Shopping list help

[Kerry Wright]

First I must say this is a great forum. Thank you for allowing me to be a part of it.

Well after many years of dreaming about it, I'm finally getting to build my shop. After it's built I should have 10 to 12K left over to to "furnish" it :D. My first priority was a good dust collection system, my choice was a Clear-Vue Cyclone running 6 inch lines. This I have already ordered.

Now for the questions, taking into account my available funds, what tools (make, models, and order of precedence) would you recommend I purchase. My skill level would be probablly be considered advanced beginner or intermediate, mainly because it has been quite some time since doing anything serious and I'm out of practice.

Here is my potential shopping list:
Table Saw
Jointer
Router and good table or Shaper
Band Saw
Scroll Saw
Plainer
Drill Press (I have a small table top but am looking at a full size)
Drum Sander

Anything else I may have forgotten? :confused:

Now what are your recommendations?

Thank you for any and all inputs
Kerry

[Pat Zabinski]

Kerry,

I think the answers you get will depend on the projects you're hoping to build. That said, I'll offer a few ideas on my wish list.

* Compound miter box
* Pocket-screw jig/tool
* Various hand tools
Cordless drill(s)
Biscuit jointer
Random orbital sander(s)
Belt sander

[Steve Kohn]

Also suggest clamps (K-body or equivalent), some method of sharpening tools, hand chisels and planes, circular saw and some sort of straight edge to break down sheets of plywood, air filter (purchased or homemade), and the list goes on and on and on.

I have found that the more skilled I get (skilled being a relative word), and the more complex projects I attempt, the more tools I need. And the more costly the tools are.

With $10-12K budget, you should be able to put together a pretty complete shop capable of doing most projects.

[Kerry Wright]

Pat and Steve, thank you for the quick replies. I guess I wasn't all that clear on what I need (and already have).

As for hand tools I'm pretty much good to go. I have a skill saw, jig saw, biscuit jointer, various hand sanders, drill motors, etc. Clamps.... well you never have enough clamps;). Hand tools galore!!! But now that I have an official shop it's time for the serious tools. The ones that until now I didn't have the room for.

So what I really need is your recommendations on what (including make and model suggestions) to buy. My proposed shopping list is just that, proposed. I know I will need a table saw and would like a radial arm saw along with everything else that is listed. What I want from the experts (you) is sort of guide to what I really need. If you don't think I will have much use for a Radial Arm and think a miter saw will work better, say so.

My projects will be both large and small (Entertainment Centers to Jewlery Boxs). This shop will be the foundation of my retirement (not for a number of years at the present rate) lifestyle, so I want to do it right.

So, what are your thoughts?

[Ken Shoemaker]

Kerry,
A year ago I did something similar to what your doing now. Trust me, spend your money on a couple of Good woodworking classes before you go hogwild furnishing a shop. I wish I'd have done it first. I'd suspect that they will help you focus on what tools, and the quality of those you purchase should be.

There are several members in the creek who own/run quality schools and should be a great help. I know I'll e attending one very soon.

Just a thought... Ken

[Jim Becker]

Kerry, stick with the basics for now and buy good stuff. (the most expensive tools are the ones you need to replace early and often) Table saw, jointer, planer and router should be at the top of your list as they are the heart of the woodworking shop for most folks. The latter might best be a 12 amp multi-base router kit (I like the Dewalt 618, but there are a number of good ones out there)

For jointer and planer, I believe in wider is better relative to the former. 8" minimum, but there are some nice options at 10" and 12" now from manufacturers like Grizzly and Oliver if you want to make the investment. I'd even suggest that putting the money into the wider jointer and using a 13" "lunch box" planer isn't a horrible idea, frankly. Flat, straight and square trumps "fast" when it comes to processing lumber.

Table saw...go 3hp cabinet saw based on your available budget. Lot's of choices from value machines from Grizzly and Bridgewood up to the PM2000 and SawStop. And don't forget used in this space...there are folks like me who occasionally make decisions to step up to Euro sliders from a cabinet saw and others who offer great vintage machines. And, of course, some folks who either decide to downsize or get out of the activity or have to sell for personal financial reasons.

Forget the radial arm saw. Buy a decent CMS or SCMS for breaking down lumber and other similar cuts. If you want to be able to cross cut wider, but long boards that would be uncomfortable to work on the table saw, a guide for your circular saw is a good solution. If someday you decide you really want a RAS, buy an old Dewalt or one of the machines from Original Saw company. The RAS available "new" these days are pretty lame and really have been superceded by other tools.

Drill press isn't something that gets use a lot in most woodworking shops, so don't make it a priority. When and if you do buy, make sure it can handle a slow speed at the low end of 200-300 rpm tops and make sure it has a nice long throw. (drilling depth...you want close to 4" or more if you can get it) DPs are something you can actually economize on with no-name or "house brand" tools.

