How much time do you spend "looking for stuff"?

[Larry Fox]

The thread asking how much time we spend in the shop started me thinking how much time I spend looking for things around the shop vs. accomplishing something. What I mean by that is that I set things down here or there and then have difficulty finding them again. It occurred to me that I can't be alone here and wondered how other people have solved the problem.

I am not a particularly messy person but my shop is somewhat on the small side. I find that I waste a lot of time traversing the shop looking on/under/around stuff looking for that ruler, chisel, knife whatever that I just KNOW that I left around here somewhere. Perfect example - I spent 20 minutes of precious shop time last night looking for a pair of scissors.

So, how do you stay organized or is it just a loosing battle that everyone just accepts?

I have tried to "put things back" when done with them which works - to a point. Problem is that the definition of "done with them" is somewhat flexible.

Anyway - happy Friday.

L

[Al Willits]

My problem is after a bit I think I have to rearange things, then I can't remember where I rearanged them to.

But I do suffer from the gremblims that move stuff after I set them down, and probably spend a bit more than I like looking for them, although Beasty has a uncanny knack of knowing where everything is, so I usually end up asking her.

Al...honey...where is my...huh? on the bench...ok thanks dear...:)

[Dave Bonde]

No Larry it is not just you:) I am looking for things all the time. I know when it is time to clean the shop when I spend twice as much time looking for things as I do building.:mad: I get frustrated but don't seem to change my ways. I visualize everything right in its place but never seem to accomplish it. An interesting observation I made this summer - I am in the middle of a major remodel of my house and I had a friend helping me this sumer - he always had the tools he needed and I would have to borrow X- tool because mine was either on the ground MIA or whatever. I helped him with a project at his house and it was the exact opposite I always had the tools and he didn’t – go figure maybe there is something to that. By the way I see we are about 1 month apart in age - maybe it has something to do with turning 40 last summer:eek: Dave

[Cliff Rohrabacher]

That depends on where I put it.

[Bruce Haugen]

Okay, is it time for true confessions here? My shop is very small, but expandable if I want to park outside. What's embarrassing is the amount of time I spend looking for a piece of scrap wood that's already the right size so I don't have to cut into something bigger. In a perfect world, when I finish a project there would be only the project and sawdust.

Bruce, hanging head in shame.;)

[Brian Doris]

I have exactly the same problem, always have had. I work in a tiny basement which clutters up in no time. Between jobs I put my tools, bits etc., away in drawers or cupboards so the wall area above my cabinetmakers bench is relatively free. I bolted a 2' x 4' piece of MDF to the wall and screwed on a couple of rows of round, pierced, rare earth magnets at about 8" centres. I also made up what looks like a giant knife rack, consisting of two pieces of 2"x1" mild steel just under 4' long sandwiching some flat rare earth magnets, which is also screwed to the MDF.
Any magnet store will advise you on the required magnet strength, and for the "knife rack" the required spacing - watch polarity.
My set up will hold anything from a 2lb+ hammer right down to a 1/32" drill bit with just the right degree of stick. Long clamps remain a problem!
Regards

[John Bailey]

I've always been pretty organized and never had a problem finding things in the shop. Of course, my old basement shop was only 10'x12', or something like that, and I didn't have enough stuff to get lost, and it didn't have anywhere to get lost. Recently, I built a "large" 20'x20' shop and I still knew where everything was. I don't know what it is, but now that I'm building a boat, I can't find anything and my shop is always a mess. I'm getting better by putting tools back when I'm done using them, not when the project is done. If I lay it down while I'm working a project, I forget where it is, so, instead of laying down, I put it away. It saves a lot of time in the long run.

Dave B. - 40 HA!!;) Just wait till you hit 50.

John

[glenn bradley]

When I am between activities or just pausing to think about what I'm doing, I pick up around the shop. This accomplishes my goal of pausing to reflect on my approach and also keeps the clutter down and improves safety. So. . . being the anal type-A sort of guy I am, I generally go right to what I'm after 'cause I just put it away. Of course, there are ALWAYS exceptions like the shelf brackets I couldn't find for 3 weeks because I put them in a box and labeled them shelf brackets (???) duh!

P.s. My dad gave me a bucket-boss that he got as a door prize at his WWing club. I thought of it as more of a job site item but it does come in handy for holding stuff I will reach for repeatedly during a certain phase of a project. You just have to clean it out between phases or what you want is buried under what you needed before (did that make sense?).

