New 8" Jointer Arrived

[John Buzzurro]

Back in December, I posted a thread (http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?t=48430) asking about 8" jointers. Just thought I'd share my final decision. First, I realized quickly that I needed to upgrade my shop wiring, so that was the first task. I now have a subpanel installed, with 3 new 20-amp circuits, one of which is 240V for the jointer.

The Decision Making Process

Next, I needed to decide on a jointer. At first I was leaning toward Delta, since I was already happy with my Delta 6" jointer, but their prices were 2-3 times higher than other brands. The feedback I was getting was to look at Yorkcraft or Grizzly. The prices were appealing, but I kinda liked the idea of buying something local. So I went down to the local tool guy, and learned that he sells ShopFox, which is Grizzly sold under a different brand name. I decided to go with the ShopFox W1741 which is equivalent to the Grizzly G0490 (3hp motor, 76" table, parallelogram beds).

So, for $730 (which included tax + local delivery), the Shopfox was mine. I also knew I'd need a real dust collector for the jointer (the shopvac wasn't going to cut it). So with the money I saved, I bought a Delta AP400 dust collector. While I was at it, I threw in a Delta AP200 air cleaner as well.

Bottom line: for less than the cost of the low-end Delta 8" jointer, I had new wiring, a jointer and sorely needed dust collection.

New Jointer Setup and Opinions

The first obstacle was getting the table lifted onto the cabinet. I thought it was going to be difficult, since the manual suggested doing it with 4 people. I decided to try it with 2 people, and it worked out just fine. Assembly was not bad, but I did have to adjust the height on the outfeed table, and reset the 4 knives.

The motor makes a brief banging sound for a second when turning it on, but runs smoothly otherwise. I had read that this is common on the Grizzlys. I'll probably try playing around with tightening the belt to see if it can be remedied, but I'm not too concerned at this point.

Finally, I ran some QSWO through it, and the jointer handled it effortlessly, with excellent results.

And, here is the pic:

http://home.comcast.net/%7Ejbuzzurr/pics/shopfoxjointer.jpg

(http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?t=48430)

[Ken Fitzgerald]

Congrats on the entire project.....power, dc, ac, and jointer! Report back with a review on that jointer after you've had it for a while!

[Eric Shields]

John,

Congrats on the new acquisition and the upgrades, I'm sure you will be happy with them all.

Eric

[Jim Becker]

That's a beauty, John! Congratulations!

[Jim Fox]

Good to know........I already have a ShopFox Cabinet Saw and 2hp Dust Collector. If I can swing a storage place for a couple months, I am thinking about getting the Powermatic 8" Jointer and the Rikon 18" Bandsaw at the local woodcraft while they are on sale. Just going to be moving somewhere around April and don't wanna double move it.

[Jeffrey Makiel]

That's a handsome lookin' machine!
-Jeff

[glenn bradley]

Thanks for the post John. I'm saving up for an 8" and am really interested in your thoughts after you use the tool for awhile. It looks great. Was the parallelogram bed part of your decision or did other features make it a 'just-so-happens'?

[John Buzzurro]

Thanks for the post John. I'm saving up for an 8" and am really interested in your thoughts after you use the tool for awhile. It looks great. Was the parallelogram bed part of your decision or did other features make it a 'just-so-happens'?
Glenn,

Originally, I didn't care about the parallelogram beds, but when I saw the prices compared to Delta, I decided to go for it.

[David Cramer]

Very nice John! Definitely one of my future purchases. As Ken said, please report back and tell us the pro and cons. I hope it works well for you. Congrads on the new iron!

Dave

[Lars Thomas]

Wow, that's a three or four-way gloat. Nicely done. lars

[Jake Helmboldt]

John, I just bought the same jointer a couple weeks ago. You got a killer price as I paid $100 more with tax, but it was still cheaper than a Grizzly twin, and it comes with a 2-yr warranty. I got a link belt for it today and plan to put it on tomorrow. The "banging" you mention happens upon shutdown for me as the belt hits a harmonic I think. I had it happen on startup, but I added a little tension to the belt and it went away.

