Dry weddings - Is this an issue?

[Dan Mages]

Hi All


I had a rather nasty phone call from the exclusive alcohol caterer for our wedding venue regarding our needs for a Kosher wedding. He went on this 5 minute rant about how we are being unreasonable, being inconsiderate to his businesses and that we do not appreciate his license at The Domes. His solution is to charge is to charge us approximately $40 a bottle with service and tax (a 400% markup from retail!!) and have a rather convoluted scheme where our kosher food caterer will serve it under his supervision. This will result in an alcohol budget of approximately $3000-3500, which is way out of our price range. He was rude, arrogant, and abrasive and put me in a really foul mood for the remainder of the day. A formal complaint is being filed with the county park district. It won't do us much good, it will help them ditch this guy once his contract expires (which they want to do).



So we have two options go dry or go somewhere else. We absolutely love the venue, so we will probably have to go dry. What is everyone's experience with dry weddings? Any issues or thoughts?

Dan

BTW, if we do go dry, LOML will demand that he apologize to me for his attitude.

[Ken Fitzgerald]

Nothing wrong with a dry wedding. I drink but we had a dry wedding..I'd tell that guy to take a hike.

[Andy Hoyt]

Wet or dry doesn't matter. The event in question is what's important.

On the other hand ---- How about both? Let all the guests know that it's a dry wedding, and that the theme is Prohibition Era so everyone should dress and "gear up" accordingly.

[jeremy levine]

I can't say how much it angers me to read this. In a word it's antisemitism.
Maybe he would like his name posted here http://www.antisemitism.org.il/
or here http://www.adl.org/.

I've been to dry weddings, they are fine. You really can't drink that much if you expect to drive.


Boy does this hack me off.

It seems the web site implies you can choose your caterer of you choice
Catering/Bar Service: Caterer of your choice – must be a licensed, insured, full-service caterer. Exclusive bar service from the contracted vendor

[Jim Bell]

How big is your future wife's purse? Might stick a bottle in there. You might also try to book a party with the Hells Angels MC :eek: for the following week end. Lets see how he "handles" that one,

[scott spencer]

It's hard to know if he's motivated by anti-semitism or greed or both, but he's positively absolutely 100% wrong in his approach to you. I'd have an extremely difficult time giving him a dime regardless of his reasoning.

[John Hart]

It's hard to know if he's motivated by anti-semitism or greed or both, but he's positively absolutely 100% wrong in his approach to you. I'd have an extremely difficult time giving him a dime regardless of his reasoning.

The wedding industry as a whole has gotten out of control, because they know it's a one-time thing, and most folks are prepared to overspend. I doubt this is antisemitism. The dress maker, the flower folks, food, drink....everything is over-priced due to "that's what the market will bear".

Someone somewhere is going to have to start saying, "ok...thanks for your quote...perhaps we can do business at my next wedding.....b-bye"

[Steven Wilson]

Tell him to take a hike and you should look into another venue. One question, is there anything in your contract for the venue that would prevent you or guests from BYOB? If so then I would look elsewhere, if not then advertise as BYOB (and then bring a few case of booze on your own).

[jeremy levine]

If you raise the price of a house when a memeber of a certain ethnic or religous group comes to buy it, the state will show up at your door with an arrest warrant. It seems that if you gouge a price based on a religious request you might be on really thin ice.

[Bill Grumbine]

Dan, our oldest daughter is getting married in June 2007. We started out at the outset planning a dry wedding. I am all for a glass of wine or a bottle of beer, but there are people who will be there that can't control their drinking, and do not need the temptation, as well as people who would be offended on religious grounds (Baptists, dontcha know?). Plus, I do not need the hassle of drunks on the way home or fights breaking out, although the latter is not likely. We are doing a fairly modest wedding all around, but no one has given us a hassle about it being dry, attendants or vendors. If someone does, too bad.

