Selling an occasional piece of funiture

[Robert Goodwin]

My wife used to work with me, but since the birth of our children, she has been at home. We planned for this and I couldn’t be happier. Money gets a little tight this time of year though with Christmas and all, which got me to thinking. I am a hobbyist, and some of the projects that I really want to build do not necessarily fit with my wife’s taste. I’d like to build a piece a year or two just for fun and to sell around the holidays for a little extra cash. How would one go about doing this? I’m not into this for a business. I probably would not like to do a commission due to the lack of time I get in the shop with two small kids. A commission would require a schedule/deadline. I have too many of those at work.

If the piece doesn’t sell, no big deal, I am sure I could just give it away for a Christmas present. But ideally it would be nice to get my money back for wood for the next project and have a little extra for Christmas gifts.. Any ideas what would be a good way to sell an occasional piece of furniture? Consignment, Newspaper???

[Noah Alkinburgh]

Couple of suggestions. Take pictures of your projects and bring them in to work. Show them around casually to close friends at work and then some may ask you about selling or you may be more direct and let them know that it is for sale. If they are small projects and you can do it, bring it in to work and display it.

Another option is ebay.

Church or other social group you might be a part of. Do the same thing as at work.

Best of luck!

Noah

[Carl Eyman]

The low end antique shops that sell furniture sold by Sears or Woolworth in the first third of the twentieth Century Might be a good choice.

I had such a relationship once. If a customer bought a dry sink (commode) for instance and wanted a shelf unit to make it into a hutch you could do that. It is commission, but a small enough job so time would not be so big a factor. Another approach is to ask the shop what sells, make the piece, and give it to them on consignment.

[Jim Young]

Dond't know how social you are at work, but there is the perfect hobbyist market. I have mentioned to a few people that I do woodworking. This usually brings questions like "can you do this?". Every once in a while someone will ask for some special "thing" that they can't find in stores. I have gotten several projects this way. The people always love the item and never complain about the timing because they know that you are doing this as a hobby.

The bigger question is "how much do I charge"? I'll let you wrestle with that one for a while.

[Ed Marks]

I also agree with the comments about selling at work. By just talking about the hobby I've managed to hook up with a few people who come back each year for something. It puts a few dollars back into the hobby and usually funds whatever Santa delivers to the workshop. Having a WWW site of your work goes a long way at work. I never actually set out to sell things to people I knew from work, it just happened.

Another method is to hook up with a higher end gift shop that might be interested in selling on consigment. Around here there is everything from shops dedicated to selling furniture and other craftware (pottery, etc.) to antique shops that carry a line of furniture. Small items like jewelry boxes and unique turnings can be quite profitable; although, they take time to sell. If you think about it early enough and can get some peices placed you can probably sell one or two a year. You might also meet a potential buyer that will come back.

[Robert Goodwin]

Thanks for all your responces. I did not think about the workplace as being a good place to sell. I have had people ask about some of the pictures I have had at my desk.


Thanks again,
Rob

[Lynn Sonier]

The "how much to charge" thing gets to me too. Materials are so darn expensive it seems like its a shame to also charge an hourly rate. I do a lot of work for churches and feel bad when I submit a bill which includes materials and my time. They pay it but its like taking money from a friend. Another thing, I enjoy doing the work so much it is almost its own pay - but not quite. Made a couple of doors for a table for a local church today - rail and stile - and they're the best I ever did. That's a pretty good rate of pay in itself. (Maybe I shouldn't say that I made them out of white oak instead of red oak because I picked up the wrong plank at the lumber yard.)

[Robert Goodwin]

I agree about the joy of working on it being my hourly pay. Since I would only be make a piece a year or two to sell, I don't think that I would be hurting local funiture makers by undercutting them. Atleast I hope not, I would not want to impact a business in a negative way.