Drum sanders are also something most folks buy later on when they find they actually need them. I bought mine (Performax 22-44 Plus) after woodworking for a number of years and it really only gets used when I'm working with slabs. I don't run other things through it in most cases.

Scroll saws are specialty tools. They generally get used for specific kinds of projects...often stand-alone projects. Therefore, it also shouldn't be on the priority list, IMHO, unless you really have a hankering for scrolling. You can also usually find nice ones used.

[glenn bradley]

If I walked into Tools-r-Us and just fired off . . . .
- DC, you've already got covered
- Safety gear; ear plugs. mask, Rx goggles, featherboards, push blocks, etc., etc.
- Saw Stop table saw with router table extension and a Woodpecker PRL loaded with a Milwaukee 5625.
- MM16 bandsaw
- Grizzly G0593 8" jointer
- Grizzly G1021z planer or equivalent
- Delta 20-950 drill press
- Large belt or drum sander (haven't decided on my dream here yet)
- Bosch 4410L Miter saw
- Decent HVLP sprayer and an area to use it (temporary tarp walls work for me)

This is not a crazy, money is no object list. These are machines I would get myself and feel are reasonable for upper end hobbies type stuff like I do. I'd go on but sooo many will give you soooo many ideas here. Let the games begin!

Oh yeah, a 'just over the requirement' amount of T-8 lighting and a decent little sound system.

You have the marvelous opportunity to NOT buy the "almost good enough" tool and have to go back (very expensive way to go). Enjoy the ride ;-)

[Don Bullock]

I'm in the process of doing the same thing, but my retirement is a little closer. I have to finish this school year and one more.:D

The posts so far are all excellent. I'd also suggest reading as many magazines and books as possible. There are many books and articles on setting up a shop as well as reviews on many different tools. I've found many good ideas for some projects that I'd like to do. Having the tools necessary for those projects has become a priority for me. The magazines and books have also helped me decide which tools I need first. Some magazines have websites where you can read past articles and even see videos. You might also watch for sales. Sometimes you'll find a deal like the one I got on a SCMS on Amazon that is hard to turn down. There is always, as Jim said, the used market. Some have found good deals on Craigslist in their local areas. I haven't tried that direction yet. There is also eBay. While I have bought many things off of eBay, I must admit that I haven't bought tools there yet. I wish I could help you with makes and models, but I'm not experienced enough for that. I'd suggest that you do a search for a particular type of tool and read the posts. I wish you the best and will be watching for posts from you. Perhaps you'll find something that I have missed.

[Kerry Wright]

Thank you all for the great suggestions. Some refresher classes are on my list, just need to find them. The tool suggestions were just what I was looking for. I hadn't considered an SCMS, but after doing some reading, it's now one of the top five. I had planned on a Jet or Grizzly cabinet TS but now that my wife has seen the Saw Stop hot dog video:eek:, I don't have a choice. It's almost twice what I had planned on spending for the TS, but I'm sure I'll be happy with it. What do you think about getting an Incra fence instead of the one Saw Stop sells?

Thanks again for the inputs!

[Nancy Laird]

Kerry, you forgot the lathe!! Into the vortex........

Nancy

[Paul Greathouse]

Kerry

Welcome to the creek. Do yourself a favor and take a look in the "Manufacturers Forum" for Eurekazone (EZ Smart System). This is one of the best and most versitile guide systems there is. It works equally well with a circular saw as it does with a router.

It can do things for you just as good as a tablesaw and is much safer. It will also give glue-edge quality cuts with your circular saw that were once only possible with a jointer. It really excels at breaking down sheet goods and it will put a straight edge on solid stock lumber. With the router attachement it can do dadoing, fluting and many other routing tasks.

Burt Wadell regularly posts on the EZsmart forum. Burt operates a production cabinet shop and uses this equipment on a daily basis. There are also several finish carpenters and also hobbiest that are very happy with the EZ system.

You can also check out their website Eurekazone.org for more details and to view the system. It is reasonably priced, very well made and they have great customer service. If you call the number on the website you will probably be speaking to the owner/inventer Dino.

After seeing what the system can do, you may decide not to purchase some of those expensive high end tools in your original list. I am in much the same position as you. I just built a new shop and want to set it up as an extra income retirement cabinet shop. I was about to buy most of the same stuff you have listed but now I am reconsidering some of my original ideas, after purchasing and using the EZsmart system.

Check it out and see if its for you.

[Don Bullock]

...I had planned on a Jet or Grizzly cabinet TS but now that my wife has seen the Saw Stop hot dog video:eek:, I don't have a choice. It's almost twice what I had planned on spending for the TS, but I'm sure I'll be happy with it...

