Basic Laser Information

[Keith Outten]

The idea of using a Laser in a woodworking shop isn't really that new. In the last few years less costly machines became available that are priced within reach of even the most modest of woodworkng shops. Lasers are the ultimate woodworking tool in my opinion and in time they will be available and widely used by almost all woodworkers.

Immediately woodworkers will embrace the capability to vector cut wood and plastics at a precision level approaching their local machine shop. Computer Numerical Controlled (CNC) equipment has been in the metalworking field for decades, a laser will bring a simular capability to woodworkers. Computer controlled routers are already widespread thoughout the industry and have recently been marketed to serious amateurs in home workshops. A combination of the two machines brings incredible opportunities to any shop or group that can obtain this new technology.

For starters! Ask Ken Salisbury how he identifies his work these days. Ken found a local laser engraver who would make custom wooden disks that were engraved with his company logo and information. These disks Ken inlays into his projects and they provide a professional mark to distinguish his work and his company from his competitors.

Ken doesn't own an engraver and he may never need to purchase a machine for his shop. The idea here is that this is a service that he found in his local area that he could use to his advantage. Even hobbyists should consider this type of arrangement, sharing a machine within a group or outsourcing the work to a local shop.

I hope to be able to share with everyone the basic information you will need to connect with an engraver in your area. Over time I will describe the software I use and how you may be able to learn to create your own drawings that are ready for engraving. This will save you over 50% of any fees you would normally be charged by a local service. If you have your own wood and can do your own design you would then pay only for the engraving time. This would make Laser engraving very affordable even for the home shop.

More Later!

[Ron Jones near Indy]

interests me. I will follow this forum closely. :D

[Joe Tonich]

what would be the price range for a set-up to make some extra $ to help defray the cost of wood and tooling related to the hobby? SWMBO thinks this hobby is pretty expensive as you usually need more tools for every diff. project you do! Would it be worth looking into in your opinion?

Joe

[Keith Outten]

Laser Engravers start in the 15 to 20 thousand dollar range. They are expensive but if you break it down it is just 25 bucks a day if you finance the machine. If you engrave just one plaque per day anything else is profit but don't even think about it until you have learned to use the machine. I'll give you some tips over time that will help you learn how it works, then you can try to develope a few projects for the machine. If after you have successfully produced a few things on someone else's machine you want to buy a laser go for it!

For most woodworkers the best deal is to find someone in your local area that owns a laser and buy engraving time. If you are willing to learn a few tricks you can learn while doing and if you are interested in your own machine you will be income positive from the day you purchase your machine. I made the classic mistake of buying a machine first, I had to learn to use the machine, develope products and market all at the same time.

The price will scare most people to death but you can learn for free and test the waters while having fun or just add some very nice engravings to your own projects.

The people who turn bowls should be listening, bowls would be a very nice project for engraving. Cabinet doors slso benefit from engraving and then there is glass and marble and leather and plastic and cloth and mat board and mirrors...you get the picture.

[Ken Salisbury]

I also have a lot of Craft Products laser engraved. Really adds to the sales:
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<IMG src="http://www.klsal.com/engrave2.jpg">
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<IMG src="http://www.klsal.com/engrave5.jpg">
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<IMG src="http://www.klsal.com/engrave4.jpg">
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<IMG src="http://www.klsal.com/engrave6.jpg">

Wooden Logo Medallions to mark my work
<p align="center">
<IMG src="http://www.klsal.com/logosale.jpg">

[Charles McKinley]

Hello,

Thank you for this forum. This is a topic I have had interest in for some time. What are the limits of the laser in cutting material? Are there andy laser user in Western PA or Eastern OH?

THanks

CHuck

[Howard Rosenberg]

I've been very interested in Laser Engraving for a while now. Like almost every woodworker, I dream of turning my hobby into a cottage industry-level business. I never see ads in the magazines for this type of equipment. If I wanted to do a search what would the best search words be in a search engine? Thank you, Keith. Howard

[Joe Tonich]

By saying it was somewhat within reach I was figuring a few grand. Gonna keep watch for your tips and look for a local shop w/engraving. Don't have the gonads to even MENTION a 15-20 grand piece of equipment to SWMBO! :eek: Maybe renting shop time and learning how would be feasable though.

Thanks again,

Joe

[Keith Outten]

A Laser is a big ticket iten no doubt but there are other woodworking machines that are also in the high end price range. What is uique about lasers is that they open doors for your workshop that other more traditional machines may not.

For now lets concentrate on how you can use a laser without buying it, the nice features you can add to the projects you are building in your workshop right now. Almost any woodworkng project can be engraved but remember that the machining capabilities are a major part of what a laser can provide.

If you were interested in building a project that had a huge number of repetitive cuts or a number of very delicate parts or dimentions that required very precise machining you now have an option to use a laser. Another tool to allow you to build some projects that you might not have done in the past.