[Noah Alkinburgh]

I agree about the joy of working on it being my hourly pay. Since I would only be make a piece a year or two to sell, I don't think that I would be hurting local funiture makers by undercutting them. Atleast I hope not, I would not want to impact a business in a negative way.

Robert,

One word of caution on pricing. If you start low its very difficlut to raise the price. I struggle with this too especially when selling to friends and family. It is one of the reasons I haven't sold much, but when asked about price I always ballpark higher then I am comfortable with. Even then I am probably low. While I understand not wanting to charge hourly the bottom line is they are getting a piece of you and your passion and even if you don't think your hours should be paid for, you attention to detail, care, and personal touch should be worth more then anyting else.

Just a thought....

Noah

[Robert Goodwin]

Robert,

One word of caution on pricing. If you start low its very difficlut to raise the price. I struggle with this too especially when selling to friends and family. It is one of the reasons I haven't sold much, but when asked about price I always ballpark higher then I am comfortable with. Even then I am probably low. While I understand not wanting to charge hourly the bottom line is they are getting a piece of you and your passion and even if you don't think your hours should be paid for, you attention to detail, care, and personal touch should be worth more then anyting else.

Just a thought....

Noah


Good point. I might just steer clear of Friends and family for selling purposes. Although I'm pretty easy going there is no telling what kind of problems could occur if my idea of what a friend wanted is different then mine.

[Jared Cuneo]

Its tough, I just completed 2 commisioned, small, hinged boxes and I put a ton of hours into details and sanding/finishing. In the end, they came out great but in all honesty, I made about $5 hour. My normal job, sidework would pay $75-100/hr, but I hate doing it.

Also, I had to recut some parts for this job, thankfully, the wood was not figured nor were the size of the pieces of any consequence, but you must take these things into consideration.

HOWEVER, your situation is somewhat unique in that you are just doing it for pleasure and it doesn't really matter if the piece sells. This helps take the pressure off. And believe me, even though this is not my day job, it always seems like when you are just playing it by ear and not building to spec, everything goes right....When you have deadlines and customer spec, the craziest nonsense seems to happen :)

I would also agree with Noah, just like a job, its very hard to increase price/salary....don't start out low....if your work is good, it will show and they will pay for it....gotta be a salesman too.....the things we make in our shops don't come off an assembly line in China....

JC

[Chuck Lenz]

I would charge what you have to have in labor. If they don't like it, well theres allways the made in China products they can buy. Custom anything is more expensive than mass produced products. And don't tell everyone it's your HOBBY ! I'm not so sure that selling your work at work is the way to go either, if anyone has a issue with your work or prices you may create some bad feelings and put your main income at risk.

[Matt Lackey]

I did furniture full time for a few years, now I am in the same boat. I plan on avoiding $15/BF figured wood and make things I like. I will be trying my luck on craigslist to see if I can move some tables and etc. I think I may present somewhat anonomously like "Made by a local craftsman."

There is a huge difference in the value of custom and spec work. With custom, people participate in the creative process and they have to pay for that, they like to pay for that.

If I just make something, I get the enjoyment and the buyer just gets a well made product. I do not meet them at their house nor do I deal with their "interior designer." The price has to be lower or I am gouging. Also, with spec work, dimensions can be determined by the size of offcuts in the shop. You cannot chage custom pricing for that. You can if they want a second one that matches however, you should not charge for design time.

Whenever I "market" to people I know I always endup hornswagled into some project I do not want to do. This is why you should just sell completed products if that is what you have time for.

Matt

[Lee Schierer]

Look around your area. Here where I live, there is are a couple of finished/unfinished furniture shops that would take custom pieces on consignment. There is also a permanent indoor flea market that has booths you can rent. You could rent your own or talk to someone that already rents one. There are also several local craft fairs in the fall. I'm sure your area would have similar places. Just remember what ever price you first mention at craft fairs or flea markets, will likely get negotiated down rather than up. Most people shopping like to haggle over the price a bit when they shop those types of places.

