My first handcut dovetails

[Eric Sink]

I've been trying to put this off. I've watched Cosman's video several times. I've bought tools. I've read books. I've done everything I could to avoid cutting my first set of dovetails because I wanted my first set to be really good.

And then tonight I decided that this was a dumb way to approach the learning process. It's probably impossible to learn how to cut dovetails without cutting any dovetails. So this evening I went out to the shop, and I decided I wasn't going to worry about how they turned out.

Well, the result looks pretty bad. :)

I suppose I could have made it easier on myself. Curly white oak is arguably not the recommended wood for learning to cut dovetails.

I had a heckuva time getting the joint to go together at all. Plenty of trimming with a chisel was required.

I even screwed up the orientation of the boards. In the picture you can see the word "inside" written on one of the boards, now on the outside of the joint.

But at least the joint is square! :)

I'm going to watch Cosman's video again, with a newfound appreciation for his skills. And then I'm going to try and do a little better the second time.

But I'm keeping this piece so that someday when I improve my skills I can look at far I've come.

Anybody else end up with a really ugly first set of dovetails?

[Roy Wall]

Eric,

You hang in there!! It may take 3 or 10 or 20 DT's ...but you will improve.

Your saw marks look pretty good......the accurate scribing from the tails to the pin is very crucial. Make sure you have good lighting and try and split the lines!

You can practice using Poplar - little more forgiving. Make about a hundred cuts to lines in practice boards.

An excellent craftsman on this forum once said " In its simplest form, WWing boils down to accurate marking and cutting TO A LINE." Well, something like this...:o :confused: :cool: It wasn't me - I'm not an excellent craftsman!

I know how you feel about research , getting the tools, watching Rob... I did all this stuff too-- but you are right -- you HAVE TO CUT THEM to learn.

Good for you!! Keep it up!! It is intimidating at first...but you will see the beauty of the joint as you work-- and you'll be an old pro in no time!

[Mike K Wenzloff]

Hey Eric--not bad.

Like Roy says, keep at it. I usually also recommend Poplar, but Cherry is also a good wood if it is cheaper in your area.

Chris Schwarz once wrote about making a corner like you did in this post, once per day for 30 days. You'll have it down pretty well. Mark them with the date. Cut a couple practice lines at first, but soon you'll go from marking to cutting.

Take care, Mike

[Mike Henderson]

Eric - Let me add my encouragement, also. My first dovetails looked about the same as yours, but the next ones were better, and I learned more from the ones that followed.

I kept my first dovetails for a while, also, just as a reminder. Finally threw them away during a shop cleanup.

Just keep cutting and you'll improve. Try some easier wood.

Mike

[James Mittlefehldt]

Heck Eric compared to the first set I cut yours look great, and I did the same thing getting the orientation mixed up, so my rectangle became a Z.

After I did those I read Ian Kirby's The Complete Dovetail, which set me on the right path. Since then I have amalgamated several techniques or ideas to end up with the way I do them now. However I always read any article I can find on them, or mortise and tenon joints, which in my opinion are harder to cut by hand than dovetails.

You ahve made a good start but as mentioned above you might try a more forgiving wood for a while, till it comes easier. Oh and yes I stll have those first dovetails hanging about somewhere just to keep me humble.

[Mark Singer]

We have all made dovetails that are similar....hang in there and keep doing them. Accurate scribing and sawing is the weakeast areas when you are learning.... You will surprise yourself in time!

[Nick Clayton]

Did you ride your bike in a perfectly straight line when your first tried it?Practice , practice, practice!!! It's the only way I found to improve my DT's. Don't over obsess about the layout of your pin size etc (have you ever checked out old furniture). Have fun with it.:D

[Chuck Schwab]

Hi Eric,

You know I've been putting off doing handcut dovetails forever. I think I've been intimidated by the whole ordeal and overwhelmed with the literature out there. Even this week I was contemplating buying a router dovetail jig to make some but decided last night I didn't want to. So I'm heading to the big Woodcraft sale this weekend and stocking up on some good tools so I can start handcutting dovetails. Hopefully I can do this on Monday and will look for your post and put a pic of my first attempt as well.

Oh, and if my first attempt turns out perfectly:rolleyes: , I'll have my 5 yr old make some and claim that it was my work so you aren't discouraged! (joking)

Chuck

[Matt Campbell]

My first dovetails weren't very good, but man did my third set (for some reason) look soooo much better. You should definitely keep practicing. You could just take some scrap and do two pins and tails every day or every other. Whatever. Just make sure you get to keep practicing if you enjoy it.

[Terry Beadle]

Another thing you should practice while you are at it is how to repair the practice dovetails you've cut. This is where you put little shims of wood that go with the long grain or end cuts on the opposite situation. They help you to focus on the gaps and how they came about.

Also use a very fine marking knife for your initial marks and then fill the cuts with a very sharp #2 lead pencil.

By the way, starting with oak is not a good selection because there's almost no give to the wood. The popular suggested or straight grained cherry is a better practice wood. I practiced on pine and it like to drove me nuts because it would flake at just the wrong place even when the chisel whas hair shaving sharp.

