Consumer Reports of Woodworking?

[Marc Prudhomme]

Hi guys,
Is there a web site out there that rates all woodworking power tools?I have consumer reports online but unfortunately it doesnt rate alot of woodworking tools.Anyone have any sites?
Marc

[John Shuk]

I'd say that if you hang around the forums long enough you get a good sense. As far as product testing goes I (my opinion) would say WOOD Magazine is the most scientifically supportable source as far as cosistency goes. I like Fine WoodWorking but I think the tests often are done by different authors and the "controls" aren't always as consistent. There are exceptions but this is what I have come to believe. I don't think you will find a source for WW'ing tools like CS since the market just isn't that broad and funding would be an issue.

[Marc Prudhomme]

I'd say that if you hang around the forums long enough you get a good sense. As far as product testing goes I (my opinion) would say WOOD Magazine is the most scientifically supportable source as far as cosistency goes. I like Fine WoodWorking but I think the tests often are done by different authors and the "controls" aren't always as consistent. There are exceptions but this is what I have come to believe. I don't think you will find a source for WW'ing tools like CS since the market just isn't that broad and funding would be an issue.

I agree that the woodworking magazines are good at rating the tools.I have a ton of them at the house but they are all outdated.

[Lee Schierer]

The only problem with woodworking magazine ratings of tools is that they never say anything bad about tools from the companies that advertise with their magazine. Still it does give you an idea of how they compare, just try to read the reviews in several different magazines to see how the tools fared.

[Lloyd McKinlay]

All to be taken for what they are--opinions; and in some cases almost promotional material. I often start my research on these sites and finish by asking the advice of the Sawmill Creek community.

http://www.toolsofthetrade.net/

http://www.woodworking2.org/toolpage.htm

http://plansnow.com/toolreviews.html

http://www.onlinetoolreviews.com/toolreviewindex.htm

[Larry Crim]

I agree with John IRT the forums, I find more useful information here and on other sites using the search or just asking for opinions than I ever could using the WW mags, The best thing is you have users here that are using the tools in pretty much the same enviroment as I do, the home shop. I am not discounting the mags but like above I think they may might be less willing to discount a tools ability or point out a shortfall when the manufacturer is a advertiser in the mag.

[glenn bradley]

Remember that large grain of salt from magazines that have advertisements and also rate tools. Even if they don't openly advertise for Powermatic (example) there can be influences. Several mags are solely subscription supported. That being said, forum with posts of real-world experience may not post every tiny detail for comparison but, you get a good feel for a tool after some use. ;-)

[Pete Brown]

IMHO, the biggest problem with woodworking magazine ratings is that they rarely or never rate long-term usage. Even the car magazines and sites will tell you how a car fared after its long-term road tests.

For example, the DeWalt DW735 consistently did very well in the woodworking magazines. However, they never tested knife life over time, or more importantly, ran across the very common gear breakage issues that that that planer had early on.

Many tools are great at first, but don't hold up over time. You'll only learn that on places like here or other groups, by talking to folks who have been using them for a while.

As a final note, Consumer Reports has consistently been one of the worst and most biased places to look for consumer product advice. I'd take anything they saw with a salt-block-sized grain of salt :)

[Jesse Thornton]

Hi guys,
Is there a web site out there that rates all woodworking power tools?
You're staring at it!

[Dewayne Reding]

The advertising factor really does appear to add bias. It would be suicide for them to start trashing Delta-Skil or BD for example. Rather than rating tools Excellent,Fair and Poor. They seem to use Great- Really Great- and Really Super Great. Personally, I try to stay away from the stuff that is only great. :) You can kind of read between the lines. If they mention a problem area, you can bet it's usually worse than they describe.

[Larry Rasmussen]

I just posted this on a thread in which someone looking at planers inquired about the fit of the dust hood and whether it allowed the outfeed table to still fold up. Mine doesn't but I knew about it at before buying the thing after reading it on the amazon rating section for the tool. I didn't know about it by reading the several magazine articles rating cut, snipe and so on. The info is a balance to the magazine articles in that it is often written by first time users, some who appear to be pretty tempermental so a different grain of salt is useful there. It's luck of the draw on whether a certain tool is for sale or reviewed on Amazon but worth the single minute it takes to zoom over to do a check, especially if forum info is skimpy.
Larry

[Kelly C. Hanna]

I agree with Lee. I never take the magazines word for it alone. I always ask other w/w's for their experience when I don't know about a certain tool.

[Jesse Thornton]

While a lot of good info can be gleaned from the reviews on Amazon, it should be kept in mind they they also have a vested interest in positive reviews. I've read a few articles like this one:
http://www.llywelyn.net/docs/mine/amazon.html
While the evidence against them is purely anecdotal, it does stand to reason that they might be a lot more diligent in scouring the negative reviews for policy infractions than the positive ones. At least when you ask Creekers about a particular tool you can be pretty confident that the same posting rules will apply to the whole range of opinions. You'll also get more timely, and time-tested, reviews by asking here. I bet quite a few of Amazon's reviews are written when people want to share their initial exitement about a tool they've just bought, but not nesseccarily followed up on after they've been using it for a year or two.

