46-715r

[Chuck Hanger]

Wanting to get into turning. Haven't done any since high school (44 years ago). Can you fellas give me the pros and cons about the above listed Delta lathe?
Thanks, Chuck
On sale now for $299

[Andy Hoyt]

Hey Chuck. Welcome back to turning. Just looked at that machine (http://www.deltamachinery.com/index.asp?e=136&p=984) on the Delta site and it's probably just fine as a centerwork lathe. But for facework that 600 RPM low speed remains a killer - at least for me it does.

[Bob Noles]

Chuck,

That machine has been know for adverse issues for a long time. Even the factory referbs (that is what the (r) stands for) are still not up to par. I went to a Redmond/Rockler gran opening not long ago and a friend of mine picked one up while we were there. He has had a lot of issues with it since, but knew that going in. It was just something to get him by for the time being until he decides on a different lathe for long term.

I would keep looking and possibly even a Jet mini would work as well for your needs.

[Gary DeWitt]

Seems underpowered for it's size. That's a great price, though.
I've had a Delta Midi for some time, it's ok as a starter but I had to make new lock down handles (they were plastic and broke). Tailstock slips. Spindle squeaks unless I wd-40 it daily. Just not the fit and finish I would expect for $299.

[Frank Fusco]

For $350.00, plus shipping, you can get a good Grizzly.
http://www.grizzly.com/products/G0584

[Bob Opsitos]

I've had a 46-715 for over a year now, bought new. Has worked good on everything I've turned. Bowls, end grain and face grain HF's, platters, winged bowl or two, and about a dozen pens. I've done very little spindle work other than the pens and a tool handle.

I've been told that I happen to have one of the "good" ones, so I consider myself lucky in that regard.

Eventually I will upgrade to something with more swing and EVS. The low speed isn't low enough for a few things (parting HF's off the lathe comes to mind), but more than manageable. Never really needed more power.

If you were to get a "good" "r" it'll make you happy.

Bob

[Bill Boehme]

........But for facework that 600 RPM low speed remains a killer - at least for me it does.
I think that the 600 RPM number is a bit off -- I have measured the actual speeds of my lathe using a stroboscope and the lowest speed was 480 RPM. It could stand to be a bit lower, but it has turned anything that I wanted to turn over the past three years. It has the potential for being a very good machine, but Delta went too cheap on some of the parts, primarily the pulleys which are made of die cast zinc -- OK for fixed pulleys on this size machine, but not rugged enough for duty as a Reeves pulley. The other issue is the excessive free play in the yoke arrangement that drives the movable half of the spindle pulley. This allows the spindle pulley to feed back vibrations in the motor pulley, which leads to wear on the pulley bore and keyway.

I have spent at least several hundred hours rebuilding and trying to upgrade my lathe with some success, but the one weak link in the drive system that I have not been completely able to address is the wear in the Reeves pulleys. On the yoke assembly, I got the assistance of another member of my club to turn a new follower rod with a tighter fit to the bore in the headstock. I wanted to install bronze bushings in the headstock bore for the follower rod, but was talked out of that idea because of the difficulty of reaming the bore in perfect alignment with the spindle. The new follower gave a tight fit to the yoke and that one change was a major improvement in the overall performance of the lathe.

The next issue to attack was the motor pulley. It needed two things -- dampen the vibration and tighten up the fit of the sliding half of the pulley to the keystock.

The second part was easy -- I just got some oversized keystock from Grainger (about .002 mm oversized), cut it to size, pressed it into the motor shaft keyway along with some Loctite to keep it there and I was in business. This gave me a very tight fit -- almost too tight, but it quickly wore in to give a good fit.

It was a long time, trying different types of greases (most with molybdenum) that I finally came across a very good grease to use on the motor shaft. It is a very heavy synthetic silicone based grease (no moly) that did not change its properties over time. Had I been using that grease from the beginning, the wear on the pulley bore and keyway probably would have been much less that what I have. One of the problems with the grease was that wood dust and shavings were mixing with it and some of it was slinging off the motor shaft. I fixed that problem by fabricating a boot and cinching it at each end with a nylon ty-wrap. This also gave me a bonus by acting as a viscous damper on the spring to minimize vibrations.