[Jack Dickey]

Yeah I agree , 50 is my next number , it gets much worse , trust me ..
I have three tapes , and 40,000 pencils .. You would think with all that , that I wud remember to clip ONE of the tapes on my jeans and put at least one pencil in my pocket , when I move around .. You would THINK that ..
Also why is it when I want a Phillips screwdriver all I can find is one of the 1000 or so slotteds I have laying around , and vice versa ..

[Dennis Peacock]

Shoot, I'm so well organized that I can't seem to find anything!!! In short, I spend a lot of time looking for all my organized items I NEED. ;)

[Matt Guyrd]

I added three tape rules and steel rules to my Xmas wish list for this very reason!

I walk circle around my "relatively" organized shop looking for anything to measure with. Same with pencils.

I also asked for a shop apron to hold some of these items in hopes that the circling is minimized.

Matt

[pat warner]

"So, how do you stay organized or is it just a loosing battle that everyone just accepts?"
__________________________________________________ __________
Have a terrible time with this. Even worse when a student is waitng on me..
I lose up to 10% of my day looking.
Strategy:
Keep as much as possible in my pockets, work on as few projects as possible (simulataneously), consolidate tools in a small box for job specific tasks then return to crib.
Concentrate to the max, slacking off in to dream land will aggravate the hell out of the seek & find conflagration.

Routs. (http://www.patwarner.com)

[John Schreiber]

That's the advantage of my small shop I guess. Especially this time of year when the cars are in the "shop," my work area is confined to just a few arms' reaches.

I'm a big believer in "A place for everything and everything in its place" and I try to be disciplined about it. I try to internalize Shaker philosophy which I summarize in part as: When you sit in a chair you sit in the chair. When you are done sitting, you hang the chair back up on its hook.

[Rennie Heuer]

I'm sure I spend at lease 25% of my shop time looking for something I had in my hands minutes earlier. Very frustrating!!!

[Bob Childress]

This thread struck a raw nerve! :D Whenever I'm ready to begin a project, everything is hunky-dory and in its place. But as soon as I start using tools and lay them down for a minute, they mysteriously wander away. :confused: I know I laid it on the assembly table, but I find it on a shelf. I put it down on the tablesaw top and locate it later by the drill press. It's very strange. :o

I've even bought 2 or 3 of some common tools, just hoping I can find 1 when I need it. I have 6 tape measures, 3 claw hammers, 2 full sets of allen wrenches, 2 torpedo levels, 4 pairs of safety glasses, 3 combination squares, and at last count about 7,211 pencils, give or take (all true, except maybe the pencils). And I can still never find a tape measure when I need it. :mad: (Or a pencil.:p )

[Don Bullock]

A couple of summers ago my wife and I spent much of our vacation time (we are both teachers) organizing my "workshop area" in our garage. I must admit it was a real mess and I spent most of my project time finding things. She agreed to purchase a big Craftsman tool box, a new work bench, cabinents and whatever else it took to keep the shop organized. I have to say that now know where every tool that I have is. I have very little wasted time looking for things.

Now that my shop is better organized, I have been able to fit more equipment into my small area. More importantly I have been able to spend what little time I have working on projects instead of looking for what I need.

[Andy Hoyt]

I always find the original immediately upon returning from the store to buy the replacement. This happens multiple times for the same item with no regard as to whether I'm looking for the original or the replacement.

It's a Yosarrian thing.

[Steve Dewey]

My problem is I went thru a rapid expansion over the last 2 years adding 4 Craftsman rolling carts & 2 workbenches for storage to my existing 1 rolling cart. They kept having them on sale for $100 - thought it would be a good way to "organize" instead of having stuff taking up bench space.

I can tell you where everything is in that original rolling cart, the rest I'm probably batting 500.