I haven't had a chance to use it much, but the only thing I had to do on mine was raise the outfeed table about a 1/32-1/16. The tables are flat as a board (a well jointed board that is). The knives were set perfectly and I get a nice smooth cut.

The only issue I have is that the fence catches in the gap between the carriage support and the table. But after looking at other brands it appears to be a common issue. And the only time it would come into play is sliding it all the way off the table. The fence also has a very minor twist, so I need to measure how bad and check with their tech people to see if it is w/in spec, but it is only visible with an engineers square.

For anyone considering it, I can't imagine paying twice as much for the DJ20. They are virtually identical. There was one sitting next to the SF at the showroom. The SF has the added bonus of a built in mobile base.

Jake

[David Cramer]

The ShopFox W1741 and the Delta DJ20 are almost identical and the ShopFox is nearly 1/2 the price!!! I am a true novice:o and that truely blows me away. I had no idea. I realize from the outside that they have their similarities, but I assumed the DJ20 had to be built like a tank inside to justify the price difference. I am not being sarcastic:rolleyes: in any way. If people know this, why:confused: the heck are they spending all their hard earned dollars on for something that is no better than virtually the same thing at almost 1/2 the price? Is this widely known and people are just brand loyal? Not trying to start anything, just blown away!!!!

Dave

p.s. Yes, I am in the market for one as a future purchase, hence the curiousity.

[Kevin Blunt]

I was actually in the midst of buying one today and i told the salesguy that I wanted to do a bit of research and that I would get back to him by Monday afternoon.I am in Canada and I have stumbled across a very good price on it about 30 mins from where I live. I am very interested in hearing anything about it positive or negative. I really like the aesthetics of it as well. It is a nice looking machine.

I wonder why they only are driving the machine with a single belt given that it is 3hp?

Anything given in the way of tech info or user reviews would be greatly apprecited by me and by the sounds of all the gents that have posted that this is on their wishlists it I am sure they would appreciate it as well.

Congrats on the purchase by the way. What made you decide to purchase this jointer over all the others?

Kevin

[Don Bullock]

John, congratulations!! It's nice to know what you paid compared to other similar machines. Thanks for posting that information. I'm about two years away from being able to buy a jointer and will need all the input I can get to help me make the right decision when I do take that leap. That Shop Fox looks great. The table is very long. How does the table length compare with other 8" jointers?

[John Buzzurro]

Wow, that's a three or four-way gloat. Nicely done. lars
Gloat? What gloat? This was strictly an informational post ;)

[John Buzzurro]

Congrats on the purchase by the way. What made you decide to purchase this jointer over all the others?

Kevin
Kevin, It was a combination of price and the fact that I could purchase it locally.

[John Buzzurro]

The table is very long. How does the table length compare with other 8" jointers?
Don, All of the 8" jointers I was considering had table lengths of around 76".

[Kevin Blunt]

John,

Would the Jointer pass the nickel test once it is running?

[Benjamin Dahl]

John, thanks for the info. I am about to buy an 8" jointer as well and after your posting have found the same model at a decent price. the dealer also has the shop fox with spiral cutter heads (for fair amount more money). From reading reviews in FWW and Wood it seems that the spiral head's main advantage is for highly figured wood. Did your dealer have any impressions about this? Maybe the parallelogram bed helps mitigate tear out.
Thanks,
Ben

[Doug Shepard]

That sure is purdy. That price is pretty sweet too. If you don't mind me asking though: What the heck do you need a fan for in this weather, in your area?:confused:

[John Buzzurro]

From reading reviews in FWW and Wood it seems that the spiral head's main advantage is for highly figured wood. Did your dealer have any impressions about this? Maybe the parallelogram bed helps mitigate tear out.
Thanks,
Ben
Ben, I can't offer any info there - Honestly, I didn't even think about spiral heads.