I believe the real culprit in the pulley vibrations is the motor pulley. I have tried at least four motor pulleys and they all are warped to some degree and even when the warping is minimal, they tend to deform a bit under heavy turning due to the softness of the die cast zinc, I suspect. I have actually turned the headstock around and remove the belt guard and belt and then used turning tools to true up the pulley. Zinc turns nicely, but you can't go at it as if it were wood or you will get a pulley destroying catch. This has met with some success, but, of course, turning a soft metal thinner is going to make it more prone to deform. What this machine really needs are cast iron Reeves pulleys. If it had more rugged pulleys, it would be a wonderful machine. Anyway, my changes have helped my lathe considerably, but I have concluded that I have done just about all that can be done without locating a CI Reeves pulley for the motor shaft. I believe that with my yoke fix that the zinc pulley on the spindle is probably rugged enough.

I feel like the basic machine is well built -- I like the bed, headstock (except for the drive), tailstock, etc. It is fairly easy to work on -- I have removed the spindle and replaced the bearings. I have also modified the motor so that its rotation can be reversed. It was a fairly easy mod since all of the necessary wires inside the motor were readily accessible.

Now my next move is to replace the drive system. I managed to get a 1.5 HP Baldor Vector Duty motor (http://www.baldor.com/products/detail.asp?1=1&page=1&catalogonly=1&catalog=ZDM3584T&product=AC+Motors&family=Vector%7Cvw%5FACMotors%5FVector&winding=05WGW053&rating=40C+AMB%2DCONT) on eBay for around $100 and three Baldor vector drive controllers (http://www.baldor.com/products/detail.asp?1=1&page=3&catalogonly=1&catalog=ZD18H202-E&product=AC+Controls&family=Vector%7Cvw%5FACControls%5FVector) for around $200 each. Now I am in the process of designing the mounting fixture and belt drive (two speed ranges) system. My project will need to go on hold for a while because I am scheduled for back surgery in 9 days and it will be a while before I can waltz around with the 60 pound motor. It won't be a Powermatic 3520, but it won't cost as much either. My friends say that my woodturning is just a front for rebuilding machines. They will never get a confession out of me -- I am sticking with my story that I am a real woodturner.


Bill

[Chuck Hanger]

I think that the issues that Bill has had with his that I have to lean toward Frank's suggestion on the Griz.
Andy I will have to admit that last summer I bought a old rust ball of a Sears. Bought it for my 80 year old father in law (actually looks and acts younger than me). He had sold his when they moved to a smaller home 6 years ago. Cleaned it all up (many hours), built a table for it and purchased some of those thingys you poke at the wood. Got it all done and thought I should try it out before delivery. Worked great. Cut me a square of 2X6, mitered the corners and turned me a little bowl. Use it to hold screws and such. Am I a veteran turner now?:confused:
Thanks again all,
Chuck

[Dick Strauss]

Chuck,
I also own the 46-715 and have been very happy with it given the price (about $400 new) versus the Delta/Jet mini alternative in the $250-$325 range.

I had a problem with vibration in the drive system. I took off the cover and massaged the reeves drive back and forth a few times and haven't had the problem since.

I also built a sandbox to hold 300# of sand to lower the center of gravity and dampen vibrations from off-balance blanks. My lathe now weighs close to 700#.

I will send box measurements to any interested parties.

One of the really weak links in this lathe is the stand. The legs flex with off-balance blanks so much so that the lathe will walk across the room. I've already cut and drilled a new 2x4" stand to provide additional stiffness to the stand. It will be bolted (with an adhesive?) to the outside of the stand when I assemble it. I've also raised the lathe about 3-4" so that it is at a comfortable height for turning. Since I had to raise it, I increased the span of the legs (width-wise) to help with lateral stability.