Not to knock amazon as a resource - I use it myself, but I think posting on a completely non-commercial forum like this one will provide a far more reliable array of opinions.

[skip coyne]

fine woodworking/home building publishes a annual guide to tools , they do tell you how they tested and they give user ratings along with the reviewers recommendations

while I wouldn't buy solely on it it does provide one resource . off course again I'm sure advertising dollars plays a part

[Jake Helmboldt]

I think their's are actually the best. They don't subscribe to the great, greater, greatest like some others. Some mags are more just a listing of features and don't get into any kind of real review of the tools.

FWW makes a point of reporting quantifiable things like table flatness and alignment. Their 8" jointer review from a year or so ago had all the subjective stuff in addition to the QC type issues, which is what I want to know about. While not perfect I think they are about the best. WOOD doesn't have as much of the quantifiable elements, but are better than some of the other mags.

I think sites like this and others are your best resource to solicit feedback on first-hand experience from actual woodworkers.

Jake

[Larry Rasmussen]

Interesting Jessie, I don't doubt the likely veracity of the guy that had his reviews pulled. He did ask the million dollar question- how would Amazon have the time and money to micro manage the deletion of the reviews? Anyhow, I do agree that review and follow up comments on a site like this are the clear preference for product info.

[thomas prevost]

If the ratings in the woodworking mag are accurate and unbiased, why for example-cabinet 10" 3hp saw? --MAG A the best is Unisaw, Mag B= Powermatic, Mag C=General, Mag D=Sawstop? Each mag does the same reviews over and over about 18 mo. apart. Why one time Unisaw and the next reveiw has Grizzly in the same mag.? Not much changes on most tool lines.

[Jake Helmboldt]

If the ratings in the woodworking mag are accurate and unbiased, why for example-cabinet 10" 3hp saw? --MAG A the best is Unisaw, Mag B= Powermatic, Mag C=General, Mag D=Sawstop? Each mag does the same reviews over and over about 18 mo. apart.

A lot of it goes back to what they use as their criteria for reviewing the tools. I think those like FWW that use measurable criteria are more consistent than those that simply have an opinion.

Here is an example: Woodworker's Journal rated the Ridgid contractor saw as the best a year or so ago. And yet they noted that the fence is medicore at best. It has an integrated mobile base. BFD. So instead of buying a $60 mobile base you have to buy a $200-$300 fence to be in leauge with the other saws reviewed. The other things that made it "stand out from the pack"? Built in stowage for the mitre gauge and a saw blade. It would be analagous to Road & Track saying they picked the top supercar based on its great rearview mirror visibility and comfortable seats.

No mention of table flatness, arbor runout, trunnion alignment, etc. FWW on the other hand measures all those types of things, whether it is a cabinet saw or a hand plane. And while I always do my own homework it is nice to know that someone is looking beyond the superficial issues when reviewing these things that we spend a lot of money on.

JH

[Gary Keedwell]

IMHO, the biggest problem with woodworking magazine ratings is that they rarely or never rate long-term usage. Even the car magazines and sites will tell you how a car fared after its long-term road tests.

For example, the DeWalt DW735 consistently did very well in the woodworking magazines. However, they never tested knife life over time, or more importantly, ran across the very common gear breakage issues that that that planer had early on.

Many tools are great at first, but don't hold up over time. You'll only learn that on places like here or other groups, by talking to folks who have been using them for a while.

As a final note, Consumer Reports has consistently been one of the worst and most biased places to look for consumer product advice. I'd take anything they saw with a salt-block-sized grain of salt :)
I beg to differ with you on your Consumer Report digger. That mag does not take consumer product money nor does it allow advertising in the mag. I t has saved me a big bundle of money from vehicles to exercise equipment. It is one of the biggest reasons that American cars have improved over the years, too. They took the heat and told the truth about the junk Detroit was hawking on unsuspecting consumers.

Gary K.

[Adam Bauer]

Really you can never find a one-stop shop for reviews like this. They both have good and bad points. For the magazines liske somebody said they are usually testing brand new items and for usually no more than a week. Even the biggest piece of junk can usually last a week. However the advantage to the magazines is that they are usually not biased. Messageboards are good in that you can usually find numerous people who have the tool and have been using it for an extended amount of time. However, I've found people on boards to be VERY biased. And usually the people with the biggest bias are the people "who know a neighbor who's girlfriends brother had one of those and it was a piece of crap" and have never actually owned the item in question itself.

So really what you need to do is what you probably don't want to hear. look in at least two different magazines review sections if possible and check more than one message board as well and if possible try to get them from different diciplines if possible (ex.. a general woodworking and a specific one too (woodturning, cabinetmaking)) this will allow for you to get the best feel for the tool by being able to compare from different opinions so bias is removed or at least reduced.