Maybe I need to show my wife the video too.;) :D Yes, you will be happy with it.

[Gary Herrmann]

Definitely consider an 8" or wider jointer. I have a 6" PM. Good jointer, but limited. My next large purchases will be upgrading to a wider jointer and a floor model planer (currently have lunch box).

You can make due with a small, inexpensive table saw, but a cabinet saw makes life much simpler. I made my first several pieces of furniture using a Dewalt benchtop saw. It can be done, but...

I also did without a SCMS for a number of years and now I wonder why I waited. Same for a drill press.

If I had to put them in order, I think I'd go with:

Tablesaw
8"+ jointer
15"+ planer
Bandsaw
Router + table (I put this here because a router and a fence will get you pretty far)
SCMS
Drill Press

Scroll saw and drum sander depends on the type of work you do

[Bob Michaels]

[quote=Paul Greathouse]Kerry

Do yourself a favor and take a look in the "Manufacturers Forum" for Eurekazone (EZ Smart System). This is one of the best and most versitile guide systems there is.



Hmmmm, Paid Political Announcement ???

[Mike Heidrick]

What do you think about getting an Incra fence instead of the one Saw Stop sells?

Thanks again for the inputs!

first off you are goingto absolutely love the Sawstop. No doubt about that. Now to the Incra question. I am a new owner to both of these - Sawstop Bies clone on the saw and LS Pro setup on the router. I am thinking the Incra might be the answer here had I done it a second time. I love the sawstop fence and I tell you it is the smoothest fence I have ever used. But the Incra is absolutely slick. The only reason I like the Bies is that it seems so much heavier and more substantial - no substitute for steel. Not sure how I would feel about putting a 4X8 sheet into the incra but as far as wow features the Incra sure has some crazy precision. You could even put your router table into the saw and use the Incra fence there and save you the cost of the fence for the router table. Either way you wil have one slick setup.

That EZ system is nice too. I do not own one, I would not give up my TS for one, I would not spend a grand on one, but they sure are pretty neat to see in action. I think a 10' straight edge with a carriage system would work just as well for me. That or find a panel saw used for a grand and invest in it. Shopnotes even made one that a router could attach to.

Jointers! Get a 12" Griz or York or Oliver. I have a 6" Jet, it is nice, but now I want a 12" jointer BAD!! Got a deal on mine so no loss in turning it over but I should have done the homework on this tool.

Save some money for wood. It easily costs more than the tools.

[Paul Greathouse]

Hmmmm, Paid Political Announcement ???[/quote]

No Bob, there is no financial incentive whatsoever on my part. I was merely trying to relay to Kerry the benefits that I have found in my use of the EZ system for the past year that I have owned it.

I also stated at the end of my post "check it out and see if its for you". If my post sounded too enthusiastic, it's because I believe that I have truely found a better way to do many of the woodworking tasks that I do.

I still have the same Delta tablesaw that I have owned for the last 17 years and I don't plan on getting rid of it but the EZ system has taken over alot of the tasks that it used to perform and in my particular situation, does them better and safer.

I work mostly with 1 1/2" and less thickness materials. Between the EZ system and my homemade "Jointability" (google jointablility, you'll see what I mean, and no, they don't pay me either) jointer I see no reason for me to purchase a high end jointer at this point in time. But thats just me, everyone has different needs and desires.

Bob, I hope that you continue to enjoy woodworking with whatever tools you choose to use and please share with us, the benefits of them, so that we can all make more informed decisions about future tool purchases.

I would like to thank those that have posted other tool suggestions to this thread, you have all presented great ideas that will help me in the future.

[John Russell]

I have spent the last couple of years buying machines for a garage shop -- don't regret any of the purchases. I did some windowshopping over Christmas for a Felder 500 series combo machine and a Minimax Cu300. If I had it to do all over again I would be very tempted to take this route ... space efficient, larger planer and jointer, shaper, and a sliding saw.

[Neil Bosdet]

I like most of the posts on this subject and I usually don't bother to add any thoughts of my own on this common subject as it always well covered but I must point out what I consider to be a large oversight... Air compressor. It's one of my favorite items in my shop. I actually have 2. A little one for onsight jobs away from my shop and my big one that's plumbed all over my shop. Get at least a 60 gallon upright with as many CFM's as you can afford along with the rest of the tools on the list. I love air tools and would never be without them. Spray guns, die grinders, impact wrenches and sanders need big volumes of air that little compressors can't handle. This is a must in my shop.

Happy New Year.

Neil

[glenn bradley]

Just sounds like a satisfied customer to me. I'd sure use one if I had one but my piggy bank is reserved for a jointer upgrade.