The wedding is all about two people joining their lives together for the rest of their lives. It is not an opportunity to drink one's self into oblivion at someone else's expense, although a lot of people take it that way anymore. Stick to your guns and refuse to give the guy any money. Use sparkling grape juice for the toast, and if anyone grumbles, tell them you are concerned for the recovering alcoholics in the group, as well as those on medication. That should do for even the most dedicated boozers. I hope it all goes well for you and the rest of the family!

Bill

[Bill Grumbine]

The wedding industry as a whole has gotten out of control, because they know it's a one-time thing, and most folks are prepared to overspend. I doubt this is antisemitism. The dress maker, the flower folks, food, drink....everything is over-priced due to "that's what the market will bear".

Someone somewhere is going to have to start saying, "ok...thanks for your quote...perhaps we can do business at my next wedding.....b-bye"

Here we are John! Wedding photographer? The cheapest we found was $1600 for the day, and we would get 24 8x10 pictures in an album! Guess what? Dad (me), who used to photograph weddings, now has himself a brandy new Nikon D80 with its attendant flash, and several other accessories. I get to photograph the wedding and keep the camera! Dresses are being made by family members, and the buffet is going to be very simple. Not counting the camera expense, we are looking at about $3000 for the entire affair. That is a price I think reasonable.

As a counselor, it seems to me that the stability and length of the marriage is inversely proportional to the cost of the wedding. Girls who insist on $20,000 - $40,000 weddings and more seem to end up divorced within a year.

Bill

[Dan Mages]

If you raise the price of a house when a memeber of a certain ethnic or religous group comes to buy it, the state will show up at your door with an arrest warrant. It seems that if you gouge a price based on a religious request you might be on really thin ice.

True, but in this case we are requesting "premium non stocked wine" instead of their standard beverage package and therefore may charge what they want. This all about greed and arrogance. LOML and her father are going to play bad cop/weeping bride to get him in line or tell him to take a hike.

Dan

[Dan Mages]

Here we are John! Wedding photographer? The cheapest we found was $1600 for the day, and we would get 24 8x10 pictures in an album! Guess what? Dad (me), who used to photograph weddings, now has himself a brandy new Nikon D80 with its attendant flash, and several other accessories. I get to photograph the wedding and keep the camera! Dresses are being made by family members, and the buffet is going to be very simple. Not counting the camera expense, we are looking at about $3000 for the entire affair. That is a price I think reasonable.

As a counselor, it seems to me that the stability and length of the marriage is inversely proportional to the cost of the wedding. Girls who insist on $20,000 - $40,000 weddings and more seem to end up divorced within a year.

Bill

Heh... I know what you mean. Once you mention it is for a wedding, the prices double. We are looking at around $15k for our wedding. That is about $100 per guest.

As a photographer, I could use your advice. What do you think about the work at www.duzynski.com? We will be signing with this guy for the wedding. The rate is $950 for 5 hours and we get all of the photos on a CD/DVD and a copyright transfer. No prints or albums included but that is not too important for us.

Dan

[Mike Cutler]

Dan.

Tell him to take a hike. It was this kind of nonsense that caused my wife and myself to forestall our wedding plans.
By the time the caterer came back with the estimates for food and alcohol for the wedding it was going to cost me approximately $75.00 per person. I told them that for 60-75 couples I would rent a nice restaraunt for the reception instead of eating on plastic chairs and folding tables. $150.00 per couple in 1986 would have bought a heck of a meal at just about any resaraunt.

I don't think it was antisemitism. I think he just trying to expoilt your vulnerability.

[Jim O'Dell]

Dan, I would think a complaint your state's liquor liscensing group would be in order...may not have to wait for his contract to expire! Jim.

[Bill Grumbine]

Heh... I know what you mean. Once you mention it is for a wedding, the prices double. We are looking at around $15k for our wedding. That is about $100 per guest.

As a photographer, I could use your advice. What do you think about the work at www.duzynski.com? We will be signing with this guy for the wedding. The rate is $950 for 5 hours and we get all of the photos on a CD/DVD and a copyright transfer. No prints or albums included but that is not too important for us.

Dan

Look for a PM Dan. If anyone else is wondering, I think this part is not really pertinent to the discussion in the thread.