The other weak link is that the motor speed on the Delta isn't slow enough (about 450rpm) for easy roughing on really off-balance large blanks (in excess of a 10" diameter). The 3/4hp Delta motor is definitely very strong for its modest rating (IMO). The reeves drive doesn't allow for a slow enough "roughing out" speed. Just so that you know...low speeds are also a problem with the Jet1236/1442 and all of the Grizzly machines. The Jet miniVS is so underpowered that you can easily stall it with a 5" blank.

While the Delta 46-715 is definitely not a PM3520A, I'd buy the Delta again. I think this machine still offers the best combination of flexibility/power/quality/price IMHO.


Bill,
I'm planning a 1.5-2hp EVS 3-phase motor/controller upgrade as well. I want a slower speed and reverse all in one. From your comments it sounds like the Reeves drive probably won't take an increase in HP.

Best of luck with your decision,
Dick

[Bill Boehme]

......One of the really weak links in this lathe is the stand. The legs flex with off-balance blanks so much so that the lathe will walk across the room. I've already cut and drilled a new 2x4" stand to provide additional stiffness to the stand. It will be bolted (with an adhesive?) to the outside of the stand when I assemble it. I've also raised the lathe about 3-4" so that it is at a comfortable height for turning. Since I had to raise it, I increased the span of the legs (width-wise) to help with lateral stability......

.....While the Delta 46-715 is definitely not a PM3520A, I'd buy the Delta again. I think this machine still offers the best combination of flexibility/power/quality/price IMHO......


Bill,
I'm planning a 1.5-2hp EVS 3-phase motor/controller upgrade as well. I want a slower speed and reverse all in one. From your comments it sounds like the Reeves drive probably won't take an increase in HP.

Best of luck with your decision,
Dick

Dick,

Thanks for your comments and I am in agreement with what you say. I might also mention that one of the dilemas for a new turner buying a lathe is that they see the specs of a PM3520 type machine and then look for a lower cost machine while still dreaming of the performance of the much more expensive lathe. It ain't gonna' happen -- all of the machines are competitively priced so you generally get what you pay for.

I might mention something about the stand that could have been your problem. The first thing that I noticed when assembling the stand is that I could not get it sturdy enough and then I figured out that the problem was the bolts being used and NOT the steel legs. The supplied bolts have square shoulders under the heads that is longer than two thicknesses of the steel leg material and the supplied washers have a hole that is too small to pass over the shoulder of the bolt. I called Delta about this but could not get it through their thick heads. Their older machines used thicker steel for the legs so it was not a problem back then. My solution was very simple -- I went to the local hardware store and bought some US size washers that fit perfectly over the shoulders of the bolts and were thick enough to allow the legs to be tightened down securely. Withis simple fix, I find that the supplied legs on my lathe are VERY sturdy and don't allow any movement.

I will keep you posted on the development of my lathe mods. If you have Delta Cad, I can supply engineering drawings showing top assembly and part details. I will be using micro-v (aka poly-v) pulleys -- 10 groove and a 30 inch, 10 rib J-section belt. I plan to use two overlapping speed ranges -- 0 to 1800 RPM and 1500 to 3200 RPM. The main reason for the two speed ranges is due to the ratio of load product of inertia to rotor product of inertia with an assumed maximum sized blank at the start of turning.

I think that the MTBF of the Reeves drive is too low to keep it as a part of the new drive system.

Bill

[Dick Strauss]

Bill,
My problem with the legs is really the thin sheet metal used. The joints don't flex but the legs do. It would be a really nice lathe if they had used cast iron legs like the Jet. I would have even paid to upgrade to cast iron if available.

I'm going to try to find a motor that uses the same mounting plate and shaft diameter if possible. That way I can use the reeves drive temporarily.

Can you PM me with the directions for changing the motor wiring so that mine will reverse?

Thanks,
Dick