work you do is the first step, IMO. Once you figure that out, then you can begin to decide what you want your bench to do for you.

I've got some workholding stuff on my site, http://www.sawdustersplace.com/Workholding/Workholding.htm some of which are examples of my simplistic way of handling things, others that other folks have provided. Mine is a storebought because it was too cheap to pass up. But I've made it my own through modifications. It is not for everyone, or maybe not even for anyone else, but it is what works for me.

[Ruston Hughes]

Fine Woodworking just had a comparison of several workbenches in a recent issue (#188). It's a good read for comparision of premade workbenches.

With that said, I agree completely with Jerry's comments. I did a lot of research before building my bench and couldn't make a decision on what style of bench because I didn't have a good feel for how I would be using it for various tasks. I bought Sam Allen's workbench book which describes the various styles of workbenches, vises and methods of using the workbench for various tasks.

My approach was to build a simple, inexpensive bench as a learning experience. For about $200 I built a bench with a MDF/hardboard top, 4x4 douglas fir base and a single face vise. Now that I've been using it a while I have a much better idea of what my ideal workbench would be given what I like to build and the tools/techniques I like to use.

Now if I had $2500 laying around I might have just gotten the LN workbench and been done with it:D, but that wasn't an option for me.

[Mike Holbrook]

I built a easy one from an old Time Life Series "Home Workshop" plan that has seen better days. I bought a small one when I needed one to do a home construction project and could not stop the project to build one:
http://www.highlandwoodworking.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=2328

I think if I was starting over I would use a Festool Table and saw to get started. You can do most wood working and home construction projects with: Festool table, saw, router and dust collector. Although those 4 items are expensive, compared to a workbench, table saw, router table dust collection system .....the price is very reasonable, the tools are easy to use and the dust collector that works with all the tools will make your work much more enjoyable and safer. The Festool table has a clamping system that in some ways is more versatile than even a work bench.

The Festool gear is a system that is all made to work together in an organized safe manner. The Festool gear is portable and will not need all the space that stationary tools require. So if you have limited knowledge,space and budget but want to do some first class construction and wood working Festool offers a vary versatile, powerful way to get started for less money than you would dish out for a couple quality stationary tools and a dust collection system.

[Brian Kent]

I started out with a wobbly table and a slanting , uneven 2x4 hammering bench. I felt free to brace and drill the table and to work on the 2x4's with my home depot planes. I bought a discount vise and mounted it where I would want one on a good bench, just for practice.

Then one month last spring there was a compulsion to get out there and start making a scandinavian bench with my favorite woods.

So my advice is do anything that works. Then when it's time, buy or make your ideal (for today) and have fun.

[Pam Niedermayer]

As I started trying to make a bench I realized that I needed at least a small bench to make a big bench; so I dropped back and bought one from Woodirect (http://www.woodirect.com/merchant2/) when it cost half as much as their current model (mine came with only the tail vise, but I don't use a front vise anyhow). I've modified it to have a planing beam the length of the back. I also built a tiny mortising/sawing bench out of some spare 2 X 10 stock. Since the building department has seen fit to make me continue using my shed, the size is still right. This has given me the opportunity to test how I prefer working, so I'm now ready to build bench, planing beam, and assembly table whenever the bldg dept comes to its senses.

Pam

[Randy Acton]

One feature I like about the bench I'm currently using is the recessed are in the center for holding all the small parts, screws, etc... so they aren's in the way while working, which is also hooked up to the dust collection.

One thing I have to have in the next bench is a "saddle" style clamp that will hold the work piece in two directions.