[John Buzzurro]

If you don't mind me asking though: What the heck do you need a fan for in this weather, in your area?:confused:
Doug, That's the new model X30-G air cleaner I bought.:D Actually, I use the fan to circulate the air when working with Mineral Spirits, etc. :)

[Jeffrey Schronce]

I have had the exact same machine for about a year. I purchased mine from a Amish SF dealer in Lancaster county (PA) for $650 (w/o sales tax and picked up at his location). I had to wait about a month for him to get it as it was pretty new at the time. I *think* with SF your price from the retailer will depend on whether or not you can wait on delivery. It was higher if I wanted it within a few days and $650 if I could wait a few weeks when the normal monthly shipment came in.
I have what I would call a minor jolt on start up and a "shudder" for about 2 seconds during part of the turning off process. I have not tried to adjust the belt or replace with link belt. I will likely do that in the Spring. I think one poster said it happended with the belt off, but I don't see how that could happen???
Over all it a great unit. I check the fence for squareness to the table before every final pass. On occasion I have to adjust a small amount howver I don't know if that is common with dovetail way fitted fences or not. Seems Yorkcrafts rack and pinion fence may have a small advantage on the fence.
Ben, I don't think the parallelogram beds will come close to making up any quality in cut versus spiral or indexed cutter heads. If I was to get a replacement cutter head it would be Byrd indexed not spiral knives. Not much of a price difference.

[Benjamin Dahl]

thanks Jeff and John. Jeff, have you been pretty happy with the quality of the cuts? I am not sure that I need the Shelix head right away, it is just something that has been addressed in recent reviews and not something I have ever handled. I do like the idea of an 8" jointer for around $700 but don't like making an expensive purchase that I will not be happy with. The SF does look like it is put together well and I don't mind a little bit of work to get it going. thanks for the input.
Ben

[glenn bradley]

I'm in the indexed cutter head quandary myself. $300-plus more . . . Hmmmmm. Just how much do I hate aligning those knives? The jury is still out. Fortunately my piggy bank isn't quite ready for the decision yet.

[jim gossage]

I'm in the indexed cutter head quandary myself. $300-plus more . . . Hmmmmm. Just how much do I hate aligning those knives? The jury is still out. Fortunately my piggy bank isn't quite ready for the decision yet.[/quote]

i recently bought a yorkcraft 8" jointer with spiral cutterhead. the cutter was an extra $400 or so, but well worth it. it cuts smoothly and with almost no noise, though feed pressure is a little greater. some people have complained about ridges with spiral heads, but from what i see they are detectable only with a mag lens (<0.002"). considering the cost of replacing/sharpening straight blades, the durability of carbide inserts, and never having to align blades again (took me >2 hr on my old machine), this was a worthwhile purchase - as long as you have the bucks!

[D.McDonnel "Mac"]

From the looks of it the upper cast iron jointer part of the SF looks identical to my DJ20. This is something I also noticed about the Steel City unit at the last WW show I was at. I know Delta moved the production of the that part (as opposed to the motor and base unit which remained in the US) several years ago. It was orogonally made in Brazil I do believe by a company named Invicta. Has the pattents run out on it or something? The Tiawaneese company making the Delta part selling it to anyone now?

The parallelagram design is great but it was always a premium cost option. It looks like it can be had much cheaper now.

[glenn bradley]

Not to hijack but, Thanks Jim. That's good info from a real world experience. I'll take that over marketing fluff any day.

[Jake Helmboldt]

John, I posted part of this on a general SF thread, but in specific reference to the W1741 I'll pass this along:

NOTE: If you are thinking about putting a link belt on the 1741 (and probably a DJ20) there are a couple problems you will run into. I just tried doing so yesterday.