Some people rave about craigslist, but I can't ever seem to get it to work locally.

[Rod Torgeson]

About 11 years ago I started making pens. I got my lathe and supplies at the beginning of my Christmas break from work. We had about a week off over the holidays. Between then and next Christmas I made a bunch of pens. Then just before the holidays in 1997 I took some to work and showed them around at the appropriate time to people. I sold about $500 worth of pens to co-workers. Most of that was accomplished by word of mouth. I retired in January of 1998. In the fall of 1998 I went back to work on contract for 2 months. During that time I had people come up to me and ask if I still made pens and was I selling them. Once again I made around $500. One lady had lost the pencil to a set that she had bought for herself. I made her a new one, no charge. She had bought several sets from me for gifts.

I also contacted some jewelry stores in the area where I lived(Marysville, WA) and there were three that bought from me and then doubled the price in their store. One store would give a set away when someone purchased a high dollar item.

Now I still make pens and give them away to The Freedom Pen Project.

Rod<---in Appleton, WA

[Richard Niemiec]

As to the OP question, when folks hear that I make things, they are always asking about "could you make a [blurful] for my living room" and I always dealt with it this way: I would ask what they had in mind as far as style and size, and told them, "OK, that sounds nice, I'll tell you what, that sounds like an interesting project, I will build something like that to my taste, and when its done I'll let you take a look at it and if you like it, you can buy it. If you don't, no hard feelings, I'll keep it." This way I'm not in the position of having to review design choices with them, worrying if they will like it or not, am not under a deadline and I get to make something that I am interested in with some design elements that will build upon my skills, e.g., inlay, bow front, moldings, etc. I also quote them a round number, say $1000 for a sofa table, and usually sell it to them for $800 when its all said and done, depending on how much time I have into the project and the type of wood involved. I have done this about 6 or 7 times, and every time it is gladly purchased, and there are good feelings all around.

Now, a few folks mentioned consignment shops, and a word of caution is appropriate. Be careful about who/where you consign goods. For example, if the shop goes belly up and files bankruptcy and has floor plan financing from a bank or an asset based lender, the creditor generally has taken a security interest in collateral, which is the contents of the store. This would include your piece as it becomes part of the bankruptcy "estate" because it is in the debtor's possession, and if the lender forecloses its security interest, it can sell your goods and keep the proceeds - UNLESS - you have filed your own UCC-1 security interest in the piece and are on record. This applies to both existing creditors and future creditors of the consignment shop.

This gets somewhat complicated, here's a link (one of many) that will give you some background:

http://www.poynerspruill.com/infocenter/Bankruptcy/Consignment_Sales_Requirements_Article9.asp

This is more important if you deal repetitively with a consignment shop and have more at risk. Let a word to the wise be sufficient......

RN

[Dave Stoler]

Comission would be tough...Just matching color to an existing piece would be hard (to me)..Heck, in my own home I would find it difficult.
Just the rambleing of a beginner hobbiest , but I think if you have a finished piece and someone wants it it will be much less stressful.
And like mentioned before..Price high and haggle down if necessary..But try to stay consistant so that if customers compare price and piece by chance somwhere down the road there is a consistancy.

[Tim Sproul]

Any ideas what would be a good way to sell an occasional piece of furniture?

A good way to get people to notice your work is to give it away. Make small, finely crafted and finished pieces and give them as gifts during the holidays or for birthdays. Turn some pens. Make some small boxes or pen/pencil holders. Perhaps a small desk organizer with a drawer or two.

Having real items in hand will really impress folks. Pictures are just like a catalog - nice but not compelling. Keep the pictures of your furniture scale work....this will let them all know that they can expect the same craftsmanship in furniture as some receive in gifts.

[Pat Germain]

Very informative thread. I have the luxury of living in an area which hosts numerous tourists in the Summer. It seems Colorado tourists will buy anything featuring an elk or moose. I'm thinking if I can make small projects featuring moose and elk, I just might be able to sell them to some of the local tourist stores. Hmmmm...