I have a bad habit of not picking up while on the job. Right now I'm tripping over clamps. I built a torsion box assembly table that is on the other side of the basement from my wall hung clamp rack - plus I bought a dozen new clamps that don't have a home yet. Net result - Clamps everywhere :o

[Bob Childress]

Net result - Clamps everywhere :o

You'd better send those clamps to me and I'll take care of them for you.:D

[Jeffrey Fusaro]

hello, all!

i've been 'lurking' on the site for a few days, just reading (and chuckling at) the posts.

i couldn't resist chiming in on this thread.

i thought i was the only one that had this problem. i feel a little better, now.

first off... i always know where my tape measure(s) are. they are always on the floor, since the blasted things keep falling out the holder on my tool belt. i'm gonna get rid of that silly leather pouch and just throw the tape on floor when i'm done with it. i'll know where it is, when i trip over it.

but, i've made some great strides lately. we just moved into a new home back in june, and for the first time in my life, i have "my place" to work. i partitioned off a corner of the basement and have been spending the last few months setting up shop. the big push came after buying a jet mini-lathe/dust monster. i knew i'd be working outside, if i didn't get the area enclosed quickly.

i've also purchased an upright storage cabinet, so that i can finally get all of my small expendable supplies and materials out of dozen or so empty diaper boxes that everything had been stored in previously.

now, which box is the glue in...? huggies? or pampers?

the next step is to install a full sheet of peg board on the wall, so that i can keep small hand tools nearby and organized, so i won't have to hunt for them.

oh, wait... never mind... they're on the floor.

[glenn bradley]

An article I read written by someone much smarter than I stated that you should have at least 4 square feet of surface nearby, preferably mobile, while you work. That way everything you "set down" should be right there. I guess this doesn't count during clamp-ups, I'd bury 4 sq.ft.

[Brent Dowell]

Right now I'm in the middle of moving to a new house.

I'd say right now 90% of my conversations with my wife start out with "Hey, Do you know where the _______ is?"

Not sure how long it's going to take to get my shop built and organized, but I'm trying to prepare myself to not know where anything is for the next year, at least ...:eek:

[glenn bradley]

If only those clamps would multiply while they're lying around in that pile, eh?

[Bob Childress]

Welcome to the Creek, Jeffrey! Jump right in. The glue is in the Pampers box. :D

[Matt Calder]

All,
I am not an organized person. Last Christmas I bought a whole lot of surplus office file cabinets, the big steel kind. Now everything has a place and I (usually) can find whatever I am looking for. I don't always put stuff away right away, but when I do it always goes back to the same spot. So it is there, or where I used it last.

Matt

[Kirk Poore]

I added three tape rules and steel rules to my Xmas wish list for this very reason!

I walk circle around my "relatively" organized shop looking for anything to measure with. Same with pencils.

I also asked for a shop apron to hold some of these items in hopes that the circling is minimized.

Matt

Half my stuff is in my garage and half in my basement shop. I have a tape, flashlight, and eye & ear protection in each place. And once or twice a year I buy a box of 20 wooden pencils and sharpen them at once, and scatter them all over the shop and the garage. When I can't find more than one or two of them anymore, it's time to buy a new box.

Of course, I've got so much scrap that I never have trouble finding that. I've burned about a third of it over the last couple of months starting my wood stove, though.

Kirk

[Jim Becker]

Not all that much....most of the time. I'm pretty anal about putting things in specific places immediately after using them. But occasionally, "something" makes up for all the "planning" when it comes to "time to find"!! :D

[Ethan Sincox]

My wife loves me. How do I know this? My shop is every square inch of our one-car garage. (It was that way pre-marriage; we sold her condo just before the wedding and moved her and her stuff into mine... I pledged to scrape her windows in the winter and keep my woodworking tools and lumber confined to that one space if I could keep it. It meant squeezing in the 3/4 of my lumber I kept in the basement, but... I wasn't about to complain.)

So I don't have a problem with knowing where everything is - it is somewhere in a 10'x18' rectangle, generally at chest-level or lower! Narrowing that down a bit, of course, is often quite challenging.

I occasionally hear commercials on the radio for the companies who come in and organize your garage... I bet they'd run at the sight of mine.

How else do I know my wife loves me? We're in the market for a new (well, old, really - we'd love to find an old craftsman we can fix up) house and one of the requirements we've both agreed it will need to have is a workshop (or room to build one).

To solve the immediate organization (or lack thereof) problem, does anyone have any good book or article recommendations for workshop organization techniques and ideas?

[Jack Dickey]

Jeffery , welcome to the Creek , and oh by the way , dont waste your money on the pegboard .. I have about a zillion square feet of it and cant find anything thats on it ..
I think finding the original , or second or third replacement after buying a replacement is why I have so much stuff .. Is what I tell LOML , I'll go buy another ________ , then we will be able to find the one thats missing ..
I started this afternoon a major renovation of my storage issues .. It'll werk .. for a little while .. Then it'll be back to normal ..