Bill

[Dan Larson]

Dan,

To answer your question... go with the dry wedding... can't imagine that your guests will care much. I enjoy a nice glass of wine with dinner as much as anyone, but it wouldn't bother me one bit to go to a dry wedding. You mention the Domes... are you referring to the Mitchell Domes in Milwaukee? Really neat place to have a wedding... don't let a greedy caterer push you away from having your wedding a such a cool place!

Dan

[Dan Mages]

Dan,

To answer your question... go with the dry wedding... can't imagine that your guests will care much. I enjoy a nice glass of wine with dinner as much as anyone, but it wouldn't bother me one bit to go to a dry wedding. You mention the Domes... are you referring to the Mitchell Domes in Milwaukee? Really neat place to have a wedding... don't let a greedy caterer push you away from having your wedding a such a cool place!

Dan
Yep. It will be at the Mitchell Park Domes. The ceremony will be in their show dome. Just a preview... ;)

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v647/DanMages/MISC/TheHappyCouple-KISSING.jpg

[Art Mulder]

Here we are John! Wedding photographer? The cheapest we found was $1600 for the day, and we would get 24 8x10 pictures in an album! Guess what? Dad (me), who used to photograph weddings, now has himself a brandy new Nikon D80 with its attendant flash, and several other accessories. I get to photograph the wedding and keep the camera! Dresses are being made by family members, and the buffet is going to be very simple. Not counting the camera expense, we are looking at about $3000 for the entire affair. That is a price I think reasonable.

As a counselor, it seems to me that the stability and length of the marriage is inversely proportional to the cost of the wedding. Girls who insist on $20,000 - $40,000 weddings and more seem to end up divorced within a year.

Bill

Amen, Bill!

I confess that I don't really get it when I hear about these expensive weddings.

I have been married just over 15 years. Our wedding was dry. There was a bottle of white grape juice and a bottle of sparkling red on each table (8 ppl) and it was a great time. Can I remember what we ate? Uhh, no. Who cares about that sort of stuff?

We rented a hall at the local boy-scout camp. Pretty cheap. but large, clean, and very nice for our size crowd (about 100 guests or so, maybe 120, I forget). My mom (trained as a tailor when a young lady in Holland.) made the wedding dress and attendant's dresses. For catering we hired a local ladies club that did it for fundraising for charity. For photos we were blessed to have a cousin who did it for us as a wedding gift. I made the dance tape myself. My father in law was out of pocket less than $4000 when all was said and done.

Those multi-thousand dollar photos? How often do you use them? It has been at least a few years since I cracked open our wedding binder. Oh, I'm glad I have some photos. But I don't need a hundred photos of carefully posed people.

I had a friend back when I was engaged, her son was engaged at the same time, and she said it really well: "Make sure you spend time preparing for the Marriage, and not just the Wedding!"

And I've rambled on long enough. I'll go hide behind Bill now, in case someone needs to throw something at me... ;)

[Lee Schierer]

I've been to both wet and dry weddings. At most of the Wet wedddings someone over did it and caused a problem. Some folks find it hard to resist free drinks and go crazy. Bear in mind if you are providing the drinks, you are also responsible for the damage someone drinking them does at the hall or on the way home.

For my daughter we went dry despite a loud protest from the Grooms parents. We stood our ground and had a great reception, nearly everyone there said it was one of the most fun times they had ever had at a wedding. The DJ played music for an extra hour beyond his contracted time at no charge because as he put it; "folks were dancing and having fun and so was I so I didn't want to stop" Even the Grooms parents admitted it was a lot of fun.

If I had it to do over again we would go dry for sure.

[Dan Larson]

Yep. It will be at the Mitchell Park Domes. The ceremony will be in their show dome. Just a preview... ;)

Excellent... I'm sure by the time your big day arrives, all of the silly annoyances like the caterer will have faded away... and you'll be able to focus on enjoying it to the fullest!