[Lewis DeJoseph]

Hi All,

When I worked in a cabinet shop many years ago, we would charge 3 to 4 times the cost of the materials. It seems to me that selling anything for the cost of the materials costs you money in electric, heat, supplies that you might have on hand (glue, nails, screws, whatever), gas money to pickup materials etc...

It was explained to me that the cost doubled covered overhead and the next pricing would be profit.

So twice your cost seems a reasonable place to start from and work up from there

I like the idea of selling some work. Consider fairs of different kinds (state, county, craft, read the paper looking for fundraisers, churches, things of that sort), ebay, craigs list, look into how far you might be willing to travel for a weekend and look into events that far and make a family trip out of it. I used to do these trips just to go to the event, its better if you can make some money doing it.

Good luck

Lewis

[John Lucas]

My first woodworking "job" was an order placed by my Aunt Ruth. She had very expensive house and tastes and showed me a picture of a Pembroke end table and asked if I could make it. I said "sure" and without batting an eye she said, make me two and charge whatever you think is right. This was in '66 or so, so the numbers are vague but I purchased some beautiful mahogany for the table and did a damn fine job, considering I only has a 1935 vintage table saw and a craftsman router. When I delivered them to her she loved them and immediately put them in place in her elegant living room. They did look good there. When alll done, she said "how much?" I was real nervous with the answer but I pulled out a sheet of costs and added hours of labor and the total came to somewhere around $300. She looked at it and wrote me out a check. I didnt look at the check, just folded it and put it in my pocket...relieved that the price "hagling" was over. She asked me to look at the check. It was made out for $5,000. I asked why. She said, look at where I put the tables. There is nothing in that room under $5,000. I want this to be a lesson to you. If you take commissions like this, price the object like the piece of art it is and take into consideration that your client "wants" to pay a good price for the item.
I had a neighbor of hers call me and asked if I would make something for her.. She sent me a picture of the piece and I said yes. I hedged a little on price and asked if I could hold off on making the final estimate. She said just make the piece and then tell me - "your Aunt Ruth said that the Pembroke tables cost $3,000 each so I am sure you price will be right. (yes they just went up 100%)
My point with all this is to consider where the piece will be when delivered...and for whom. No, you dont find that many Aunt Ruths around but they are there.

[Lee Koepke]

No, you dont find that many Aunt Ruths around but they are there. Your Aunt Ruth sounds like an awesome woman. Its rare that you find that kind of character in people. Thanks for sharing that story.

[Michael Gibbons]

Make a few nice pieces that could be used in any type of household decor then take a chance and reserve a spot in a local craft show and see if the stuff sells. Yes, you might not sell anything and there is the cost to rent the space and tables to consider, but you also may sell everything and do relly well. Maybe a couple small tables and jewelry boxes,stuff like that. Do it well in advance of the holidays when folks are looking for gifts. Charge double whatever the wood, glue, screws, hinges, and stain/ finish cost then add 20% for gas and utilities.

[Hank Knight]

If your tools and shop are covered under your homeowners insurance policy, you might void your coverage if you sell your work. Homeowners policies usually have an exclusion for " businesses" or "commercial enterprises" or something of that nature. If you have some disaster, like a fire or a flood, your insurance company could deny coverage for your shop and tools if they learn that you sell your work - even if it's only an occasional piece - on the grounds that your shop is a business or a commercial enterprise. It might be worthwhile to have a chat with your insurance agent to make sure you are on the same page with respect to the coverage for your shop. Better to know now than to be surprised later.

Hank

[Lewis DeJoseph]

Hi,

While Hank is right, you have to start somewhere. If you find that you are selling a few peices a year, you can talk to your insurance company and pick up coverage for little or no change in the cost. The main thing is that you don't have people coming and going. We had an herb farm that we started out of our house and the insurance went up minimally, and that was with people and a petting zoo. The animal thing was the problem then. The following year we dropped the petting zoo and the cost was comparitive to what we had prior.