[Kelly C. Hanna]

Easter Eggs....got a friend who says he can hide his own...:D:D:D

Yep, CRS has attached itself and while I probably spend less time than the average hobbyist, I still misplace things. Lucky enough to be able to make a good living working with wood, I have to have all the appropriate tools on the jobsite. The fun starts when there's 2 or 3 guys helping me and the tools get scattered fast.

By myself in the shop, I lose little time to searching. I tend to have everything right at hand when I start a project and I am pretty good about putting it all away when the project is finished.

[Bob Gaughan]

Nothing profound to add except - Thank God - I thought it was just me!

[Al Willits]

OK, anybody besides me couldn't find their tape or pencil so they used a piece of their hand/arm as a measuring tool, then used their finger nail to mark the cut, only to find the tape and pencil when they tried to put the cut wood on the bench and had to move the tape and pencil out of the way first?
er....anybody???? :)

I used to use a tool belt, but my belt has gotten big enough now that I can't hardly walk when I fill it up with tools.....gave it up, now I just consider wandering aimlessy around the shop looking for who knows what, exercise.

Al

[Ted Baca]

It is pretty much SOP in my shop. I spend way too much time looking for stuff and either find it under something I laid down on top of it or can't find it all and go buy another one (hardware) come home and set the bag down next to it. I ask myself "where the h#ll did I put it?" about 50 times a weekend. But it's not just the shop, it's at the office, in the kitchen, storage room, etc.. I would elaborate more but I have go find my other sock.....

[Andrew Melamed]

never have the problem, keep my shop very clean....but, then again my tool cabinet is 2 steps away, sometimes i love my small shed shop

[Alfred Clem]

My first shop teacher was an Irishman who had his own set of rules about just that thing: finding stuff.

Rule #1: if you are using several tools, always set them down on your work bench to the right. That way, you only have to look in one direction.

Rule #2: if you are using several tools and are finished with them, put them away where you found them. Don't just have them lying around on your work bench.

Rule #3: if you find you have run out of something, make a penciled note of it and buy it next time you go to the hardware store. After more than 65 years, I still hear that Irishman's voice: you have a grocery list, you have a hardware list.

[Dan Drager]

I try and minimize my searching time by having at least 5 - 10 tapes, brushes, squares, push sticks, etc laying all over. If there is one of what I need on every surface in the damn shop, not a problem.

[John Hastings]

I have 6 children. 5 sons and 1 daughter. I'm surprised no one mentioned this. They have been walking off with my tools for years!!! It's now to the point that even if I'm responsible for misplacing something, I convinced that one of my beautiful children has what ever I'm looking for, safely tucked under their bed. Whenever my wife sees me come out of the basement with a nervous twitch, she'll say, "ok, what are you missing now. The scary part is that my acetylene torch is missing. Ok, just kidding about that.
By the way, I just stumbled on the “Creek” a couple of weeks ago, and I have been pleasantly shocked at how much is here. The “Creek” is an incredibly useful tool that I know my kids won’t be able to walk off with!!!
I always believed that you should support what you like/love/respect/trust. So, as a Christmas present, I’ve asked my wife to donate to the “Creek” for me. I strongly encourage everyone to do the same. You all have a list of tools that you want Santa to bring you, well add a donation to Sawmill Creek to your “wish list”. Thanks again. See ya’

[Mike Holbrook]

Great thread,

I have a major problem, first I always have multiple projects going on in multiple buildings on multiple floors. Finish one then start another......naaaa! I have a part time helper, usually one day a week, it takes me that week to find the things he "put up" last time he left. I have two kids, 4 dogs (who steal every thing that hits the ground) and a wife who has decided she is a mechanic and builder. If I could just narrow the tool location down to a specific floor in a specific building....

I have been spending some major time tyring to cut down on the time I spend looking for things and thought I would list some of my solutions.

1- I dumped the tool belt it wore out, was too heavy and things always seemd to fall out of it. I am liking my plain old Lee Valley Apron with two big pockets on the bottom (with covering flaps) and one pocket and pencil holders up top.

2-My Festool table, saw and router arrived yesterday. This is several threads just in itself. One of my problems is I frequently have no place to put tools, just the systainers on the dust extractor will be a major help.

3-I think I will go ahead and finish my shop, including the room off my shop where I plan to do much of my sawing.

4-EZ Smart table & Ez Smart. Yes, Festools & EZ Smart coexist quite well and can even compliment each other.