Most woodworkers don't dry their own lumber or own a sawmill, these are services that you essentially outsource to someone else. This is the best way to think of using a laser, just another machining service that you can purchase.

My point is that you don't have to buy a laser! Everyone owns a computer these days and with a little effort you can add new features to your projects or gifts for your family that will make a significant difference in the final appearence of your finished work. If you are interested in woodworking full time as a business then purchasing a laser for your shop might be a way to obtain jobs your competitors can't provide.

I could cut to the chase and we could start discussing how you can make money right now but that isn't what I have in mind for this forum. There are ways that you can take a very simple wooden object that you can't sell at a craft show, add some very nice engraved graphic and sell them all day long for a nice profit. When you start personalizing gifts the value increases quiclkly.

In the next thread we will discuss the software you will need and a why.

[Fred Reitberger]

I searched and found out about Epilog. What are the others and who is the industry leader?
Thanks!

[Keith Outten]

Fred,

I believe that Universal and Newing-Hall are also major players in the Laser business.

[Ken Salisbury]

Yes Universal is a player - They have desk top units starting at $10K
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Universal Laser Systems (http://www.versalaser.com)

[Howard Rosenberg]

look like computer printers. What are the maximums in length, width & thickness of objects you can put into a machine like this? Are there any other manufacturing companies of lasers worth looking at? Thank you. Howard

[Fred Reitberger]

I looked at Newing-Hall and found nothing on their web site that even looked like a laser system. (The Universal web site looks cheap and thin on content. No information on wattage, speed, size, etc. ) Update this line. The desktop line is the thin on info web pages. I found the main site that was excellant in content and info. Epilog looks serious and committed. Any others out there?

[Bob Oswin]

Hurry Ken:

You have really piqued my interest.
You should see how I amke steel rule dies!
This is a quantum leap forward in wood technology for me!

Yipppeeee!

Bob

[Keith Outten]

Here is another idea for you to reveiw and it is just another option for using a laser. Wood is a great material for engraving and the possibilities are extensive but the list of materials available are almost endless.

This is simple line art engraved on AlumaMark material. AlumaMark is an aluminum material available in .005" and .020" thickness with a special coating that reacts to the laser when engraved and can accept shading. AlumaMark is available in gold and silver.

[jack duren]

im not familiar with lasers. so ill just ask a general question.

im building a bar and the top center piece will extend past the other two sections left and right. a bump out,possibly held up by columns and capitals. not sure yet as i create as i go.

ive consiidered etched glass with lights in side on the very top section . it is a square section with an arched bottom. how difficult to put letters and outlines on a certain size piece?....jacl

[Howard Rosenberg]

Have you considered what retail stores do when they move in?

They get a sign company (one with the computers & films etc) create the image in a frosted-looking film and adhere it to the glass. Looks just like frosted glass at a fraction of the price and allows the landlord to peel it off in case the owner moves etc.

Hope this helps. Howard

[jack duren]

ill be doing the etching myself. just havent got to that part yet. hoping to practice on some samples before i actually do the real pieces. doing a laser design in wood is actually what i meant.

curious if anybody has a laser system in the kansas city area?....rebel

[Keith Outten]

Jack,

If you can't find a local engraver get back to me, I can engrave your wooden material and ship it to you via UPS. You can sandblast wood yourself, the effect isn't at all like laser engraving but it can be a very nice technique if you do it right.

When glass is the meduim there are a couple options to consider.

- There are acids that you can purchase and etch glass using a template mask.

- You can sandblast glass, again using a mask and preferably a very fine grit...I use glass beads in my cabinet. When a job is too large for my lasers engraving cabinet I use the engraver to vector cut a rubber mask. The mask then is used to sandblast the large areas of the glass. This same technique works for making template masks for painting.

Tip---
Lasers can cut gaskets from a variety of meterials, engrave and cut cloth and be used to make engineering models from wood and plastic.

[Aaron Koehl]

Also, using the laser an adhesive mask of your logo can be cut
out. Once you apply the mask, you can
purchase an aerosol "frost" used for faux-frosting glass--
looks very real, even up close. (And no, not the stuff you
use to put frost on the windows at Christmas time-- that stuff
is designed to look like actual frozen frost; this stuff is much
smoother.)

The frost will come off using soap and water, and will
allow:

1. Much larger areas to be frosted, and
2. Removal of the frost in case you decide to move, and
3. Lower cost than actually frosting or sandblasting, and
4. Self application by the consumer, rather than a professional.

_Aaron_

[jack duren]

where would i purchase such a frost. sounds very interesting. i could easily cut out the design......jack

[Aaron Koehl]

You should be able to get the aerosol frost pretty
much anywhere they have spray paint-- you should
be able to find it at WalMart.

_Aaron_