Lewis


If your tools and shop are covered under your homeowners insurance policy, you might void your coverage if you sell your work. Homeowners policies usually have an exclusion for " businesses" or "commercial enterprises" or something of that nature. If you have some disaster, like a fire or a flood, your insurance company could deny coverage for your shop and tools if they learn that you sell your work - even if it's only an occasional piece - on the grounds that your shop is a business or a commercial enterprise. It might be worthwhile to have a chat with your insurance agent to make sure you are on the same page with respect to the coverage for your shop. Better to know now than to be surprised later.

Hank

[Richard Dragin]

My first woodworking "job" was an order placed by my Aunt Ruth. She had very expensive house and tastes and showed me a picture of a Pembroke end table and asked if I could make it. I said "sure" and without batting an eye she said, make me two and charge whatever you think is right. This was in '66 or so, so the numbers are vague but I purchased some beautiful mahogany for the table and did a damn fine job, considering I only has a 1935 vintage table saw and a craftsman router. When I delivered them to her she loved them and immediately put them in place in her elegant living room. They did look good there. When alll done, she said "how much?" I was real nervous with the answer but I pulled out a sheet of costs and added hours of labor and the total came to somewhere around $300. She looked at it and wrote me out a check. I didnt look at the check, just folded it and put it in my pocket...relieved that the price "hagling" was over. She asked me to look at the check. It was made out for $5,000. I asked why. She said, look at where I put the tables. There is nothing in that room under $5,000. I want this to be a lesson to you. If you take commissions like this, price the object like the piece of art it is and take into consideration that your client "wants" to pay a good price for the item.
I had a neighbor of hers call me and asked if I would make something for her.. She sent me a picture of the piece and I said yes. I hedged a little on price and asked if I could hold off on making the final estimate. She said just make the piece and then tell me - "your Aunt Ruth said that the Pembroke tables cost $3,000 each so I am sure you price will be right. (yes they just went up 100%)
My point with all this is to consider where the piece will be when delivered...and for whom. No, you dont find that many Aunt Ruths around but they are there.

I just underpriced a job and am kicking myself in the butt. It is a small job so it's not a big deal and it is for a good cause but when I gave a quote the customer was surprised and expected it to be a lot more. I knew I just cost myself some well deserved profit but maybe it'll pay off down the road with some more work.

John's lesson is a good one. If you qoute low people will question your quality and they will only value your time and effort if you do. You can't raise the price after a quote but you can always lower it if you want the job.

[Rick Gooden]

I recently had some people ask me to quote closet organization for a 10' x 10' room. Keep in mind that ww is not my profession. Actually a co-worker told them they should talk to me. The folks showed me a closet system they were considering and is was $2000. Because it was pre fab stuff, but nice, it didn't allow for exactly what they were looking for. I told them I thought the $2000 was a little high but I could do what they wanted for $4000. No argument, they agreed and now have the closet they actually wanted and it's a one of a kind design made from real wood. I discovered this many years ago when the owner of a company I was engineering Audio/Video systems for had me go to a client's home with him. A competitor had bid $25,000 for a theater. Tom (the owner) told them that we could do a nice theater for $50,000 and they signed a contract. Incidentally, the theater was significantly better and worth the $50k. We made money and the client was thrilled. I learned a good lesson that day.

[Ellen Benkin]

When I make things for friends we go over the designs and I get their approval. They pay for all the materials (I document the costs) and I expect to be taken out for a "very expensive" dinner. In most cases, where they know the value of the work, they give me more money than the actual cost of materials. I set no time schedule for completion so that I can work at my own speed and do what I want and know that my products have good homes. I'm happy cutting wood and making different items and I don't worry about what I will do with them when I'm finished.