4-Cabinets, there are 10 sheets of 3/4 plywood leaning on the wall. Now that the Festool gear is here they will be made into cabinets as part of the shop finishing project.

5-storeWall, the wife spent a bunch of time researching products to put on the garage wall to hang things on. You have probably seen something like it on Norm's workshop walls. I hate peg board, every time I go to get something I nock 3 other things off the wall. This newer type wall treatment provides many more, much sturdier solutions to the adjustable wall hanging system concept. The wife has spent many months researching garage storage solutions and she likes storeWall better than the other products. According to the red head, storeWall can use just about anybodies brackets, hooks etc. whereas the other vendors design theirs such that you have to use their hardware. I was negative on the whole idea at first, prefering cabinets, until I saw all the accesories they make to hang on that panneling: parts drawers (like for screws) large brackets that can hold lumber, baskets....all of which can be moved between all of the locations I have the panneling in. The wife is signing up as a vendor, for the discount and because of all the friends she has who want it.

6-I have 8 or so heavy duty nylon tool carriers. If people would just stick the right stuff in the right bag, grrrr.

7-I drug out my dad's old Black&Decker ToolMate which I inherited. It is no Festool table but sometimes it helps.

8-Also part of my shop completion project is at least one set of the collapsable saw horses. I will have a 3/4" sheet of plywood, with retaining molding to hold it on the saw horses without screws.

So guys add to the list. Maybe we can compile a big list of solutions so SMC people have a reference.

[Kristian Wild]

I manage to work myself up so well when I can't find something that I've just developed work habits that avoid searching MOST of the time. I confess, I am the epitome of the anal-retentive tools-must-go-back-where-they-belong type of person.

This has also stemmed from working in a shop with three other WWers' . The other guys have mostly learned to tolerate my annoying habits, especially regarding putting back anything of mine that they have borrowed. When I'm working on a particular task, I expect to simply turn around and pluck the tool I want from the place it always sits. When this is not the case all I can think about is the wasted time and money resulting from it.

So I like to be effecient, (I may not be able to spell "effecient"??) and the single biggest thing I have found to help me out is my apron. I love my apron! In it are the small tools that are most often used away from my bench and are always needed at your fingertips. Mine holds on a regular basis:

Chest Pocket
A regular wood pencil 4H
Mechanical pencil w/2H leads (0.7mm)
6" stainless steel ruler
My ear plugs

Lower Center Pouch
4" machinists square
16' tape

Lower Left Pouch
Stubby picquick screwdriver or regular size pickquick

Lower Right Pouch
Olfa utility knife
One of those big white erasers

Within a very short time I found that I simply reached for the tool I needed without even thinking about where it was. Somehow I've never managed to sell the other guys in the shop on the apron idea. So I just tease them relentlessly as they log miles per day walking between the various machines and their benches looking for their tapes or squares or rulers. (It's a very friendly shop)

By the way if I've inspired anyone to try an apron, the basic one from LV is good, but I just use ones that I mooch from a local ski shop. I used to work in several ski shops and the ski and binding manufacturers used to give us dozens of aprons each year.

Kris

[Jim O'Dell]

Pencils, never can find a pencil. I've asked for an old time manual, wall mounted sharpener for Christmas!! Like the ones we had in grade school. I usuallya put one behind my ear. Forget about it when I go inside for the day, find it, set it by my computer, the wonder where it is when I start the next time in the shop!

And John, every one told me growing up that you are over the hill at 30. I laughed at 30 and kept on trucking. BUT I swear to you, the day I hit 40, my body fell apart. It was not fun. 50 didn't do much, except the eyes that had started going down hill, gained a little speed. :D Maybe I was just an early achiever? :eek: Jim.

[Don Bullock]

My problem is I went thru a rapid expansion over the last 2 years adding 4 Craftsman rolling carts & 2 workbenches for storage to my existing 1 rolling cart. They kept having them on sale for $100 - thought it would be a good way to "organize" instead of having stuff taking up bench space.