Dan

[Dan Mages]

Dan, I would think a complaint your state's liquor liscensing group would be in order...may not have to wait for his contract to expire! Jim.
Thanks for the idea. I called Milwaukee's licensing office and they were not happy with what happened and asked me to send in a formal complaint. They also gave me the name of the alderman for the area who might be willing to twist a few arms.

If he wants to playhardball, I am more than willing to comply. I might not be using him, but I am more than happy to make his life a little less pleasant and possibly cost him his exclusive contracts with the city.

[Jim King]

Something over 40 years ago the family decided that my wife and I were going to have this big wedding and invite the world. Neither my wife nor I wanted it that way so I went down the road on the tractor and borrowed $500 from the neighbor and the next morning we flew from Mpls to Idaho Falls via Salt Lake and were married the same night. Called home and canceled the big wedding. Arrived back in Wisconsin with money in our pocket. ( It was not a dry wedding ) Times have changed.

[Al Willits]

""""""
antisemitism?
""""""""

Somehow I think that word gets used a bit to much...imho

Remembering we don't have all the info, but I'd say you have a over zealous caterer who wants to run the show his way, not good a practice in my opinion, but I've seen it before.
400% markup outrageous?
Maybe not, ever consider what you pay for a drink at a decent bar and what that drink costs buy the case?

If your spending the kinda money it seems like, have your wedding somewhere else and don't let anyone else tell your whether it has to be dry or not, your choice, most your friends like to indulge a bit, maybe wet would be the way to go, nothing wrong with either way, but a wet wedding has choices for your guests, a dry one doesn't...up to you.

Personally I'd tell him how its gonna be, and if he doesn't want to do it that way, go somewhere else.
Like said, its your wedding.


Al

[Joe Pelonio]

At my wedding we had champagne only, and it would have been dry except that my employer at the time (1974) owned a liquor store and it was his present to us.

Not only is the booze jacked way up in price but there's nothing worse than a drunk uncle or cousin doing something stupid. I'd suggest providing sparkling Apple Juice or something similar for toasts and enjoy the wedding
without the alcohol. You'll avoid some liability issues too.

[Dan Mages]

""""""
antisemitism?
""""""""

Somehow I think that word gets used a bit to much...imho

Remembering we don't have all the info, but I'd say you have a over zealous caterer who wants to run the show his way, not good a practice in my opinion, but I've seen it before.
400% markup outrageous?
Maybe not, ever consider what you pay for a drink at a decent bar and what that drink costs buy the case?

If your spending the kinda money it seems like, have your wedding somewhere else and don't let anyone else tell your whether it has to be dry or not, your choice, most your friends like to indulge a bit, maybe wet would be the way to go, nothing wrong with either way, but a wet wedding has choices for your guests, a dry one doesn't...up to you.

Personally I'd tell him how its gonna be, and if he doesn't want to do it that way, go somewhere else.
Like said, its your wedding.


Al

The wine costs $7 per bottle wholesale. That gives them a 570% profit per bottle. At their price, the wine would cost $10 a glass. And we are not buying by the glass, but in bulk. I would expect some sort of price break when purchasing in bulk.

We will probably tell him to stick it, but we are not going anywhere. To take our business elsewhere will allow him to win. The Domes are owned by Milwaukee County which has contracted with him to be the exclusive alcohol vendor.

[Al Willits]

Ya, that seems a bit much, but I've seen mark ups close to than that, especially with hired caterer's and such, kinda what the traffic will bear I think. (seen a lot cheaper too)
Also wouldn't supprise me his profit was partly keyed off what he thought he could charge you.
Comments like "we want to make it special" gotta mean dollar signs to him maybe.??

Either way, congrats on getting married, and hopefully you'll laugh about this later....hopefully.

Al

[jeremy levine]

If all special requests get a 400% markup, then it's SOP but if he hears the word kosher and adds 400% thne what is it ?............... The Web site for the domes says you can choose your own caterer.

[Dan Mages]

If all special requests get a 400% markup, then it's SOP but if he hears the word kosher and adds 400% thne what is it ?............... The Web site for the domes says you can choose your own caterer.


For food, yes. Alcohol and carbonated beverages are a different story.