Like the fellows said. Persistance will win and the rewards are many.

[Randy Acton]

Keep up the good work!! For a first try that is very respectable. I try to practice a handcut dovetail or two every time I go in the shop. Hopefully it won't be long and I'll be doing them in my sleep.

I took a jointery class at MASW a couple years and it was the single biggest thing I've done to improve my handwork skills. And of all the methods I've seen for handcut dovetails, IMHO Marc Adams has the best.

[David Tiell]

For your first time, that don't look so bad. I think my second, third and fourth times looked worse. Keep up the practice. But yeah, switch to a different wood, at least while learning. I did most of my practicing in pine and poplar. I finally got tired of just making corners, and decided to make a tool tote. The joints look a lot better than the first ones, much worse than i can do now, but that was 17 years ago, and I still have it today. Actually making something helped me to take my time and be more careful, knowing that if I cut any joint wrong, it was back to square one.

[Eric Wong]

They look way better than my first set. Mine looked like they were made by a beaver.

[Tim Wagner]

Well soon I will follow in your footsteps, and then you will be good and mine will look like yours. yours actualy don't look that bad. if you mixed some glue up with some saw dust and glued it together to fill in the gaps it would look pretty good once sanded.

[Andrew Williams]

My first ones looked about like that. My second ones, I overcompensated for the gap, made them too tight and the joint broke. My third ones I got it right. I scribed from the tails to the pins with a pencil and cut on the waste side of the pencil line, leaving at least half of it. I kept my third one and still have it

The pic doesn't show all the putty in them ;)

I recommend practicing on 1/2" poplar. Much easier than 3/4" anything, especially harder woods. Just that one joint in 3/4" ash took a long time!

[Brian Kent]

Your first dovetails look alot like mine.

The secret is about a pint of wood putty and lots of sand paper.

[Jim Becker]

The secret is about a pint of wood putty and lots of sand paper.

Nope...slivers of wood with the grain oriented in the same direction as will best fill the space. Never use wood putty. If you do this carefully, you'll almost not be able to tell that there was space there to begin with! And with dovetails, it's generally pretty easy to cram wood in there, too... And yes, I've had to do this will nearly all the hand-cut dovetails I've done...which is not very many. But it was the savior of my cherry mantle project. Frankly, I can't find the gaps now.

[Charles R. Smith]

My first ones were about the same quality. I did them using Rob's video as a guide. Then I showed them to Rob, to get his critique. He said that my biggest mistake was that my wood wasn't perfectly dimensioned to begin with. That proved to be the best advice I've gotten on the subject.
Charles in Victoria (who is still trying to make the perfect dovetail joint)

[Brian Kent]

Jim,

All joking aside for the moment - "yes" on the wood fibers - "no" on the pint of wood putty. That, plus erring in the direction of too tight rather than too loose to begin with, and paring a bit to fit.

[Tim Wagner]

has anyone used plywood to practice on? I seem to have that in abundance. I also have some peices of oak. I could get some poplar, or cypress. I love the look of cypress.

edit: I went and got a dovetail saw, a small chisel 5mm, and some water stone. 1000 grit on one side and 4000 on the other.

[Jim Dunn]

I've been told on this forum that plywood, having glue as part of it's construction, is not the best of materials to practice on. That is of course unless you just love sharpening tools:)

[Tim Wagner]

That is of course unless you just love sharpening tools:)

Need to practice that too. I don't however wish to dull my chisels intentionaly to do it though. I also don't have any olds ones to test those skills on.

ok, i'll just get some poplar.

[Andrew Williams]

1/2" poplar is great for making dovetails

[David Barbee]

Been preparing to give this a shot myself. Yesterday i spent some time just trying to cut to a line. I was watching a Frank Klausz hand tools video a few days ago and he spoke about doing exercises with your tools. For dovetails it was pretty much cutting to a line. I figured that i better start there first. How are you cleaning out your waste? chisel or fret saw?

[Bob Oehler]

Like everyone said just keep practicing. I am a firm believer in marking a bunch of lines on a board and sawing to the lines for practice. The closer you can saw the better the dovetails are. I find the more chisel work I have to do the more chance I introduce for errors.

Keep the dovetails and date them. I have several of my practice pieces in my shop. They are neat to look at and are a reminder of how far I have come. My kids can throw them out when I am gone, if they chose.

Take Care and keep on dovtailin'

Bob Oehler

[Andrew Williams]

I just chisel them out. This is fast with sharp chisels, especially on 1/2" wood that is not too hard

[Jeff Craven]

How are you cleaning out your waste? chisel or fret saw?I've been using a Jewelers saw (adjustable frame fret saw), with a fine tooth scroll saw blade. It is easier to control than a larger coping saw. Since the throat isn't very deep, I bend the blade about 45° so the frame won't hit the workpiece. Then I chisel out the last ~1/16" - 1/8".

http://www.olsonsaw.com/images/Jewelers-Saw_lg.jpg

[Charles Jackson III]

Very nice dovetails.