Laserbuzz Items - Stain Before or After?

[Bill Stein]

I've been doing Laserbuzz wall tributes for a few months. Following Buzz's video tips and hints, I've always cut first and then stained which made sense since I was using two different colors of stain.

But now I have an order for about 200 wall tributes and the customer wants all of the pieces to be stained one color -- Early American. So I'm wondering if it would be better to stain the board and then cut the pieces. Or, if you recommend cutting first, can I leave the pieces "assembled" after cutting and stain all three pieces in one fell swoop which I think will cut down on the time required but, more importantly, cut down the space required to stain and dry. But, of course, then the edges don't get any stain which I don't see as a problem as they come out of the laser a nice dark brown anyway. But will the stain "glue" the pieces together if I don't seperate them?

I wasn't a woodworker before I started doing the LaserBuzz stuff (and I'm still not! :( ) so I don't have any idea about the best way to stain, etc. so I'm depending on your help to lead me in the right direction.

Which brings up another question. Brush, spray cans, or rag to apply the MinWax stain? Up to now, I've used the spray cans and I like them. On this job, speed is more important than the cost of the stain so I don't mind paying for the spray cans if that is the best way to go. I'm probably not ready to invest in a spray rig and go through the learning curve just for this job.

Thanks,
Bill

p.s. Buzz, feel free to join in!

[John Esberg]

Howdy!

I'd buy a cans of the liquid stains and load up rags. Wipe the boards down. It and even.

I've used this technique for making stands and other items in bulk. Works like a champ.

Have fun!

DAK

[John Esberg]

Oh, and congrats on the 200 piece order!

DAK

[Ray Mighells]

Congrats on the big job. Staining before cutting will also help to prevent stain from getting on the back and create gluing problems. Should be allowed to dry without touching each other and creating spots or smudges. Good luck.

[Michael Kowalczyk]

Bill Congrats on the big order also. Which tribute gets the honor of being cut out 200 times?

Are you planning on having the background stained to match instead of painting them a color to contrast?

I have done it with the spray cans from Wallyworld, The big orange box store and my local Sears hardware to try out each for short runs and I use a dip and wipe for our production runs. When we spray a clearcoat, we use an HVLP spray gun on a sheet of ply covered with cardboard.

We manufacture displays as our core business so we get to use them as drying racks also. You could make something like a plate rail or kitchen plate drying rack or run down to the dollar store and buy one but they must be wiped down well if you stand them verticle.

Here is a picture of an old prototype that may give you some ideas.
Or you can make one Like Tom has in his video. I have a bunch around my office and shop for storage that I designed years ago but they also work great for sorting out periodical/trade magazines. i'll see if I can find a picture of it later.

If you want to talk in more detail just PM me your phone # and I'll call you.

Thanks,
Michael

[Carol VanArnam]

Bill- I'm a wood worker and let me tell you this.....

You always have to sand after you vector cut, right? If you stain then vector cut you have to be willing to accept the "stains" on the wood from vector cutting and hope your wood stain color will cover up the burn marks. If you stain the wood then spray lacquer on it THEN you can use spray on furniture polish and just wipe the laser marks.

test a piece with the stain and see if it hides your laser burn marks....
it's always nice to stain a nice big board then spray it with lacquer then do all the cutting. just wide off the laser marks with a rag and poof you are done and sitting on the sofa resting and counting your bucks.....

[Ed Newbold]

Bill- I'm a wood worker and let me tell you this.....

You always have to sand after you vector cut, right? If you stain then vector cut you have to be willing to accept the "stains" on the wood from vector cutting and hope your wood stain color will cover up the burn marks. If you stain the wood then spray lacquer on it THEN you can use spray on furniture polish and just wipe the laser marks.

test a piece with the stain and see if it hides your laser burn marks....
it's always nice to stain a nice big board then spray it with lacquer then do all the cutting. just wide off the laser marks with a rag and poof you are done and sitting on the sofa resting and counting your bucks.....Hi Carol. I'm having trouble following your sequence. Are you suggesting:

1. Sand
2. Stain
3. Lacquer
4. Vector cut
5. Apply furniture polish
6. Wipe off

Most of us out here are still seeking some type of "check-list" we can use to complete our designs.

Thanks very much,

[Bill Stein]

Wipe the boards down. It and even.



I know that the last sentence is a typo, but I can't deciper it. What do I do after I wipe the boards down with the stain?