I can tell you where everything is in that original rolling cart, the rest I'm probably batting 500...:o

I bought a set of the magnetic drawer signs that Sears sells for it's Craftsmat tool chests. They help me remember which drawer to look in for things.;)

As I told you, my wife said I could do anything if it would help to organize my shop. She's an organization master, and I'm terrible at it. I can certainly relate to many of you on that issue. You should see my desk at work!:eek: :o

[jonathan snyder]

Hi folks,
I got a-lot of laughs reading this thread. Thanks,

I sometimes spend a bit of time looking for things. I usually find whatever I'm looking for on the third or fourth search through a particular drawer or shelf! My Mom always said "men don't know how to look for things". To combat the problem of loosing pencils, tape, small square etc, I got an apron with lots of pockets, Only problem is I don't always wear it. Now where did I put that square, oh yeah its in my apron pocket hanging over there on the wall.

Hope everyone is having a good weekend

Jonathan

[Jim C Bradley]

Hi All,
I didn't realize so many people were as "Where is it" handicapped as I am. Glenn Bradley, my son, is almost disgusting. He can find things most of the time because he will get mad occasionally and throw half of his stuff away.
Larry cannot possibly look as long for things as I do---sometimes I haven't even moved. And Al I have been rearranging my shop for many months---setting up my first ever, intelligently (I hope) laid out shop. So everything is in a constant state of rearrangement. That cabinet is now gone. That cabinet is now out in the "Outhouse" (my 14' x 4' shed for the DC, Air Comp and boxes of Seldom or Never stuff). This drawer was pliars now it is screwdrivers (where did I put the pliars?). The drill press was there and now the grinder is. ETC!!!
Dave Bonde is crying over 40 --- I'm more than twice that. Really took me a long time to get things the way I want them to be.
I do have half a dozen ugly, chartruse, plastic trays about 6"x9"x1" that end up all over the shop when I am working. They hold the various tools etc that I am using near the TS or another tray near the drill press, etc. THESE REALLY HELP but are not a cure.
I forgot, I think it was Al, who wrote the routine about his wife finding his tools. This is common at our house. Myrna does not know squat about my shop. However, after I look for something for 20 minutes, I go in the house and yell, "Help." She asks me what it looks like. I tell her it is bare metal color and looks like a king size strawberry stem picker. She then says, "Is this what you mean?" and hands me my Romex cable stripper.
Sorry about the diarrhea of the keyboard.
Enjoy,
Jim

[Gary Herrmann]

Tape measures mostly. I don't know why, but I tend to lose track of where I put the tape measure. I like to use the same one throughout a project so having more than one actually makes it worse. Counting the ones in the junk drawer in the kitchen and in the garage, I have 5.

Other than that, I can usually find just about anything. Nothing is labeled in my shop but I know where things are. Drives SWMBO nuts. Probably why she makes such a point about the tape measures.

[Rich Engelhardt]

Hello,

"How much time do you spend "looking for stuff"? "

Too much!
My only saving grace is that I don't seem to be alone in that respect.
I hate to tadmit it, but I've been known to go out and buy something simply because it's faster that trying to find the one I already have.

A month ago I searched high and low for my Skil saw w/no laser guide to no avail.
It was easier and faster to go out and buy a Ryobi w/laser.

[everett lowell]

My first shop teacher was an Irishman who had his own set of rules about just that thing: finding stuff.

Rule #1: if you are using several tools, always set them down on your work bench to the right. That way, you only have to look in one direction.

Rule #2: if you are using several tools and are finished with them, put them away where you found them. Don't just have them lying around on your work bench.

Rule #3: if you find you have run out of something, make a penciled note of it and buy it next time you go to the hardware store. After more than 65 years, I still hear that Irishman's voice: you have a grocery list, you have a hardware list.I like that idea, Alfred, I might try to implement that in my work shop!:)

[Brent Dowell]

When I was actively doing things in the shop (before getting involved in moving from one house to another) I did find that a shop apron really helped to keep me from wandering around looking for pencils, machinist squares, etc...

I tried the one from lee valley, but found that it was a little long, and that when I wore it with shorts, well, it sort of looked a bit funny :D The strap on the back of my neck was also a bit annoying.

I got one from Duluth trading that really worked out a lot better. More pockets, and a neat arrangement with the belt and neck strap that keeps the neck strap off your neck. Might be worth a look if. I liked it so much I got my dad one.

[Jim Becker]

Tape measures mostly. I don't know why, but I tend to lose track of where I put the tape measure. I like to use the same one throughout a project so having more than one actually makes it worse.

I solved that particular problem by putting it in the exact same spot near my miter saw "every time" I'm done using it. 95% of the time, that's where it will be. The other 5%...hopefully, it's visible. :D