1. Link belts sit higher in the groove of the sheave so there is not enough clearance between the belt housing/guard (it will rub).
2. The fence carriage mount has two bolt holes that are not symetrical (one is closer to the belt). The washer on this bolt must be ground down so that the belt doesn't rub against it.

Even witht the link belt there is still a bit of slap and shudder, but it does run smoother. A higher quality v-belt might be a better solution since it will fit without mods to the belt shroud.

As for other's questions about cut quality, I also had mentioned that I ran a long piece of birds eye maple through yesterday with virtually no tearout on the standard 4-blade head.

[Kevin Blunt]

John,

I hav e afew questions about your jointer if you wouldn't mind. For waht it is worth I decided to purchase one of these as well based on the research that I have done.

Just a couple of things I would like to ask you.

1) what gauge is the power cord that came with your jointer? Apparently the first production models came with 16 gauge but since then it has been upgraded to 12 gauge according to some. What does yours have?

2) Was the motor mounted to the Motor Mount brackets or the actual base when packaged for shipment? Again, in th eearly models the motor was installed on the actual motor mounts and caused some owners to have to deal with bent motor mounts due to shipping.

3) Do you know if your jointer has the revamped mobile base wheel which apparently allows it to roll around a little easier?

Sorry to bother you with these questions but would appreciate you helping me out.

[Jake Helmboldt]

Kevin, in lieu of John answering, I just got mine a couple weeks ago so I'll chime in.

1. the cord is 12AWG.
2. the motor is now shipped bolted to the inside of the top of the base, not to the mounts. This is to consolidate packing, but to address the bent mounts apparently.
3. I don't know if the caster is changed. It is a steel wheel w/ beveled edges. My garage floor is rough concrete and mobile bases don't roll well on it. The jointer does better than my contrator saw with the retractable casters, albeit it is bumpy.

Jake

[Bob Michaels]

Nice score John. I'm sure you'll love it.

[Jim Dunn]

A beautiful piece of equipment for sure. Congrats on the new planer.

[Kevin Blunt]

Kevin, in lieu of John answering, I just got mine a couple weeks ago so I'll chime in.

1. the cord is 12AWG.
2. the motor is now shipped bolted to the inside of the top of the base, not to the mounts. This is to consolidate packing, but to address the bent mounts apparently.
3. I don't know if the caster is changed. It is a steel wheel w/ beveled edges. My garage floor is rough concrete and mobile bases don't roll well on it. The jointer does better than my contrator saw with the retractable casters, albeit it is bumpy.

Jake


Thanks Jake. I am hoping that I get "New Stock" when the item arrives so that it will be 12 gauge. Worst comes to worst I will just have to change the wire. About the castor wheel. I don't believe the castor wheel has been changed, but the metal foot lever has a ifferemnt pivot point than the originals which in the old ones caused the wheel to sink underneath the foot lever too much and not allow it to roll as easily. If yours has the other corrections I am sure that you also have the updated wheel. Thanks again for the update.

Kevin

[Kevin Blunt]

Thanks Jake. I am hoping that I get "New Stock" when the item arrives so that it will be 12 gauge. Worst comes to worst I will just have to change the wire. About the castor wheel. I don't believe the castor wheel has been changed, but the metal foot lever has a ifferemnt pivot point than the originals which in the old ones caused the wheel to sink underneath the foot lever too much and not allow it to roll as easily. If yours has the other corrections I am sure that you also have the updated wheel. Thanks again for the update.

Kevin

Correct me on that. I believe the updated mobile base wheel has been installed a little further back on the foot lever which in turn keeps it a little further away from the jointer and a little easier to work with. Or so I hear.

[John Buzzurro]

John,

I hav e afew questions about your jointer if you wouldn't mind. For waht it is worth I decided to purchase one of these as well based on the research that I have done.

Just a couple of things I would like to ask you.

1) what gauge is the power cord that came with your jointer? Apparently the first production models came with 16 gauge but since then it has been upgraded to 12 gauge according to some. What does yours have?