I don't know if thanks are in order for the big order yet. Like everything else, there is a down side to it as it keeps me and the machine tied up for a while.



Which tribute gets the honor of being cut out 200 times?

Are you planning on having the background stained to match instead of painting them a color to contrast?


The customer's son just graduated from Marine boot camp and is being deployed to Iraq in January. The dad is sending everyone in the company a wall tribute for them to send to a loved one. So I'm doing 200+ Marine plus about 10 Navy for the corpsman that are assigned to the Marine Company and will be deployed with them plus a few personalized ones for the C.O., 1stSgt, etc.

The backgrounds will be painted black -- not stained.





You always have to sand after you vector cut, right?

Actually, I don't sand at all. The baltic birch I use has a pretty good finish and doesn't seem to need to be sanded to smooth the surface. And, of course, vector cutting doesn't result in any roughness. The stain does a good job of covering any cutting "smoke" residue and what isn't covered actually adds to the piece. Customers seem to like the "shadow" look that the residue gives. I don't know if not sanding is a mistake or not, but it seems to be OK with my customers.

Thanks to everyone for the feedback. It looks like I will be staining some boards and then cutting them to see how it works out.

Bill

[Ed Newbold]

The customer's son just graduated from Marine boot camp and is being deployed to Iraq in January. The dad is sending everyone in the company a wall tribute for them to send to a loved one. So I'm doing 200+ Marine plus about 10 Navy for the corpsman that are assigned to the Marine Company and will be deployed with them plus a few personalized ones for the C.O., 1stSgt, etc.

The backgrounds will be painted black -- not stained.Bill,

I highly recommend the RED background. What I do with my USMC tributes (even though it's a little added work) is take the outer and middle rings (old scrap ones) and use them to pencil in a circle on the raw background.

The outside of the background circle is painted black (for the lettering), and the inside circle I paint red (for the background of the USMC insignia).

Man, they look great and sell like hot cakes that way. BTW, I use plain old interior latex brushed on for my backgrounds.

Cheers,

[Bill Stein]

Ed,

If you could see me, you would see that I am slapping my forehead. What a great idea! Thanks for passing it along.

Bill

[Ed Newbold]

Ed,

If you could see me, you would see that I am slapping my forehead. What a great idea! Thanks for passing it along.

Bill:D hahahaha... We must both have dents in our foreheads by now. Man I do that all the time!

Merry Christmas!

[Carol VanArnam]

Bill-

Assembly line process you can use a sheet of wood (5' x 5' or any other large piece of wood). Work the entire piece as a unit doing steps 1-3. It always goes faster working large pieces of wood. Then- cut the large board into smaller boards that fit the size of your laser engraving area. Vector cut your parts out of the larger boards and then do step 5 for the finished product....

1. sand wood
2. stain wood
3. laquer (both sides of the wood)
4. vector cut
5. spray with furniture polish and wipe off the laser marks....

or

Working each piece 1 at a time......
1. vector cut all of the pieces
2. sand each piece of wood one at a time
3. stain wood each piece- one at a time
4. laquer wood each piece

I hope that helps.... I do lots of big jobs and lots of small jobs. On big jobs the first method is better.

[Michael Kowalczyk]

[quote=Carol VanArnam]Bill-

Assembly line process you can use a sheet of wood (5' x 5' or any other large piece of wood). Work the entire piece as a unit doing steps 1-3. It always goes faster working large pieces of wood. Then- cut the large board into smaller boards that fit the size of your laser engraving area. Vector cut your parts out of the larger boards and then do step 5 for the finished product....

1. sand wood
2. stain wood
3. lacquer (both sides of the wood)
4. vector cut
5. spray with furniture polish and wipe off the laser marks....

Carol,
What kind of glue do you use? Do you have any issues with gluing wood that has been stained and lacquered separating because the glue has no pores to adhere too or are you using an epoxy?

I tried gorilla glue one time and it foamed out the edges so for now I use Titebond II or III.

Thanks,

[Carol VanArnam]

Michael- I use Roo Glue. It's exactly designed for your question. Take a look at the web page I attached. Any time you seal wood with laquer the pores shut so roo glue will deal with that issue for you. Read the material on the web link below and it tells you about their product.

http://www.rooglue.com/rooclear.html

A little bottle goes a long way. I've never tried epoxy but I'm sure it would work. Roo glue I would think would cost less.

[Michael Kowalczyk]

Thanks Carol:)
I will try them next week. I just called them and they are closed til the 26th.