Dan

[Karl Laustrup]

The wedding industry as a whole has gotten out of control, because they know it's a one-time thing, and most folks are prepared to overspend. I doubt this is antisemitism. The dress maker, the flower folks, food, drink....everything is over-priced due to "that's what the market will bear".

Someone somewhere is going to have to start saying, "ok...thanks for your quote...perhaps we can do business at my next wedding.....b-bye"

You nailed it John. When will we wake up and just say NO. Does spending a few hundred dollars or $50,000 change the way two people feel for each other.

I hope not.

Karl

[John Schreiber]

A wedding is a wonderful and important event in the life of a family and it deserves to be celebrated. Alcohol is not necessary for people to have fun. Congratulations and have a great party.

[Bob Huddleston]

The purpose is the wedding. Hell, give the money that would have been used to the newlyweds as a way to maybe help pay a down payment on a house! Better that than to some big mouthed booze pusher.

[Al Willits]

"""""
If all special requests get a 400% markup, then it's SOP but if he hears the word kosher and adds 400% thne what is it ?............... The Web site for the domes says you can choose your own caterer.
""""""

I'd say it means dollar signs for him, they want something "special", they could have said they wanted a 1920's format and probably got the same added charge.
Key word is special/kosher/different, I think.

Al...ok...that's three words, sorry....:)

Oh...you really think he's dumb enough to come across as anti anything?
Seems pretty unlikely considering everybodies money is green...

[Doug Shepard]

My sister had a dry wedding - pretty much just because of the cost. The reception hall was right next door to a pizza restaurant and bar though, so those of us that felt like grabbing a drink or two just slipped away for a few minutes. I even ran into the groom once over there.

[Robert Mickley]

We did our wedding on the cheap, Wife and her mother made the wedding dress, She only had her Maid of honor and she made her dress to. My nephew who was my best man and I spurged for a new suits

Theres beutiful church downtown that specializes in weddings. I don't remember what that cost. Reception was at the VFW where her uncle is a member. Food, Wife made our cake. My brother roasted a pig and brought it. Several other family members brought side dishes. I bought a Keg. Wife picked up some wine. Nephew video taped it and a friend who is a hobby photograher but pretty good took the picturesIn the end we spent $1200 that was 19 years ago on the 12th

[Jim Becker]

Hmmm...our whole wedding came in at less than that joker wants to charge you for just the Kosher wine and "service". (Low key, small, outdoors in Key West with dinner at Mangos afterward) Fire him/her and ask the caterer directly if his/her staff could serve the wine of your choice (you provide) as part of the deal for for a reasonable "uplift" per person.

As to dry? Not a problem in my mind if it would make things easier. We only have very limited drink service for ours and it was just fine. Remember, it's about your journey, not about keeping a bunch of people sharing a couple hours with you slap-happy!

[Jason Roehl]

I don't know what WI's alcohol licensing laws are, but those prices may not be out of line. Years ago, I did a little bartending at a country club (I knew the beverage manager), and I thought one of the perks might be me getting some good booze at a low price. It turned out that those who serve for a profit pay MORE than you would off the shelf. In other words, I might have to pay $17 for a bottle of Jack Daniels from the store. A bar would have to buy it from a certain "wholesaler", and might have to pay $25 for the same bottle. AT $4/shot, 15 shots/bottle, that's $60, which is a very small profit margin in the food service industry (SWMBO has lambskin in that dept.). The same beverage manager mentioned above is now running his own catering business with a lease on a dance hall/restaurant to boot. He makes the vast majority of his profit from a wedding when the bar bill is paid.

For the record, our wedding was dry 11.5 years ago, and plenty of fun.

[Jim King]

I think you are worried about the wrong thing, the real expense starts after the wedding is paid for.

[Jerry Olexa]

Very bad judgement and greed shown here by that man. Very selfish on his part...My daughter recently attended a "dry" wedding (for religious reasons) in an adjoining state and said it was very nice. That guys behavior is way out of line...Sorry to hear this re what should be a happy, memorable occassion..