2) Was the motor mounted to the Motor Mount brackets or the actual base when packaged for shipment? Again, in th eearly models the motor was installed on the actual motor mounts and caused some owners to have to deal with bent motor mounts due to shipping.

3) Do you know if your jointer has the revamped mobile base wheel which apparently allows it to roll around a little easier?

Sorry to bother you with these questions but would appreciate you helping me out.
Kevin,

1) The gauge of the power cord is 12.
2) The motor was mounted to the base, and I had to remove it from there and onto the motor mount. SF shipped a 1-page addendum to the manual explaining this.
3) I'm not sure what version of the mobile base wheel I have, but I did not have any trouble wheeling it around.

[Stan Mijal]

Good to know........I already have a ShopFox Cabinet Saw and 2hp Dust Collector. If I can swing a storage place for a couple months, I am thinking about getting the Powermatic 8" Jointer and the Rikon 18" Bandsaw at the local woodcraft while they are on sale. Just going to be moving somewhere around April and don't wanna double move it.

Jim,

Where is a local Shop Fox distributor in your area? I'm in the Detroit area, and its always good to know where I can spend some $$ !

[Kevin Blunt]

Thanks John!

[Tim Kennedy-NH]

John,

Thanks for the great info!

I recently ordered the same jointer, and just got the call from my local (~1hr drive) dealer that it is ready for pickup. Here's my question: how big are the shipping crates? I'm planning on going to get it in my pickup truck, but I'm not sure my bed's wide enoguh to handle both boxes side-by-side between the wheel wells. I know I'll have a little over-hang at the tailgate, it's only a 6 ft bed.

Also, you said that lifting the table onto the base "it worked out just fine" with two people. How easy/difficult was it, really? I'm trying to decide between borrowing an engine hoist or just getting my father to help with the heavy lifting.

Thanks,

Tim.

[Terry Bigelow]

Tim, I have the same jointer and I picked it up in my truck(Dodge 1500) with room to spare. The jointer bed crate was long though and I had to drive with the tailgate down. As for ease of assembly, I first removed the base and uncrated it, then set it under my tailgate. I then uncrated the bed and had someone help my slide it onto the base. Pretty easy! Then I wheeled her into the shop and finished assembly. She was up and running in about an hour!

[Evan Authier]

Sorry to hijack, but Kevin, you said you found this jointer near you. Was this a dealer or a private sale. If it was a dealer, can you let me in on the secret?

Thanks,
Evan

[Matt Day]

Directly from SF, the sizes of the two crates are:
81x25x12
38x20x28

Mine arrived at the shipping depot this morning, and I'll pick it up this afternoon. Got it shipped and tax included for $700!

[John Buzzurro]

Tim,

Sounds like Matt answered your question on the crate size. The table is crated, and the base w/motor is packed in a cardboard box. In my case, it was delivered in a van, and it took 3 people to get the the 2 packages off the van and into my shop.

As for lifting the table onto the base, I had no problem at all with 2 people. I routinely lift my DW735 planer onto a temporary work table by myself. The planer weighs 92 lbs. If you can do something equivalent to that, you should have no problem.

[Tim Kennedy-NH]

Thanks John and Matt & Terry. I'll be picking it up tomorrow, with my Dad to help me get it off the truck. I'll let you know how it turns out.

Tim.

[Tim Kennedy-NH]

Thanks all for the info. My father and I had no trouble at all getting the table off the truck and onto the stand. The manual says that the whole machine weighs 510 lbs, but I don't see how. It just doesn't seem all that heavy.

The most difficult part of the whole setup was getting the motor and the cutter head pullys aligned. That was a pain. The first try was less than successful, and I had a huge SLAP when the motor first started, followed by too much vibration. Much fiddling later, and things are mostly quiet. I'll tweak it more when I get the link belt for it.

Thanks again for the help,

Tim.